Neutral earth link

[jddevel]

I need to buy a flying lead to connect my Honda EUi 20 (LPG conversion) to my input socket located on the stern of the boat. I`ve two questions.

1) I`m advised that I need to link the earth and neutral together and as this will run through the trip on the consumer board I`ve no need to put a separate earth from the generator. However what is the best way of installing that link and the size of cable please.

2) In an ideal world the generator and gas bottle will be located in the bow where the gas locker is to avoid having to move them whilst in use. So would a long flying lead suffice or try and install a additional input point in the bow to supplement the one in the stern used for connection to the landline when available. This obviously would entail considerably more work but look neater. Being 240 volt I assume voltage drop is not as important

[Alan de Enfield]

26 minutes ago, jddevel said:

In an ideal world the generator and gas bottle will be located in the bow where the gas locker is to avoid having to move them whilst in use.

That is not ideal.

You should really be considering moving the generator completely off the boat and onto the bank when it is running.

You can use a standard mains hook-up lead, and use a long gas pipe with a bayonet connect/disconnect to the cylinder.

The RYA and BSS are currently having a big 'push' on CO safety and there is a new leaflet being produced giving advice on potential problems on boats.

https://www.boatsafetyscheme.org/media/293205/carbon-monoxide-safety-on-boats-final-dec2016.pdf

Note : Even a qualified gas fitter has been charged with manslaughter.

 

[smileypete]

4 hours ago, jddevel said:

I need to buy a flying lead to connect my Honda EUi 20 (LPG conversion) to my input socket located on the stern of the boat. I`ve two questions.

1) I`m advised that I need to link the earth and neutral together and as this will run through the trip on the consumer board I`ve no need to put a separate earth from the generator. However what is the best way of installing that link and the size of cable please.

1.5mm2 or 2.5mm2 is fine. Well worth indelibly labelling the lead something like 'Earth neutral bonding lead for use with generator xxx only'

Also it wouldn't hurt to use transparent plugs to make it easy to check the bond connection is OK (could even link N to E at both ends for some redundancy):

http://cpc.farnell.com/walther/31036cl/3p-240v-bs4343-clear-coupler-blue/dp/CN06703

http://cpc.farnell.com/pro-elec/pe01010/mains-plug-transparent-13a-fuse/dp/PL00474

One of those cheap socket testers with 3 lights will help check whether the earth is connected or whether it's unconnected aka 'floating'. Typically an inverter gennie without an NE bond will show 'earth missing' on these testers. They're not 100.00% foolproof but a lot better than nothing.

Don't forget the test button on the RCD only checks the integrity of the RCD itself, not whether an NE bond is present or not.

[Detling]

You could make up a short lead with a cable plug and a cable socket to put between the long lead from the boat inlet and the generator output, this would keep the long lead available for hook up if required. 

If having a permanent connection installed remember you also have to have a means of ensuring that only one connector is connected to the boats 240V system and the other is isolated,  because otherwise you will have live pins exposed in the unused connector.

[WotEver]

1 hour ago, smileypete said:

Don't forget the test button on the RCD only checks the integrity of the RCD itself, not whether an NE bond is present or not.

Although the socket testers you mentioned often come with an RCD Test button and these WILL prove the NE bond. They won’t work on centre-tapped supplies though as previously noted on other threads. 

[jddevel]

15 hours ago, smileypete said:

Also it wouldn't hurt to use transparent plugs to make it easy to check the bond connection is OK (could even link N to E at both ends for some redundancy):

Excellent suggestion thank you.

 

14 hours ago, Detling said:

You could make up a short lead with a cable plug and a cable socket to put between the long lead from the boat inlet and the generator output, this would keep the long lead available for hook up if required. 

If having a permanent connection installed remember you also have to have a means of ensuring that only one connector is connected to the boats 240V system and the other is isolated,  because otherwise you will have live pins exposed in the unused connector.

More good advice thank you.

[jddevel]

20 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

That is not ideal.

You should really be considering moving the generator completely off the boat and onto the bank when it is running.

What concerns me about that is that having to move  the generator and a long gas pipe that the gas pipe could well prove a issue with regards to potential damage. I will have to think on that one.

[jddevel]

15 hours ago, smileypete said:

1.5mm2 or 2.5mm2 is fine. Well worth indelibly labelling the lead something like 'Earth neutral bonding lead for use with generator xxx only'

So I literally wire a link between neutral and earth? In domestic earth wiring good practice is to just remove the sheathing from the cable between earthing points so the cable remains unbroken. If possible could I therefore connect the earth via the neutral if physical possible?

[Flyboy]

I believe your generator has two 13 amp output sockets. If so, you could make the NE bond by using a 13 amp plug in one of the sockets with the N & E pins connected together. In this way you can just remove the plug if you need the use the generator without an NE bond. Mark the plug so that it is not to be used in any other socket.

[forsberg]

On ‎2018‎-‎01‎-‎08 at 14:07, jddevel said:

2) So would a long flying lead suffice or try and install a additional input point in the bow to supplement the one in the stern used for connection to the landline when available. This obviously would entail considerably more work but look neater. Being 240 volt I assume voltage drop is not as important

An additional input point bumps other security issues so you would have to install a crossover switch. Voltage drop is still important so no harm in going for 2.5mm2 and that would also make it a much better earth connector. If going for Flyboy's neat solution, a socket tester permanently plugged in a socket in the boat will indicate functionality.

Will you be the only one using this contraption so all twist's and turn's will be done as intended?

[jddevel]

On 1/9/2018 at 15:06, forsberg said:

Will you be the only one using this contraption so all twist's and turn's will be done as intended?

Yes indeed. Some sensible,sound advice once again from all. Thank you