Paying to use the canal?

[Jenwil]

Does anyone else pay to use the canals at the same rate as a boater does?

[MtB]

2 minutes ago, Jenwil said:

Does anyone else pay to use the canals at the same rate as a boater does?

 

Why do you ask? 

I'm sure you already know the answer. No!

[artleknock]

The way I read it is that Canal users pay, towpath is free to use, but is paid for with council tax etc;

[MtB]

1 minute ago, artleknock said:

but is paid for with council tax etc

 

I think not. Or do you know this for a fact? Got a reference please?

(Other than for the Basingstoke Canal, which IS funded by Surrey and Hants councils IIIRC.)

[artleknock]

1 minute ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

I think not. Or do you know this for a fact? Got a reference please?

References, what are they? I am only guessing, my council tax has to be going somewhere it's certainly not going where I can see it.

[Jenwil]

3 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Why do you ask? 

I'm sure you already know the answer. No!

I have no idea Mike just observing the comings and goings and wondering

[LadyG]

3 minutes ago, artleknock said:

I am only guessing, my council tax has to be going somewhere it's certainly not going where I can see it.

I have to pay Council Tax, and I don't even have a canal. There are leaflets sent out explaining costs, though non about cutting them!

Edited January 3, 2018 by LadyG

[artleknock]

Sometimes I think I don't even have a council.

[Captain Pegg]

27 minutes ago, Jenwil said:

Does anyone else pay to use the canals at the same rate as a boater does?

It's worth remembering that income from licences and moorings accounts for less than one quarter of CRTs overall income and that it contributes less than than the direct grant from DEFRA. It's quite possible that without millions of taxpayers who never make any use of the canal, boaters wouldn't even have the ability to pay to use the canals at all.

JP

[Boat&Bikes]

6 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

It's worth remembering that income from licences and moorings accounts for less than one quarter of CRTs overall income and that it contributes less than than the direct grant from DEFRA. It's quite possible that without millions of taxpayers who never make any use of the canal, boaters wouldn't even have the ability to pay to use the canals at all.

JP

Thats how it works isn't it? Taxpayers monies are combined to benefit all.

Ian.

[Arthur Marshall]

It's a bit hard even to define how much a boater pays, seeing as how we all pay a different amount depending on length of boat and where we tie the thing up.

Now, if you were to ask if anyone else gets more satisfaction out of it than a boater does... I remember waking up at dawn all those years ago on the morning of the new millenium, looking out of the window at the mist rolling off the hills as the sun came up - and not even giving a thought to how much my licence cost.

Edited January 3, 2018 by Arthur Marshall

[Captain Pegg]

2 minutes ago, ianali said:

Thats how it works isn't it? Taxpayers monies are combined to benefit all.

Ian.

Yes that's how it works. Thankfully.

If we had a referendum asking taxpayers if they should continue to contribute £50m every year toward CRT or stick an average of an extra £1,700 on the licence of each of the 30,000 registered boats we might not like the answer.

We don't do badly out of the taxpayer.

JP

[Alan de Enfield]

12 minutes ago, ianali said:

Thats how it works isn't it? Taxpayers monies are combined to benefit all.

Ian.

Yup - that's about how it works.

We pay our taxes to cover the Police, the Library service, education, street lighting, footpaths etc etc.

We live 2.5 miles outside the village with nearest neighbour about 1 mile away, down a mile long single track lane, we have no footpaths & no street lighting until we get into the village, we have no children of school age, the local library has closed and we have not seen a 'real' Policeman for years - we do get the 'noddy-cops' in the Village but they don't leave the lit areas, phone 999 to report some Hare-Coursing and someone at the Glasgow phone centre has no idea where the 3rd gate after the railway bridge is and by the time the police do arrive (if they do decide to come) the 'baddies' left 12 hours previously and are now safely home in Sheffield.

 

So, fairs-fair, I think I am entitled to a bit of canal funded by someone who doesn't have a boat.

Edited January 3, 2018 by Alan de Enfield

[Leo No2]

49 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

(Other than for the Basingstoke Canal, which IS funded by Surrey and Hants councils IIIRC.)

Basingstoke also funded by the riparian Borough Councils some of whom pay happily (and on time) e.g. Woking and others who are bit slower and perhaps don't pay their calculated share (can't remember how the amount is arrived at but think it may be based on the number of rate payers). One of the issues is that Surrey, for example, take all the rental from the 'houseboats' at Woodham which, to the best of my knowledge, never comes back into the canal but is just added Surrey's coffers. Don't know what it is like now but Hampshire used to be a dream to deal with - always helpful and positive.

[Boat&Bikes]

9 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Yup - that's about how it works.

We pay our taxes to cover the Police, the Library service, education, street lighting, footpaths etc etc.

We live 2.5 miles outside the village with nearest neighbour about 1 mile away, down a mile long single track lane, we have no footpaths & no street lighting until we get into the village, we have no children of school age, the local library has closed and we have not seen a 'real' Policeman for years - we do get the 'noddy-cops' in the Village but they don't leave the lit areas, phone 999 to report some Hare-Coursing and someone at the Glasgow phone centre has no idea where the 3rd gate after the railway bridge is and by the time the police do arrive (if they do decide to come) the 'baddies' left 12 hours previously and are now safely home in Sheffield.

 

So, fairs-fair, I think I am entitled to a bit of canal funded by someone who doesn't have a boat.

Yes I agree. Wife and i pay more than we probably should but that's life huh.

Ian.

[mrsmelly]

1 hour ago, LadyG said:

I have to pay Council Tax, and I don't even have a canal. There are leaflets sent out explaining costs, though non about cutting them!

Blimey " Council tax " whats that then? I hope it doesn't catch on I don't want to pay even more tax.

[Higgs]

1 hour ago, Jenwil said:

Does anyone else pay to use the canals at the same rate as a boater does?

 

Yes. People that never venture onto the canal, living in the space of private property, pay for the canal.

An arrangement between CRT and the owners of private marinas. CRT have no right of enforcement and the marinas have not statutory right of enforcement, inside private marinas. The only enforcement is derived from the terms and conditions of the particular private marina. And their only right of enforcement would be to kick you out of the marina, onto CRT's waterway - the canal.   

Edited January 3, 2018 by Higgs

[LadyG]

53 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

Yes. People that never venture onto the canal, living in the space of private property, pay for the canal.

An arrangement between CRT and the owners of private marinas. CRT have no right of enforcement and the marinas have not statutory right of enforcement, inside private marinas. The only enforcement is derived from the terms and conditions of the particular private marina. And their only right of enforcement would be to kick you out of the marina, onto CRT's waterway - the canal.   

not sure, what is your beef?

 

no one is forced to buy a boat, or to put it in a marina, whether public{?} or private.

or you could just park it in your driveway at home....

I have seen a narrowboat in a field, could that be your boat?

 

Edited January 3, 2018 by LadyG

[Wanderer Vagabond]

53 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

Yes. People that never venture onto the canal, living in the space of private property, pay for the canal.

An arrangement between CRT and the owners of private marinas. CRT have no right of enforcement and the marinas have not statutory right of enforcement, inside private marinas. The only enforcement is derived from the terms and conditions of the particular private marina. And their only right of enforcement would be to kick you out of the marina, onto CRT's waterway - the canal.   

Taking the wording of the original question, can I assume that you are not a boater then? (going by the dictionary definition of a boater to be;- a person who uses or travels in a boat for pleasure).

[Detling]

1 hour ago, Higgs said:

 

Yes. People that never venture onto the canal, living in the space of private property, pay for the canal.

An arrangement between CRT and the owners of private marinas. CRT have no right of enforcement and the marinas have not statutory right of enforcement, inside private marinas. The only enforcement is derived from the terms and conditions of the particular private marina. And their only right of enforcement would be to kick you out of the marina, onto CRT's waterway - the canal.   

Watch out if the council know you are resident 52 weeks a year they will want council tax, some people have to go out for a few weeks a year to break the genie.

[MtB]

32 minutes ago, LadyG said:

not sure, what is your beef?

 

no one is forced to buy a boat, or to put it in a marina, whether public{?} or private.

or you could just park it in your driveway at home....

I have seen a narrowboat in a field, could that be your boat?

 

 

If you thought I had a hobby horse with my dodgy Smartgauges, or Nick Norman with his complaints about modding, these are as NOTHING compared to Higgs' ranting and ravings over his imagined iniquities of the NAA!

[Higgs]

40 minutes ago, LadyG said:

not sure, what is your beef?

 

no one is forced to buy a boat, or to put it in a marina, whether public{?} or private.

or you could just park it in your driveway at home....

I have seen a narrowboat in a field, could that be your boat?

 

 

It's on private property. I have to have a boat licence.

7 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

If you thought I had a hobby horse with my dodgy Smartgauges, or Nick Norman with his complaints about modding, these are as NOTHING compared to Higgs' ranting and ravings over his imagined iniquities of the NAA!

 

Who's ranting?

23 minutes ago, Detling said:

Watch out if the council know you are resident 52 weeks a year they will want council tax, some people have to go out for a few weeks a year to break the genie.

 

I am legally resident.

36 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

Taking the wording of the original question, can I assume that you are not a boater then? (going by the dictionary definition of a boater to be;- a person who uses or travels in a boat for pleasure).

 

I live on a boat, for my pleasure.

[Wanderer Vagabond]

7 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

 

 

I live on a boat, for my pleasure.

So by the dictionary definition you are a boater. The original question was, "Does anyone else pay to use the canals at the same rate as a boater does?" so your original reply is irrelevant to the question.

[Higgs]

14 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

So by the dictionary definition you are a boater. The original question was, "Does anyone else pay to use the canals at the same rate as a boater does?" so your original reply is irrelevant to the question.

 

... and goes on to ask - "to use the canal". What about 'boaters' that don't 'boat', don't use the canal. I pay the same rate as other boaters, I just don't happen to have much to do with the canal, at the moment. Some people don't consider us marina dwellers to be boaters. Sort that one out.

Edited January 3, 2018 by Higgs

[Wanderer Vagabond]

5 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

... and goes on to ask - "to use the canal". What about 'boaters' that don't 'boat', don't use the canal. I pay the same rate as other boaters, I just don't happen to have much to do with the canal, at the moment. Some people don't consider us marina dwellers to be boaters. Sort that one out.

Which actually makes your reply doubly irrelevant since a) you are a boater (a class excluded by the original question) and b ) you don't use the canals.