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Missed opportunity


linnit

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Having pulled my pension early to aquire TYCHO and failed!..  Being a newbie so.to speak to the Historical set..do I  try and get this out of my system and  'p..s ' the money against a wall...or....is there anything out there....not converted it has to be said:glare:

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Be patient, very patient - and try to grow your boat fund rather than shrink it. As you know I have had several near purchases in the past two years, including TYCHO, and something else / better WILL come along.

F.M.C. Ltd, ENGLAND is still on Apollo Duck, and although the price is high this boat is pretty much up-together and comes complete. This boat also has an interesting history, but like all of them it does have a few faults to some purists because of this.

What type of boat are you looking for as you only say 'not converted', are you prepared to do work or are you after something shiny, does it have to be an original motor, does it have to have a 'traditional' engine :captain:

edit = and do you have a realistic budget ?

Edited by pete harrison
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Hi Pete

I have a 'shiny' boat now:)..work is not something I am scared of of..a must is a decent motor..currently have a DM2..I am not looking at 'converted' boats..ie.. Dover etc..thanks for optimism in keeping hold of funds:D

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23 minutes ago, pete harrison said:

= and do you have a realistic budget ?

I would be a fool to openly release my budget...however I am not stupid and do understand the costs of restoration or upkeep of such vessels:)

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15 minutes ago, linnit said:

Hi Pete

I have a 'shiny' boat now:)..work is not something I am scared of of..a must is a decent motor..currently have a DM2..I am not looking at 'converted' boats..ie.. Dover etc..thanks for optimism in keeping hold of funds:D

In the two years I was looking very few unconverted 'historic' motors came up for sale publicly, but several changed hands by being advertised through club membership or word of mouth. In that time I pursued only those boats that were advertised publicly as I am not a member of any clubs - EFFINGHAM (beaten to it), TYCHO (did not agree on value), MOUNTBATTEN (would only sell with JELLICOE) and that was almost it :captain:

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15 minutes ago, linnit said:

I would be a fool to openly release my budget...however I am not stupid and do understand the costs of restoration or upkeep of such vessels:)

I would not expect you to openly release your budget, and I was not suggesting you are stupid.

My view is that there are no unconverted motors that are worth in excess of £45k - £50k, and for that it would have to be exceptional. Consequently the purchase price plus restoration costs should not exceed this figure when added together - at least that is what the head says but the heart can let things run away quickly. I am sure that most owners of 'historic' narrow boats have exceeded the true value of the boat with ongoing restoration work by a considerable margin :captain:

edit - I must be getting old as I can remember when a good motor cost a couple of grand !

Edited by pete harrison
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There is no historical set just a bunch of people who happen to own similar boats. It's not a cartel and prices reflect what people have inputed into the boats. Compared to classic cars they are cheap. Ford escorts at ludicrous prices etc.

most people loose on a sale due to depreciation. I know I will never get back what I have put into my boat, nor did I on any of my other 3 histories. But i look back at selling all with regret due to the memories they gave me.

dont give up be prepared to take a massive leap...

i once bought the most expensive ( historic) boat for sale at that time on the system.  massive leap .. did not regret for a second though I regret selling on through life change. Remember if that's your thing they are unique and purchase is not a logical thing to do. If you want a logical investment follow the herd...

you have to be a bit rash.

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25 minutes ago, roland elsdon said:

There is no historical set just a bunch of people who happen to own similar boats. It's not a cartel and prices reflect what people have inputed into the boats. Compared to classic cars they are cheap. Ford escorts at ludicrous prices etc.

most people loose on a sale due to depreciation. I know I will never get back what I have put into my boat, nor did I on any of my other 3 histories. But i look back at selling all with regret due to the memories they gave me.

dont give up be prepared to take a massive leap...

i once bought the most expensive ( historic) boat for sale at that time on the system.  massive leap .. did not regret for a second though I regret selling on through life change. Remember if that's your thing they are unique and purchase is not a logical thing to do. If you want a logical investment follow the herd...

you have to be a bit rash.

I know all this..I have owned classic cars in the past..I have not given up hope..hence the post.. but I am disappointed all the same..drowning my sorrows:D

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I'm sorry to hear that Linnit has not yet found a suitable boat. But one aspect of this thread puzzles me exceedingly.

We often have people coming on here looking for a boat to buy, and one of the first things that members tell them is "What is your budget? We cannot help unless you tell us how much you can spend". Yet here we have Linnit refusing to tell us his budget, and another (very respected) member agreeing that he should not do so. To me, this doesn't make sense: if we don't know whether he has £20,000 or £100,000 to spend, how could anyone recommend a particular boat?

I must be missing some vital point, but I can't think what it might be.

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Ever so slightly off topic.

i have looked at apolloduck and there are some nice looking tug style narrowboats for sale. I know they are not historic nor have much age to them,and have no interest to the OP and others, just thought I'd say what I just did.

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Is Tycho still being advertised for sale?

If yes, it could be that the seller has decided the OP would not be the right 'future custodian', and nothing to do with money. Sellers of historic boats/cars/whatever are often more concerned about the future of their boat/car/whatever than getting top money for it. 

Odd if the case though. I'd have thought the OP would be an excellent custodian.

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2 hours ago, Athy said:

ITo me, this doesn't make sense: if we don't know whether he has £20,000 or £100,000 to spend, how could anyone recommend a particular boat?

I must be missing some vital point, but I can't think what it might be.

Well it is not hard to know the price that Tycho was advertised for, so I think we can safely conclude he can stretch to a lot more than £20K, or this thread would be fairly pointless.

I tend to agree with Pete that £50K should be to whack for an unconverted motor in top condition, (whatever that means with 80 year old boats), although clearly some advertised prices indicate current owners either feel otherwise or are tempting their luck.

From memory the "asking" on Tycho had fallen a lot from a number that many of us would have thought unrealistic, to one that would seem sensible to base negotiations on.

I'm reading this thread that a deal had been struck at less than that, and then the seller had second thoughts, but perhaps I'm jumping to all the wrong conclusions?

Tycho is actually such a unique boat I find it incredibly hard to value.  Does it's obvious uniqueness make it worth more, or is it so much an acquired taste that it might actually work against it?

I own the nearest equivalent boat, and love it to bits, but I wouln't by choice want to travel everywhere I went with 5 foot f solid steel ice ram to the front!

I also couldn't be certain that if and when we had to put Tycho's twin up for sale that I could actually let er go when it came to the final crunch.  We have ourselves experienced a seller who ultimately just couldn't let his boat go, and I can se how frustrating the whole situation can end up being.  AFAIK that "seller" still has the boat, but seldom or never uses it. (It's converted, so not relevant to the OP, by the way).

 

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6 hours ago, alan_fincher said:

I'm reading this thread that a deal had been struck at less than that, and then the seller had second thoughts, but perhaps I'm jumping to all the wrong conclusions?

I realise I misread a post by linnit, but I am already beyond the point where I can edit my reply above to reflect that, it seems.

I misread a post as "has stopped contract" rather than "has stopped contact", so I now realise, (I think!), that the likely issue is that linnet is not close enough to a number that the seller would be prepared to accept.

Therefore I now tend to agree that without knowing what was offered, it is hard to know if they could buy a better boat at the same or less money.

I  have been surprised by the insurance valuations put on our boats - prices of "historics" do seem to have risen in many cases.  Some people still manage an apparent "bargain" but neither of ours were, that's for certain!

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Sometimes good deals do turn up. The Gucci boat Otley was for sale fairly recently iirc for about £30k. Steel top on but looked to be relatively easy to deconvert. Rebottomed and refooted by wfbco around 2000 I think it was. Fairly naff engine (Perkins 3HD46) if you are into brass but at the end of the day it appeared to be quite a good boat for the money. I suppose it must have an Achilles heel of some sort and I don't know if it had the original back cabin to put lace plates and bronze windlasses in. If not then that could go against it pricewise. 

It would seem someone bought it. No idea who.


Personally I'd be interested in Ascot if and when it comes up for sale. Last time I saw it had the original back cabin and even had the coins in the step.

 

 

 

 

Edited by magnetman
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On 16/12/2017 at 20:13, linnit said:

Hi Pete

I have a 'shiny' boat now:)..work is not something I am scared of of..a must is a decent motor..currently have a DM2..I am not looking at 'converted' boats..ie.. Dover etc..thanks for optimism in keeping hold of funds:D

Will you be keeping the shiny boat with the DM2 or parting company?

I recently spoke to the owner of a very well kept unconverted historic boat that may interested in a deal on something with good pedigree but more creature comforts.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Most unconverted motors sell quick or a few reasons8

A, buyers after a traditional work boat want it that way.

B. Some people see it as a big op to wack a convertion on and sell at a higher price to get a good return, (why lots of butty boats get cut in 2 cheap to buy get 2 boats out of 1 and get double your return easly.)

Depends how picky you are too. my boat list was simple but try and find one for sale at reasonable price or semi good condition.

My list was.

1- Historic. 2- Pref built by or for fmc. 3- wooden bottom. 4- unconverted or very easy to unconvert e.g wooden extention added and not perfectly fittex out, 5- vintage engine. 6- must have correct shape rear cabin and of correct construction materials e.g. wood back metal engine room or all wood. 7- if find one buy a boat that worked for tco.

This list only had about 15 boats in i had to sit and wait for one to come up.

What im trying to say is save your cash and wait the correct boat will turn up and youll know it when you see it!

Edited by billybobbooth
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