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Diesel Bug - Ensure You Fill Your Tank


Alan de Enfield

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Over the last week my tractors have been having fuel starvation symptoms such that it (yesterday) got to such a state that one of them had to be abandoned in the field – it would just not fire up.

Previously they would run for 20 minutes or so, then ‘die’, then a short time later would ‘fire-up’ and run again for a short time. Had they been petrol/carburettor engines I’d have said they were just running on one ‘bowl full’ of fuel.

This morning decided to have a look at one of the other tractors in the yard (-5 degrees and working with bare hands – Brrrrrrrrr)

Fuel filter TOTALLY gunged up with about ½” of ‘diesel-bug-jelly’ – a lot came off in my hands as I pulled the filter out but you get the idea from the pictures.

This is what happens when you :

Use ‘EU Specification’ Red Diesel (NOT FAME Free !!!)

Leave a steel tank half-full and allow condensation to happen

Leave it standing for several weeks

Do not use ‘diesel-bug’ dispersal additives.

So – just a warning folks, in this cold (condensation prone) weather make sure you keep your fuel tanks filled. Once it gets past your filters and starts on the injectors you are into serious money to rectify.

 

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ETA- THIS REPLY NOW APPEARS TO BE INAPPROPRIATE TO THE PROBLEM REPORTED AS IT APPEARS TO BE WAXING NOT DIESEL BUG. 

Reply still stands for Diesel  bug. 

 

Had this a few years ago, tried many things the only effective treatment I found was 

MARINE 16 SHOCK TREATMENT (not the normal marine 16 but the small bottle of shock treatment) 

worked perfectly. 

I used 2 100ml bottles for my 200ltr tank 

Must be applied and then left for 72 hours after that the fuel was perfectly clean, very impressed a case where the product lived up to the what I though may be hype. 

I did change all filters prior to applying 

Link to marine 16 treatment info

http://www.marine16.co.uk/acatalog/Technical_Tips.html

Edited by reg
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11 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

Just on question. In view of the temperatures are you sure its not waxing? Especially if there was some summer time fuel in the tank. I don't know if the refineries still  alter their formulations for winter and summer through.

Actually you might be right about that as the photographs do not look like the diesel  bug I had which was more like long chain of  slimy black strands. 

Was not aware of waxing any pointers on info Tony? 

ETA 

Just did a Google search and believe you are correct I don't think this is diesel bug so the treatment I mentioned may not be appropriate in this case. 

Found this new thread on a farming forum  which may be appropriate 

https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/diesel-waxing.202490/

Edited by reg
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That does look like wax ie yellow, whereas I'd expect diesel bug to be black.

Waxing of diesel fuels can start at as high as zero ('C) at whats called the cloud point - when the fuel starts to go cloudy due to tiny crystals of wax forming.  As the temperature falls the crystals get bigger until they clog the filters etc.

Mineral diesel has more predictable low temperature behaviour, but bio-diesel has an unknown formulation of vegetable oils all of which have different cloud point temperatures, and all diesel fuel sold now is a blend bio and mineral.

The effect is reversible so when the weather warms the fuel will clear, except that you have go well above the cloud point temp to re-liquefy everything.

 

Edited by jake_crew
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9 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

Just on question. In view of the temperatures are you sure its not waxing? Especially if there was some summer time fuel in the tank. I don't know if the refineries still  alter their formulations for winter and summer through.

I had thought of that (and there maybe an element of that), but (so far) the excavator, which has its tank topped up after every use is not affected.

I was always told by the supplier that 'Summer' grade was OK to -5 and Winter grade to -15. Last night was the 1st time we have got to -5. Previously (this Winter) the lowest recorded was -3. 

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Interesting reading through the farming thread it appears to be hitting the farming community quite hard. 

In the context of this forum has anyone had this problem on their boat? Is it something we are likely to meet and if so are there any preventative measures we can take? 

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It was the whitish parts of the gunk that made me think of waxing, not the horrible black bits. I suspect the black is bug.

Some time ago RCR found suffered a string of blocked filter incidents where the filter looked clean but was actually covered in a fairly clear wax like substance. They sent sample for analysis and the report seemed to indicate that it was the result of a reaction between an "anti-bug" additive, the fuel and water. Possibly caused by excess water in the tank and excess use of additive.  That was the time I started draining the bottom of the tank each spring and altering my additive regime. The stuff RCR got from the bottom of the tank and filter was definitely of a whitish colour.

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1 minute ago, reg said:

Interesting reading through the farming thread it appears to be hitting the farming community quite hard. 

In the context of this forum has anyone had this problem on their boat? Is it something we are likely to meet and if so are there any preventative measures we can take? 

I buy my winter top up fuel from a fuel supplier with a high turnover so will be winter diesel, top up from a place which is still selling fuel they bought in the spring/summer may give problems if very cold.  However it is rare for the canal to get very cold and with a steel narrowboat the tanks are partly below the waterline so the canal will keep the tank a bit warmer.

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31 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

Just on question. In view of the temperatures are you sure its not waxing? Especially if there was some summer time fuel in the tank. I don't know if the refineries still  alter their formulations for winter and summer through.

Tony is spot on here. UK refineries make to different specs in the summer and winter (and also have an intermediate formulation for April/September) both for Gasoline and Diesel. In the summer they will use streams that will contain a lot more wax into the diesel pool. In the winter, they reformulate to keep the wax low. As someone else mentioned, the cloud point is the key specification. Quite likely Alan is using summer grade fuel.

Petrol, ie gasoline, is similar. In the winter some refineries stuff as much Butane as possible into the fuel (up to 12%) as the RVP (vapour pressure) is not an issue, but if you keep that fuel to the summer then the butane can cause issues. Butane has a low density so when a lot of butane is put in the gasoline, we get less weight of fuel at the pump, so get worse MPG. Avoid Scotland, the Grangemouth refinery has lots of Butane to get rid of!!!

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I was a workshop manager out here in Kosovo with over 1000 vehicles in the fleet, mainly Nissan and Toyota 4x4s. We get -25c every winter and i would see this problem countless times every winter when it got below -15c. We fitted inline fuel heaters before the fuel filters, end of problem. For sure that is fuel waxing. The fuel was tested and certified every year and reported to be good down to about -28c, it was then i found out that the filters used on the test machines have a different flow rate than automotive fuel filters. Vehicle filters have a higher micron rating so slows the flow more resulting in the filters freezing up quicker. We would bring frozen cars to the heated workshop and leave them overnight, they always started next day. If you put those filters in a tin and place them in the warm it will melt back to diesel. We also had fuel tested that we had put an anti waxing agent in, it made it worse.

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10 minutes ago, Mike Hurley said:

I was a workshop manager out here in Kosovo with over 1000 vehicles in the fleet, mainly Nissan and Toyota 4x4s. We get -25c every winter and i would see this problem countless times every winter when it got below -15c. We fitted inline fuel heaters before the fuel filters, end of problem. For sure that is fuel waxing. The fuel was tested and certified every year and reported to be good down to about -28c, it was then i found out that the filters used on the test machines have a different flow rate than automotive fuel filters. Vehicle filters have a higher micron rating so slows the flow more resulting in the filters freezing up quicker. We would bring frozen cars to the heated workshop and leave them overnight, they always started next day. If you put those filters in a tin and place them in the warm it will melt back to diesel. We also had fuel tested that we had put an anti waxing agent in, it made it worse.

About 25 years ago our local Ford dealer were supplying British Gas with Transits. Part of the spec was a fuel heater. Lucas CAV did a very nice kit which sandwiched between the filter head and spin in filter. We did about 300 of these but it hot a big more difficult when Ford switched to Bosch equipment. We also fitted a number of heated fuel lines to D series trucks. 

I recall stories from the past of drivers in the far north lighting fires under the tanks to warm the diesel. 

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12 minutes ago, Mike Hurley said:

I was a workshop manager out here in Kosovo with over 1000 vehicles in the fleet, mainly Nissan and Toyota 4x4s. We get -25c every winter and i would see this problem countless times every winter when it got below -15c. We fitted inline fuel heaters before the fuel filters, end of problem. For sure that is fuel waxing. The fuel was tested and certified every year and reported to be good down to about -28c, it was then i found out that the filters used on the test machines have a different flow rate than automotive fuel filters. Vehicle filters have a higher micron rating so slows the flow more resulting in the filters freezing up quicker. We would bring frozen cars to the heated workshop and leave them overnight, they always started next day. If you put those filters in a tin and place them in the warm it will melt back to diesel. We also had fuel tested that we had put an anti waxing agent in, it made it worse.

Common rail diesel engines have much finer fuel filters to protect the injection pump and so are more prone to waxing problems than an old engine, probably the fuel testers have not changed the filter spec to match the common rail requirements.

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2 minutes ago, Chewbacka said:

Common rail diesel engines have much finer fuel filters to protect the injection pump and so are more prone to waxing problems than an old engine, probably the fuel testers have not changed the filter spec to match the common rail requirements.

Sounds about right.

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Some truck drivers light little fires under their fuel tanks, or at least they did in the old days.

I am surprised that boaters dont suffer more from waxing, as I suspect that many boats spend the winter with a tank of fuel that was mostly bought in the summer or autumn so will be "summer grade" fuel. In theory the wax should go away when the temperature warms up but I have heard that in some cases some of the waxing is permanent. A suitable diesel additive will lower the waxing point of diesel by quite a few degrees.

...............Dave

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15 minutes ago, pearley said:

I recall stories from the past of drivers in the far north lighting fires under the tanks to warm the diesel. 

Not just the north. I was going to post that I recall often seeing little bonfires under the fuel tanks of lorries in lorry parks in my youth down south. 

12 minutes ago, dmr said:

Some truck drivers light little fires under their fuel tanks, or at least they did in the old days.

Yup

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We had a problem this morning, so this thread is perfectly timed.

We're out on the cut, and encased in ice for the past 2 days, though the ice had turned to slush yesterday. Yesterday we switched on the engine three times during the day to top up the batteries, and help start the central heating system (the central heating is only on for 20 mins - breakfast and bedtime). 

This morning after a very cold night, the engine was switched on (started 1st time after the solenoid had warmed up), though the battery pack wasn't low (12.5) we waited about 5 mins before the central heating system was turned on (as we normally do). After half an hour or so, central heating was turned off, I waited 5 mins while the central heating pump stopped running and the batteries were topped again, then I tried to turn the engine off. The cut out button wouldn't work, it depressed and wouldn't pop out again (sorry I'm sure there's a technical wording for this).

We decided to leave the engine ticking over (for thinking time). Five minutes later the engine spluttered and cut out.

Conclusion (we think), it was ice crystals in the fuel, causing the button to stick. After the ice/condensation had evaporated some 5 or so minutes later, the engine started up again, and the cut out button worked as it should.

We'd filled the tank last Tuesday with 100 litres of fuel at a Marina (a 100 litres their system cuts out), the tank could have taken about another 10 litres to brim it.

Since filling up we've cruised about 4 miles, we're near Hawkesbury.

John's at the moment down the engine hole, he's going to replace the fuel filter (which is probably overdue :( )

Pray for us.... :) 

Edited to say - fuel filter has been changed, it's wasn't too mucky, but was heavy. Now hoping the weather is going to warm up.

Edited by Jennifer McM
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In the mid eighties I worked at a garage maintaining black cabs, one particularly cold year diesel tanks were freezing up and those who didn't suffer from it said they added a small amount of petrol before filling up with derv.

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16 minutes ago, BWM said:

In the mid eighties I worked at a garage maintaining black cabs, one particularly cold year diesel tanks were freezing up and those who didn't suffer from it said they added a small amount of petrol before filling up with derv.

That is what Volkswagon used to recommend, on a (I think) a 5% ratio.

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42 minutes ago, WotEver said:

Not just the north. I was going to post that I recall often seeing little bonfires under the fuel tanks of lorries in lorry parks in my youth down south. 

Yup 

In the Winter of 62/63 A local (Windsor)garage had a lot of call outs for Diesel Waxing problems ,so in 1964 they purchased a New Breakdown Wagon with a Petrol Engine ,their Previous Diesel one had not always been Keen to start up when needed in a hurry.

Edited by cereal tiller
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I'd not be tempted to add petrol or paraffin to my tank. Note that most of the waxing stories are from a long time ago, and it was 80/81 when I last remember the busses stopped running due to waxed diesel. Fuel additives have come a long way since then and diesel engine pumps and injectors have also become a lot more high tech and also much more expensive. Bugger about at your peril!

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12 minutes ago, cereal tiller said:

Yep ,in 75' they may have considered a Solar Truck with Dashboard Mounted Ecofans for Air Conditioning?;)

Did you mean 76'?

Yes :)

I was thinking ‘my first summer in Birmingham’ and I moved to Brum in ‘75.

September. 

So my first summer was indeed ‘76 

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