Hurth HBW 400 & Obsolete Parts

[cheshire~rose]

Thanks for that tip. 

It is good to know of people like that

[cheshire~rose]

Well that's it handed over to ZF ... now we will wait and see what transpires

 

 

Their reception is posh with a high tech coffee table

 

[David Mack]

Is  Vision Zero the power you now have?

[cheshire~rose]

8 hours ago, David Mack said:

Is  Vision Zero the power you now have?

Certainly Zero power!

[cheshire~rose]

The report is in. Nobody is suggesting it is terminal (yet) but I think there may need to be some fettling and scavenging to get it where we want it.

I have a feeling the engineers are enjoying the challenge of working on something Old Skool ... at least they would be if they did not have proper work that gets in the way

There is the expected wear on the clutch plates etc which will be replaced as a matter of course but it is thought the problem we had was caused by excessive wear on the The Shifting Lever Cam Lobe and the Shifting Fork, both will require replacing. 

Here are a few pics for those who are interested in this sort of stuff:

This is not a clear photo but I am told it shows wear on the shifting cam lobe

Input shaft seal track wear, this will require a sleeve

Output flange showing seal track wear

Reverser gear wear on clutch plate drive splines

 

Shift fork wear - this will need to be replaced and is likely to be one of the causes of the problem we reported

The crack on the front housing is still a cause for concern. They have suggested they will discuss our options in a phone call on Monday.

If anyonybody happens to know of a Hurth HBW 400 box languishing in the back of a shed somewhere that might be for sale or parts from it might be available for sale and it has a damage free front casing please get in touch

Edited to add this one:

The Output Flange bolt holes are elongated and needs replacement. However the new Flange is only available with 4 bolt connection, not 8 as the original

[cheshire~rose]

It wasn't such a daft idea to take a 37 year old gearbox back to the manufacturer after all!

Some of the parts we needed were obsolete but our friendly ZF engineer remembered they had a Hurth HBW 450 training box in their stores and he suspected that the parts we needed were interchangeable between the two gearboxes. After a bit of research it was decided to dig the training box out and give an apprentice the opportunity to work on the training box, cannibalising it to get the bits for our box! 

The housing is making it's way back to us through the Christmas holiday period so we can get it welded up (it was going to save a significant amount of red tape to do it that way as it is not something ZF can do in house). A couple of bearings are on order with an expected delivery date of mid January and so we should have the box back by the start of February and it should be pretty much good as new! 

Can anyone answer a question please?

The guys at ZF have links with R&D. They have suggested we can add a new R&D coupling onto our order with them for an additional £75 +VAT. 

I am unsure whether to include it or not. The volunteer who stripped the box out says he looked at it and it appeared fine to him but he had never seen one before! I can't get to look at it myself until the new year but may be able to get someone to take some photos at some point if it helps? 

I am assuming they have suggested we have one because the elongated bolt holes on the output shaft might indicate that there are elongated holes on the coupling it mates to, however: I am aware there was an occasion some time back when we got mightily told off (rightfully so) for allowing it to run with loose bolts and I believe that is likely to be when the damage was done (although who knows how many times since 1980 it has been run with less than tight bolts?) 

I do know that once again a couple of the bolts had worked loose around a six months ago, they were tightened up but it was on the "to do list" to replace the bolts because of a couple of them having been run loose. (We have introduced a new routine check - the bolts are marked with engineering paint and the helm must check they are aligned as part of their routine  checks upon starting the engine) 

A new coupling was fitted some years ago before her bottom was condemned and, as the boat was out of commission for two years I suspect it has not had as much use as it might have done but, I have no idea what the suggested "life" of these things are and whether they deteriorate even if they are not in use. 

If we buy the coupling it will come with the new set of bolts we want anyway but, at £75 +VAT is that a bargain price to have a replacement sitting on the shelf when we next need one or is it unlikely we will need one any time soon? 

Decisions, decisions...

 

[RLWP]

Yes, that's a bargain. Fit the new one, keep the old one just in case

Richard

[cheshire~rose]

11 minutes ago, RLWP said:

Yes, that's a bargain. Fit the new one, keep the old one just in case

Richard

Thank you Unkle Richard! 

 

[cheshire~rose]

On 12/2/2017 at 15:11, cheshire~rose said:

Just by way of an update, the box is now out and I have an appointment with a nice man at ZF on Tuesday morning.

We have had an opportunity to have a look at the crack in the casing and it is not pretty

The housing is now welded and it looks a nice tidy job in a very difficult place to work on. 

 

This has made me realise we are going to need to repaint the box before it is refitted. 

That means I need to dig back in my archives to remind myself what the paint colour is (Lister Blue) unless anyone reading this has it at the tip of their fingers and can tell me  

 

[RLWP]

It's Lister Peacock blue - want a tin? We get it mixed

Richard

[cheshire~rose]

Thank you for the information Richard. I won't need you to mix any for us though.

We have a local supplier of traditional coach enamel:

Paintman

He supplied all the paint for Python and supplies a lot of paint for things like stationary engines and, among other things, The Queen's coaches! I am sure he will mix me up a small tin to pick up next time I am passing. If you were closer I would be happy to collect from you though. 

[RLWP]

3 minutes ago, cheshire~rose said:

Thank you for the information Richard. I won't need you to mix any for us though.

We have a local supplier of traditional coach enamel:

Paintman

He supplied all the paint for Python and supplies a lot of paint for things like stationary engines and, among other things, The Queen's coaches! I am sure he will mix me up a small tin to pick up next time I am passing. If you were closer I would be happy to collect from you though. 

I'll sell you the RAL code instead

[cheshire~rose]

Ha ha

1 minute ago, RLWP said:

I'll sell you the RAL code instead

I may need to take you up on that yet but I have pinged an email off to Paintman to see if he needs more info or a lump of something in the correct colour to match to. 

He got the two colours for Python's cabin spot on first attempt just from an exchange of emails, he visited with some swatches of paint he had mixed and the first he pulled out were spot on! He prides himself on this stuff but you would expect it of a vintage Land Rover enthusiast really  

I can never visit his place without having a long chat with him about all things mechanical 

[cheshire~rose]

We collected our re-manufactured gearbox yesterday and were fortunate to be offered a little guided tour of the site too.

Here is Adi at ZF, the lovely man who managed to get it all to happen for Python with the gearbox all ready to go:

 

It really was the smallest gearbox we saw in the place - there was everything from medium sized wind turbine gearboxes (the shaft from one towered over our heads) to channel tunnel train gearboxes, cross channel ferry, life boat, armoured millitary vehicles (they are not called tanks we were told) earth moving machines and cars.

Amazing place with a lot of people working away with the precision expected of a German engineering company

 

We fit the gearbox on Sunday and can go for a chug again