Jump to content

More inverter problems


Steve R

Featured Posts

Hi everyone, 

me and my partner are two months into our boating life. It seems that every time we think we have it sorted and relax something else crops up. This time our inverter is beeping and showing low voltage when we are watching tv or dvds, it hasn't done it before this week. My batteries are fully charged, I fitted solar panels a month ago and they are near enough charging me full most days. So I'm a little confused why the inverter is showing red low volts. I also turned everything off for a night to see if the batteries lost power but they stayed fully charged so I think they are fine.  Any thoughts would be appreciated. 

Steve

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Steve R said:

Hi everyone, 

me and my partner are two months into our boating life. It seems that every time we think we have it sorted and relax something else crops up. This time our inverter is beeping and showing low voltage when we are watching tv or dvds, it hasn't done it before this week. My batteries are fully charged, I fitted solar panels a month ago and they are near enough charging me full most days. So I'm a little confused why the inverter is showing red low volts. I also turned everything off for a night to see if the batteries lost power but they stayed fully charged so I think they are fine.  Any thoughts would be appreciated. 

Steve

How are you telling their state of charge, volt meter, Smart Gauge, Amp hour counter or hydrometer? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Steve R said:

My charge controller for the solar panels gives me a voltage and also stops charging and goes to float mode when they are full

So what voltage is showing on the solar panel when the inverter drops out in the evening?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Steve R said:

our inverter is beeping and showing low voltage when we are watching tv or dvds, it hasn't done it before this week. My batteries are fully charged

Oh no they’re not! (Well, it is coming up to Panto season.)  They’re flat. And quite possibly wrecked  

From your answers so far you have no monitoring to specifically tell you what the charge state of your batteries are, plus it appears that you don’t understand the correlation between indicated battery voltage and state of charge. 

55 minutes ago, Steve R said:

stops charging and goes to float mode when they are full

‘Full’ by what criterion? At what charge state does it switch to float? Loads of chargers switch to float way too early and it appears that your controller might be doing so too. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I expect it will be worth advising how much solar panel you have fitted & which controller you have . What else is running whilst the TV / DVD are on . Is the fridge on ? 

I have a Tracer solar control box . When i bought my solar set up 4 years ago i also got the little " display " unit . Its bobbins . I have a look at it during the day but i dont RELY on it as i dont trust it . 

Instead i use a " smartgauge " . This advises me as to my batteries state of charge - SOC . Im also careful about power usage . 

At the risk of sounding a little harsh - the tone of your OP seems to be ... " Ive fitted solar so im all fixed up ..." .

Its never going to be that straightforward . At this time of year solar gains begin to diminish & soon enough they ll be all but non existant . I can get away with just solar looking after my batts but thats cos im very cautious and dont have lots of gizmos - no telly for instance , no fridge thru winter . 

If you have been using electrical stuff via your inverter " as you please " thru late summer then that may be ok ( i do the same in summer ) and expect it to continue then its not going to happen . 

The days are getting shorter & solar will not provide . Its effectiveness will already be much less than in June July  & August . Alternative charging methods will be needed. 

I think that you ve not been charging the batts as much as you think & theyve slowly lost capacity from constant undercharging to the point where the inverter isnt able to function . 

Others can advise about how you now test your batts to see if theyre goosed but if they are then its back to the drawing board & a rethink of power management & charging routines . Looking after batteries is the key to living aboard with any degree of success and its a far from easy subject & can be an expensive one too .

I get around this by being a luddite ! But if you want electrical stuff then tje batts must be maintained and that ll involve effort , learning and probably your wallet . 

 

Edited by chubby
  • Greenie 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

OP

So in order to help others to advise can you provide :

How many batteries 

How much solar panel

Which controller

Which inverter 

How many hours TV / DVD per day 

What other electrical goods are drawing from your batts - in particular the fridge . Is it on . Is it 12v /240v ? 

Do u run your engine to charge aswell as the solar ? How many hours if so ?!

There will be more questions i expect and those who can help will need this info ( & maybe more ) in order to help . 

If youve knackered your batts dont worry ..... everybody does . If they are dead its gonna cost to replace and once replaced you ll want them to last a bit longer . If you replace them and carry on as before they will soon pack up aswell . So dont do it .

Provide answers to the above and whatever other info is asked for and you 'll get answers to what has happened and how to prevent it happening again . 

Without the info then folk are just guessing  . Every boat is different . Set ups are different . Usage is different . If help is needed on YOUR set up , folk need to know info about YOUR set up and usage . As i say - without it then its all guesswork

cheers

  • Greenie 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

Very well put series of posts from Mr Chubby above. Getting a grip on how to keep your batteries charged through winter is no mean feat and not to be underestimated, so don't feel disheartened.

Two things I would add.

1)  Chubby says 'maintaining' batteries several times but to be clear, he means charging them FULLY. I know my own solar controller is telling me complete rubbish when it tells me the batteries are 'full'. They could easily be only 60% charged according to the SmartGauge, which is the best of a poor range of battery monitoring devices. 

2) Solar performance nose-dives this time of year in my experience. Once November arrives the output will be negligible and you'll be needing to run the engine or a genny a couple of hours daily. 

3) Your batteries are almost certainly goosed from not being charged fully on a daily basis, but another approach to obsessing about keeping them correctly charged is to not bother, and buy a new set every autumn. It will take most of winter for you to knacker a new set, which will then tide you through the next summer once the solar comes back on stream.  Then buy another new set the following autumn.

Battery management is by far the most challenging thing about living aboard off grid. Did I say that already? If so, it is worth repeating.

 

 

Edited by Mike the Boilerman
To add a missing phrase
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I understand battery management is important and have been doing my best to keep them fully charged, but all I have to go on is the charge controller which says 12.8v this evening. We have been moving the boat and running the engine when is not sunny days for extra charge. We don't have much running through the inverter, just the tv and DVD. Our fridge is 12v and wired in. I have 3 175w solar panels. Sounds like I might need to test the batteries just to rule it out. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, Steve R said:

I understand battery management is important and have been doing my best to keep them fully charged, but all I have to go on is the charge controller which says 12.8v this evening. We have been moving the boat and running the engine when is not sunny days for extra charge. We don't have much running through the inverter, just the tv and DVD. Our fridge is 12v and wired in. I have 3 175w solar panels. Sounds like I might need to test the batteries just to rule it out. 

3  x 175 watt solar panels from now until around april will be about as much use as an eco fan or chocolate fireguard. I would spend a few quid and buy some snake oil.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 04/10/2017 at 18:52, Steve R said:

I understand battery management is important and have been doing my best to keep them fully charged, but all I have to go on is the charge controller which says 12.8v this evening. We have been moving the boat and running the engine when is not sunny days for extra charge. We don't have much running through the inverter, just the tv and DVD. Our fridge is 12v and wired in. I have 3 175w solar panels. Sounds like I might need to test the batteries just to rule it out. 

 

I have 560w of solar which is now almost, but not quite, keeping up with the demands of my 12v fridge. And I don't have a telly or a DVD player.

I do however listen to the radio for perhaps 5 hours a day and use the little laptop for three or four.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Several of the more modestly priced MPPT controllers seem to go to float far too early and I suspect they are timed.

That 12.8 is probably a lot of surface charge so it will drop fast to a much lower figure when night falls. Lets have the voltage just before you turn in or when the  inverter beeps but make sure is battery voltage.

I am so unsure about my new MPPT controller I have ordered and intend to fit a separate digital voltmeter.

The fact the fridge is not running via the inverter is an irrelevance, its still depleting the battery charge but possibly not as fast as a mains fridge via and inverter might.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 04/10/2017 at 19:29, Steve R said:

I have just seen that the olp light is showing on the inverter which I think might mean something is shorting out from what have have read on here. 

 

Have a look in the manual for it. (I have never heard of an "olp" light or perhaps I'm being dense and its a typo.)  The manual will have a chart telling you what all the lights mean.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

27 minutes ago, Steve R said:

I understand battery management is important and have been doing my best to keep them fully charged, but all I have to go on is the charge controller which says 12.8v this evening. We have been moving the boat and running the engine when is not sunny days for extra charge. We don't have much running through the inverter, just the tv and DVD. Our fridge is 12v and wired in. I have 3 175w solar panels. Sounds like I might need to test the batteries just to rule it out. 

hi Steve,

just to keep it simple, whats the voltage when your inverter starts wailing.... 

I suspect you are about to be made aware that fully charged batteries that have lost at lot of their capacity don't run inverters/fridges for very long....  

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I too have the feeling that Steve is at the base of a long, steep and very expensive education about battery charging and monitoring, but is still in the denial phase. 

I mean, how hard can it be to charge the batteries? Well not hard, but the sheer time it takes and equipment needed and  is hard for a new person to come to terms with.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

interesting so something is drawing over a 1KW..... hair dryer, hair straighteners, electric heater.....

alternatively you are running something that your inverter doesn't like, especially if its not a pure sine wave inverter.  process of elimination time, if its not obvious you will need to go round and switch off all your mains (inverter driven) equipment unile the overload light goes out.

if you have a separate mains charger for your batteries for when are on a shore line make sure that is off and any immersion heater....  you'd be surprised at how many people think they've invented a perpetual motion machine trying to run their inverter off the batteries the charger plugged into the inverter is charging....

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, Dr Bob said:

Immersion heaters are very good at taking 100A out without being noticed except for the hum coming from the inverter. I turn off the breaker for ours when not on shore power. Trying to teach the kids to do the same is an uphill struggle.

Consider rewiring it so that it’s only fed by shore power :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On our Victron Multi inverter/charger there is an output which is only live when on shore power so the immersion heater is wired into that. This means in the event of a power cut and the unnoticeable change over to inverter power the batteries are not subjected to an excessive load due to the immersion heater draining them. When mains power is restored this output comes live again after about 1 minute.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Ace 01 said:

On our Victron Multi inverter/charger there is an output which is only live when on shore power so the immersion heater is wired into that. This means in the event of a power cut and the unnoticeable change over to inverter power the batteries are not subjected to an excessive load due to the immersion heater draining them. When mains power is restored this output comes live again after about 1 minute.

Thanks for that. I must read the manual.

On 05/10/2017 at 00:11, Mike the Boilerman said:

Or consider rewiring the kids.

Some hope!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.