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Tawny75

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3 hours ago, Captain Pegg said:

I think we are broadly in agreement on this.

ABNB is perhaps not the place folk look for cheap liveaboards and this isn't a non-marina liveaboard configured boat. That's a lot of what's driving the market. The other thing is probably floating retirement cottage demand. It's not one of those either. If it's overpriced I would be interested to see anything better in that price range that has sold this year. I don't recall any.

Just looks like a decent honest small boat to me and more importantly meets the prospective purchasers original spec. Just needs the survey to confirm that.

JP

I'm in agreement here, overall it looks a fairly nice boat at a half decent price, but but but, it needs a bit of work and a fair wad of cash  to upgrade it to something I for one would purchase for cc ing,  the basics are there, but its tired, and I would venture to say that apart from the cooker, it has not had much spent on it in the last five years. When looking at boats [liveaboard], I want something that has evidence of regular maintenance, and that is probably the main [logical] reason I crossed this one off my shopping list. Its too expensive for bargain hunters, not attractive  enough for the more affluent leisured classes. 

I worry about the reliance on appliances, but then I realise that with two folks on board, their demand is going to be much higher than mine. [edit] ... OP is wanting this for weekends and holidays, so no real need for a w/machine, or a fridge.

Having said all that, if OP likes it and its the right price, then best wishes, assuming it passes a hull survey, you should be on board for xmas.

Edited by LadyG
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On 22/10/2017 at 08:56, alan_fincher said:

We sold a 20 year old 50 foot Mike Heywood boat 3 years ago for £30K.  This one is shorter and 26 years old, for similar money, so, unlike Mike, I can't see it as a good deal, (though I realise prices have gone up in the last 3 years).

 

Well three years ago I'd have been saying this is a "£25k or offers" boat and £31k was overpriced. But things are different today. Have you really not noticed?!! 

Presumably your advice to the OP is to buy a boat three years ago. I'd agree with that. 

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57 minutes ago, LadyG said:

I'm in agreement here, overall it looks a fairly nice boat at a half decent price, but but but, it needs a bit of work and a fair wad of cash  to upgrade it to something I for one would purchase for cc ing,  the basics are there, but its tired, and I would venture to say that apart from the cooker, it has not had much spent on it in the last five years. When looking at boats [liveaboard], I want something that has evidence of regular maintenance, and that is probably the main [logical] reason I crossed this one off my shopping list. Its too expensive for bargain hunters, not attractive  enough for the more affluent leisured classes. 

I worry about the reliance on appliances, but then I realise that with two folks on board, their demand is going to be much higher than mine. [edit] ... OP is wanting this for weekends and holidays, so no real need for a w/machine, or a fridge.

Having said all that, if OP likes it and its the right price, then best wishes, assuming it passes a hull survey, you should be on board for xmas.

You can find a reason to strike any boat off a list of potentials. The key is that if you really want one then at some point you have to make a decision to buy one.

JP

Edited by Captain Pegg
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The abnb brochure and spiel are rather good at hiding what they don't want you to see.

How many abnb brochures don't show the engine bay??........(none......make sure you look down there if you visit)

No battery for bowthruster and perhaps fit something to stop the starter battery flattening? ?

Kitchen is a newer set of units to rest of fitout.

Stove/flue join with more cement than rugby cement factory. 

It is a very basic boat which looks like it has been used as a flat on a landline by the last owner for a while, whether rented out or personal use. ...you can't tell. 

Probably just about right price in today's daft market, doesn't make it an ideal boat though.

 

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On 22/10/2017 at 18:49, matty40s said:

No battery for bowthruster and perhaps fit something to stop the starter battery flattening? ?

Kitchen is a newer set of units to rest of fitout.

Stove/flue join with more cement than rugby cement factory. 

Quibbling about details like these in today's white hot market when the OP has found a boat with all the fundamentals right at a price they can afford, seems churlish at best.

In my experience there is no such thing as the perfect boat. They ALWAYS have stuff wrong unless you buy new, and even that just introduces a whole nother set of problems. This boat is the right length, has the right accommodation and is the right price. So what if the inverter and the chimney flue  need replacing? 

Or should they carry on looking for a year for an identical boat with good flue and the right inverter? During which time prices may have risen another 10%. 

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I'm not quibbling, I'm just recommending they look a bit closer at something that on the surface looks right, but at 26 years old, may be hiding a multitude of problems. 

I do note that you selectively quoted my post and missed the elephant in the room of the engine bay.

Edited by matty40s
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Just now, matty40s said:

I'm not quibbling, I'm just recommending they look a bit closer at something that on the surface looks right, but at 26 years old, may be hiding a multitude of problems. 

I would think that the survey should sway them, they like it, its in their budget, and can be cleaned up quite a bit with teacut and polish.

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1 hour ago, Captain Pegg said:

You can find a reason to strike any boat off a list of potentials. The key is that if you really want one then at some point you have to make a decision to buy one.

JP

I have had a major setback at present, but check Appollo D every day,  I have a rolling short list, but as soon as I can move, I trust there will be a good boat waiting.

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With the way boat sales seem to be going at the moment I would say if the OP feels the boat ticks enough boxes and the survey throws nothing up too serious or expensive then go for it. Things can be changed or upgraded over time to suit your own needs and at worse give it a spruce up and put it back on the market next year and probably make a small profit.

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On 22/10/2017 at 19:34, matty40s said:

I'm not quibbling, I'm just recommending they look a bit closer at something that on the surface looks right, but at 26 years old, may be hiding a multitude of problems. 

 

And all I'm saying is that with a 47ft Mike Heyward boat priced around £30k, there are bound to be some problems or the boat would be £35k or £40k. So a dodgy flue and undersized inverter are quite good 'problems' to get. And yes a grubby engine bay is another likelihood at that price.

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Our first (low) offer has been rejected which we expected, the broker has given us an indication of what the seller is looking for pricewise, so we are going to up our offer and go up again this weekend and ask them to take the cover off the back so that we can look in the engine bay and ask them to start the engine.

 

 

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9 minutes ago, Halsey said:

have a look at hirondelle at Welton Fields great builder - but only works if you like old engines probably go for £30k 

Hirondelle is a trad stern and we want a cruiser or a semi trad.

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14 hours ago, matty40s said:

 

I do note that you selectively quoted my post and missed the elephant in the room of the engine bay.

When they sold our last boat the brochure, which I still have, certainly included a photo of that elephant.

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16 hours ago, matty40s said:

I'm not quibbling, I'm just recommending they look a bit closer at something that on the surface looks right, but at 26 years old, may be hiding a multitude of problems. 

I do note that you selectively quoted my post and missed the elephant in the room of the engine bay.

I agree ABNB do not routinely picture the engine bay which I don't understand, but most of the other brokers are deficient in this respect.  It's not true to say they never show it though, I've seen plenty of examples.

The wider point is not may be hiding a multitude of problems... a 26 year old boat is guaranteed to be hiding a build up of 26 years of less than perfect ownership.  Very few boats, if any, are maintained regardless of cost or time.  Those that are sell within seconds.  Most of us on here know what we would be letting ourselves in for were we to buy the boat in question oh and by the way let's not kid ourselves that a "professional" survey is going to reveal all, unless the surveyor has x ray vision and a crystal ball. 

 

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1 hour ago, Neil2 said:

I agree ABNB do not routinely picture the engine bay which I don't understand, but most of the other brokers are deficient in this respect.  It's not true to say they never show it though, I've seen plenty of examples.

The wider point is not may be hiding a multitude of problems... a 26 year old boat is guaranteed to be hiding a build up of 26 years of less than perfect ownership.  Very few boats, if any, are maintained regardless of cost or time.  Those that are sell within seconds.  Most of us on here know what we would be letting ourselves in for were we to buy the boat in question oh and by the way let's not kid ourselves that a "professional" survey is going to reveal all, unless the surveyor has x ray vision and a crystal ball. 

 

So how about you tell us about your experience of buying a boat of this sort of vintage Neil2? Otherwise these cryptic remarks are no help to the prospective buyer.

JP

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4 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

So how about you tell us about your experience of buying a boat of this sort of vintage Neil2? Otherwise these cryptic remarks are no help to the prospective buyer.

JP

A good idea - the more the merrier, obviously the more members who tell us about buying older boats (and any problems which they had) will be informative to the O.P. I found Neil's remarks helpful (and not cryptic), but it would be pleasing if other members could expand on the points which he has raised.

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I'm uncomfortable with the sleight against "professional" surveyors - a £300 hull survey just saved me making a big mistake on a boat at the other end of the age and price spectrum to the OPs thoughts 

As with property surveyors they can't find everything but their input is worth EVERY penny even if it doesn't feel like it at the time and believe me after paying his fee and the marina fees for lift out it didn't 

I have bought cheaper boats without surveys in the past and always got away with it but in this new era of 240v supplies, inverters and all mod cons being a "given" I wouldn't buy again without a hull survey 

 

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good to hear - can I also caution you in accepting any former "recent" survey despite the pressure you might be under unless the surveyor will legally transfer it and its assurances to you - this should properly be at your cost.

Edited by Halsey
more info given
  • Greenie 1
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On 22/10/2017 at 14:23, Tawny75 said:

Another question on this, if we were to require a more powerful inverter (we are slightly worried about the fridge going off overnight) does anyone have a rough idea of how much it would cost to source one and have it fitted?

 

An electric fridge uses about half your total electricity consumption (whether 12 V or 240 V). So getting a larger inverter to run the fridge will require you to generate twice as much electricity as if you use a gas fridge.

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We decided to venture further north today, we went up to Cheshire.  We saw a boat, loved it, two hours later we phoned to put an offer in to find out that an hour before the vendor had accepted an offer for the same amount.  Sad times but on we go!

 

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I'm in the process of selling my 1987 Liverpool Hull "Cobweb" which I have owned for four years. 

Lovely boat, sails well, sound hull, Lister SR2, multi fuel stove etc etc.

Reason I'm selling is two-fold, the market is in favour of the seller at the moment so I get more for the boat, and we want a new-build sailaway which we can lay out to our own specification.

Four years with Cobweb was enough to come to the conclusion that we love owning our own boat, there are very few problems that can't be overcome with a little work and those problems that I can't handle have been dealt with by the professionals. It also taught me that the layout of Cobweb was not ideal for us, my wife is disabled and the trad stern made entering the boat awkward for her. We looked at stripping the interior out and re-building but the cost was about the same as buying a sailaway and fitting that out, plus it didn't solve the trad stern problem, so no choice really.

I am sure the people buying her will be as happy as we have been with Cobweb as a first boat.

I would say that older boats are as good a place to start as anywhere. It's a learning curve - pretty steep at times - but learning this way prepares you for all sorts of things that you can and will cope with in the future. Hopefully the work I have done (and have had done) will serve the new owners well.

Keep looking - the boat that is ideal for you is out there!

(ps this is not an advert - I already have an offer I have accepted!)

Edited by manxmike
Stupidity!
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