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Boat Stretching enquiry


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On 09/08/2017 at 09:09, Wee Vee said:

We were more interested in people's experience of having their boats stretched – the pitfalls and things to look out for.

 

I think the main pitfall is underestimating the complexity of carrying out a stretch and completely overlooking a sting of minor but impossible-to-ignore expenses. Like buying two tons of ballast in a convenient format, getting it delivered to the boat and manhandling it into place in the bilge before the fitting out proceeds.

With a stretch I think there is loads of scope for the old cliche about it taking twice as long and costing twice and much as your most carefully thought out estimate, to be true.

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14 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

I think the main pitfall is underestimating the complexity of carrying out a stretch and completely overlooking a sting of minor but impossible-to-ignore expenses. Like buying two tons of ballast in a convenient format, getting it delivered to the boat and manhandling it into place in the bilge before the fitting out proceeds.

With a stretch I think there is loads of scope for the old cliche about it taking twice as long and costing twice and much as your most carefully thought out estimate, to be true.

3

Very similar to renovating a property I'm guessing – it's only once it's taken apart that the true extent of work can be appreciated.
We'll bear this in mind, thanks Mike.

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I always ballast the boat before returning it to the water as for pricing as previously mentioned in this post I would not stretch a boat less than Six foot due to sheet sizes land my foot price is based on this the price of £695 a foot includes three coats of black up to the top rubbing strake we also cut porthole apertures at window apertures no VAT to be added to final price cost of transport and crane is £1,500 out and back from Stockton top marina 

Kedian engineering Ltd

www.kedianengineering.co.uk

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11 minutes ago, KEDIAN said:

I always ballast the boat before returning it to the water as for pricing as previously mentioned in this post I would not stretch a boat less than Six foot due to sheet sizes land my foot price is based on this the price of £695 a foot includes three coats of black up to the top rubbing strake we also cut porthole apertures at window apertures no VAT to be added to final price cost of transport and crane is £1,500 out and back from Stockton top marina 

Kedian engineering Ltd

www.kedianengineering.co.uk

That's really useful information, many thanks. Do you take on interior refurb work too?

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On ‎8‎/‎7‎/‎2017 at 23:01, Mike the Boilerman said:

I'd say you'll notice a marginal reduction in performance (in acceleration and in stopping) due to the extra weight, but steady state cruising along will be unaffected unless you have to use full power already to achieve cruising speed. You'll just have the speed control set slightly higher for any given speed through the water.

 

I would say that more or less exactly sums up my experience having had 8ft added last year without changing the engine or prop.

Steve

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Martin, Could I ask the method you use to weld in the extra piece of base plate do you grind the ends of the new piece & the original base plate ends to a feather edge & run several weld runs in the "veed"  out groove or use a different method, Thanks.

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On 8/9/2017 at 15:40, Wee Vee said:

That's really useful information, many thanks. Do you take on interior refurb work too?

I had my boat stretched 7 foot by the original maker [Johnathon Wilson] It has made the boat a much more pleasant place to live the boat drives better and after a prop repitch now performes better than before.

The refit also was much bigger than the 7 foot but has turned out really well , would I do it again? yes I would as it was by far the cheapest way to achieve exactly what I wanted. The whole thing including a double glazed insulated wheelhouse cost 20K, which in my book was money well spent.

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On 11/08/2017 at 12:00, peterboat said:

I had my boat stretched 7 foot by the original maker [Johnathon Wilson] It has made the boat a much more pleasant place to live the boat drives better and after a prop repitch now performes better than before.

The refit also was much bigger than the 7 foot but has turned out really well , would I do it again? yes I would as it was by far the cheapest way to achieve exactly what I wanted. The whole thing including a double glazed insulated wheelhouse cost 20K, which in my book was money well spent.

That's really useful info – thanks for sharing Peter. :) 

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In 2000 the 1986 Bullfinch was stretched from 45 feet to 57. The extra 12 feet gave a generous bedroom and an enlarged engine room.  This allowed  the 10hp Sabb to be replaced by a 22hp Sabb. 

The Colecraft shell was lengthened and engine fitted by Mike Sivewright to a very professional standard. The  existing cherry planking by Ron Beauchamp at Colecraft was copied into the new bedroom walls with the rest of the woodwork done to follow the existing scheme.

Other work was done.  A full repaint, inverter and some 240 sockets, a new front stove, a new Alde boiler and other minor works.

Now, back in 1986 the original boat cost towards £17000 and this  new work cost back then a further £20000. On the face of it considering the boats value in 2017 then it seems worth it. We love the boat as it is but we've only owned it for 11 of those 31 years. 

For the previous owner, in hindsight, he didn't think that the stretching was right for him. It wasn't the same boat in his eyes and he has told us he thought it would have been better to sell and buy another 57 foot boat.

 

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On 12/08/2017 at 16:11, Peter-Bullfinch said:

In 2000 the 1986 Bullfinch was stretched from 45 feet to 57. The extra 12 feet gave a generous bedroom and an enlarged engine room.  This allowed  the 10hp Sabb to be replaced by a 22hp Sabb. 

The Colecraft shell was lengthened and engine fitted by Mike Sivewright to a very professional standard. The  existing cherry planking by Ron Beauchamp at Colecraft was copied into the new bedroom walls with the rest of the woodwork done to follow the existing scheme.

Other work was done.  A full repaint, inverter and some 240 sockets, a new front stove, a new Alde boiler and other minor works.

Now, back in 1986 the original boat cost towards £17000 and this  new work cost back then a further £20000. On the face of it considering the boats value in 2017 then it seems worth it. We love the boat as it is but we've only owned it for 11 of those 31 years. 

For the previous owner, in hindsight, he didn't think that the stretching was right for him. It wasn't the same boat in his eyes and he has told us he thought it would have been better to sell and buy another 57 foot boat.

 

 

The previous owner was grossly underestimating the almost administrative impossibility it is to sell a boat you live on, and at the same time buy another to move onto. Not only do you have to find a buyer for your old boat, but you need to find another boat that fits your needs with a seller willing to wait until you find that buyer. AND organise the money changing hands in a timely manner that suits all parties involved.

It's hard enough finding the right boat, let alone the right boat at the right price and it having to be available at precisely the same time as you sell the previous boat. 

Complicated as it is, I think stretching their existing boat is the easiest option for the OP.

Very helpful and informative post. Greenied.

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1 hour ago, Peter-Bullfinch said:

In 2000 the 1986 Bullfinch was stretched from 45 feet to 57. The extra 12 feet gave a generous bedroom and an enlarged engine room.  This allowed  the 10hp Sabb to be replaced by a 22hp Sabb. 

The Colecraft shell was lengthened and engine fitted by Mike Sivewright to a very professional standard. The  existing cherry planking by Ron Beauchamp at Colecraft was copied into the new bedroom walls with the rest of the woodwork done to follow the existing scheme.

Other work was done.  A full repaint, inverter and some 240 sockets, a new front stove, a new Alde boiler and other minor works.

Now, back in 1986 the original boat cost towards £17000 and this  new work cost back then a further £20000. On the face of it considering the boats value in 2017 then it seems worth it. We love the boat as it is but we've only owned it for 11 of those 31 years. 

For the previous owner, in hindsight, he didn't think that the stretching was right for him. It wasn't the same boat in his eyes and he has told us he thought it would have been better to sell and buy another 57 foot boat.

 

Glad it worked out for you Peter, sounds like it's made a lovely boat.

As Mike said, because of our interior requirements being a little unusual, we're sure that stretching is the way to go. It also gives us the chance to increase the size of the galley & bathroom, which are a little pokey at present. 

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On 8/7/2017 at 22:12, dmr said:

I know nuffin about your boat so probly talkin rubbish.

Some stretched boats look very out of proportion as they end up with  a very small front deck with a very long cabin.

A cheap and easy way to lengthen a boat is to extend the front deck in front of the front bulkhead as this avoids cutting and joining most of the wiring etc. If your boat is at all traddy could you do this and then put a simulated sheety bit on the front???????????

..................Dave

Just a postscript to this which some might be interested in.

What Dave suggests sounds straightforward enough and it is an option I was considering.  However, the problem is most narrowboats have a bow shape that starts aft of the front bulkhead, so the hull has to be cut back to the start of the curve and the new section "staggered" to fit.  As a result the front 2-3 feet of the boat has to be stripped out which might not be a big deal on some boats but with ours, which has the galley at the bow, it turns the job into a kitchen refit.  

Must admit I naively though it was just a matter of cutting off the bow immediately in front of the bulkhead, with little or no disturbance to the cabin, and welding in a new section.  

It may therefore be, literally, back to the drawing board for us.

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59 minutes ago, Neil2 said:

Just a postscript to this which some might be interested in.

What Dave suggests sounds straightforward enough and it is an option I was considering.  However, the problem is most narrowboats have a bow shape that starts aft of the front bulkhead, so the hull has to be cut back to the start of the curve and the new section "staggered" to fit.  As a result the front 2-3 feet of the boat has to be stripped out which might not be a big deal on some boats but with ours, which has the galley at the bow, it turns the job into a kitchen refit.  

Must admit I naively though it was just a matter of cutting off the bow immediately in front of the bulkhead, with little or no disturbance to the cabin, and welding in a new section.  

It may therefore be, literally, back to the drawing board for us.

You are correct, I've known a couple of people who have planned to do this but they probably had quite long well decks to start with, or maybe hit the same problem as you. We have a long front deck so everything is straight by the time it gets to the cabin, though we are nearly 71 feet already so won't be getting stretched.

Ive seen a few boats extended at the back by welding on a sort of extra long cruiser stern :D

............Dave

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11 hours ago, dmr said:

You are correct, I've known a couple of people who have planned to do this but they probably had quite long well decks to start with, or maybe hit the same problem as you. We have a long front deck so everything is straight by the time it gets to the cabin, though we are nearly 71 feet already so won't be getting stretched.

Ive seen a few boats extended at the back by welding on a sort of extra long cruiser stern :D

............Dave

It's very frustrating, it was only when I spoke to the guys at Streethay that I began to realise this may not be as easy a mod as I thought.  The curve of our bow is very slight behind the bulkhead but it's still a curve and that buggers the whole thing up.  We've got water pipes, gas pipes, expansion vessel, a water heater, a double sink, the cooker, water pump as well as fitted kitchen units - everything would have to come out.  If, as on many boats, the lounge was up front it would be relatively straightforward and we'd probably go for it. 

    

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32 minutes ago, Neil2 said:

It's very frustrating, it was only when I spoke to the guys at Streethay that I began to realise this may not be as easy a mod as I thought.  The curve of our bow is very slight behind the bulkhead but it's still a curve and that buggers the whole thing up.  We've got water pipes, gas pipes, expansion vessel, a water heater, a double sink, the cooker, water pump as well as fitted kitchen units - everything would have to come out.  If, as on many boats, the lounge was up front it would be relatively straightforward and we'd probably go for it. 

    

At the position of the front bulkhead, is the curvature visible above the waterline, or, less likely,  does it only start below the waterline?  and how much has it curved in at the bulkhead, and how far to the rear of the bulkhead does the curve actually start?

You can see where this is going and its clutching at straws, it would be a difficult and unusual job, probably outside the comfort zone of the boatyard, plus some welding with the insulation in place.

..............Dave

 

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