Diesels to be banned

[dor]

So, the Government has plans to ban petrol and diesel engines in new cars from 2040. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40723581   I can well see this happening, as the battery and motor technology is advancing at a fantastic rate at the moment.  But what will happen to our boats?  Will a Vetus or Barrus engine be looked at longingly like we now regard a DM2 or a Gardner?  It will be interesting to see how battery technology advances over the next few years, and solar is going to be increasingly significant.  Seen the Panda? :  http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-asia-40723015/china-opens-panda-shaped-solar-power-plant

 

 

[DHutch]

My 16 year old 3l petrol car is the newest I have owned. I think it will be a while before internal combustion leaves our world. Equally, I think what we consider to be normal will change significantly too. Better get building them nukes!

Daniel

[frangar]

Time to bring back steam then!! I'm getting rather tired of the government telling us what's best for us to suit their agenda. It's also a tad ironic that theve just scrapped the electrification of so many railways.....

[mross]

If petrol and diesel is banned, we will need to build at least four, new power stations to supply the necessary energy.  Solar panels have a maximum theoretical efficiency of about 38%.  As we know, UK's sun is not very reliable.  Even in 2040 I suspect many internal combustion vehicles will be grandfathered.

[Naughty Cal]

I am intrigued to see the new electric lorries they will be bringing out. 

[Tawny75]

1 hour ago, frangar said:

Time to bring back steam then!! I'm getting rather tired of the government telling us what's best for us to suit their agenda. It's also a tad ironic that theve just scrapped the electrification of so many railways.....

I was just about to say the same thing! 

I agree with what others are saying, other forms of energy are advancing at an amazing rate, but if they wont electrify the entire rail network they can hardly expect all cars to be electric.

24 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

I am intrigued to see the new electric lorries they will be bringing out. 

Exactly.

Him indoors is a truck driver, as he says, if they want less diesel trucks on the road then we all need to stop buying stuff.

[arbutus]

There’s a three-minute video here

https://transact.ft.com/en-gb/?play=electric-vehicles

Made by the financial services company UBS

They predict that by 2023, in six years time, car-makers in Europe will be able to make an electric car giving a 5% profit margin and it will be cheaper than a conventional car. They predict that by 2025, 30% of cars sold in Europe will be electric.

[Murflynn]

there are 2 other factors that the powers-that-be seem to avoid all the time:

1. the human population is far too high to be sustainable whatever form of fuel we use.

2. our habits of travelling long distances and transporting goods from the other side of the world, or across our own country, need to change.

 

.................  oh, and pray tell me how do we replace hundreds of thousands of jet planes?  I predict that cheap air travel will be hounded out of existence by punitive taxes on the fuel they use.

Edited July 26, 2017 by Murflynn

[furnessvale]

27 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

I am intrigued to see the new electric lorries they will be bringing out. 

Already designed and tested by Volvo amongst others.

I kid you not.  Each lorry has a pantograph on its roof and the motorway has overhead wires............ just like a railway.

Then they run all the lorries very close to each other under the control of one driver at the front...............just like a railway.

When they get to the far end, they split up the convoy and send each vehicle on its own way with a separate driver...............just like a railway.

Methinks they are trying to reinvent the wheel.  Sadly for them the rubber(road)wheels they are using are so fuel inefficient compared to steel wheel on steel rail, they will still use three times as much energy as a railway moving the goods!

George

[WotEver]

3 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

the human population is far too high to be sustainable whatever form of fuel we use.

Reported today that "40,000 people die in the UK each year from pollution related diseases". So if they fix that, there's another 40,000 pensions the Gov will have to find. 

[Pluto]

Surely the real problem is that transport is too cheap, resulting in people travelling long distances every day to and from work, and businesses moving goods long distances from one centre to another before it reaches its final destination. Hospitals are centralised, creating more travelling for patients, and thus creating more pollution which we know results in some people having poorer health. Those running things seem incapable of looking at things from first principles, and are merely interested in short-tern financial benefit, usually to themselves or their 'friends'.

[Robbo]

1 hour ago, mross said:

If petrol and diesel is banned, we will need to build at least four, new power stations to supply the necessary energy.  Solar panels have a maximum theoretical efficiency of about 38%.  As we know, UK's sun is not very reliable.  Even in 2040 I suspect many internal combustion vehicles will be grandfathered.

If we start building more Nuclear plants now we may have enough,  however we will more than likely just use gas plants.

[WotEver]

1 minute ago, Robbo said:

If we start building more Nuclear plants now we may have enough,  however we will more than likely just use gas plants.

Oh goody, more CO2

From a finite resource. 

[Murflynn]

28 minutes ago, Robbo said:

If we start building more Nuclear plants now we may have enough,  however we will more than likely just use gas plants.

no, we will use an ever increasing number of wind farms, and hopefully wave farms as well once a useful technology emerges.

gas plants are part of the problem (but you knew that already).  They will always produce CO2 and no doubt produce some NOx as well.

[Robbo]

Just now, Murflynn said:

no, we will use an ever increasing number of wind farms, and hopefully wave farms as well once a useful technology emerges.

gas plants are part of the problem (but you knew that already).  They will always produce CO2 and no doubt produce some NOx as well.

Unless you come up with a suitable storage method that can suistain min of 7 weeks, renewables like wind and solar will always need another source.  Nuclear is really the only answer, and is prob the most cleanest of them all including renewables like solar.

[ditchcrawler]

10 hours ago, dor said:

So, the Government has plans to ban petrol and diesel engines in new cars from 2040. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40723581   I can well see this happening, as the battery and motor technology is advancing at a fantastic rate at the moment.  But what will happen to our boats?  Will a Vetus or Barrus engine be looked at longingly like we now regard a DM2 or a Gardner?  It will be interesting to see how battery technology advances over the next few years, and solar is going to be increasingly significant.  Seen the Panda? :  http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-asia-40723015/china-opens-panda-shaped-solar-power-plant

 

 

Well they have never hit any of their other targets so why should the manage this one. I think the only way it will happen is if there are no body making them any more.

1 hour ago, Pluto said:

Surely the real problem is that transport is too cheap, resulting in people travelling long distances every day to and from work, and businesses moving goods long distances from one centre to another before it reaches its final destination. Hospitals are centralised, creating more travelling for patients, and thus creating more pollution which we know results in some people having poorer health. Those running things seem incapable of looking at things from first principles, and are merely interested in short-tern financial benefit, usually to themselves or their 'friends'.

The ultimate on this must be "Green electricity" where they bring the "green" fuel half way round the world on oil burning ships and diesel burning trains.

[David Schweizer]

3 hours ago, mross said:

If petrol and diesel is banned, we will need to build at least four, new power stations to supply the necessary energy.  Solar panels have a maximum theoretical efficiency of about 38%.  As we know, UK's sun is not very reliable.  Even in 2040 I suspect many internal combustion vehicles will be grandfathered.

But we do get a lot of rain, and what has always bewildered me is the little use we make of falling water to generate power. In Swizerland, almost every waterfall you see has a small turbine associated with it, imagine how much power could be generated just from the numerous long waterfalls on the Thames, and there must be many more similar opportunities on our other rivers.

Unfortunately, the Planning Authorities seem to discourage any such inovation. Near me there is an old derelect water mill on the River Avon,  and the owners recently submitted a Planning Application for it's restoration and the installation of a water turbine. The application was refused  on "ecological" grounds!! eventually the mill building, which is wooden, will collapse and fall into the river.

[peterboat]

Just as well that CRT are installing turbines on all the weirs up here then isnt it? I dont know why people are complaining it will happen the technology is leaping ahead so in a few years when your silent boat cruises down the canal you will wonder what all the fuss was about

[David Schweizer]

2 minutes ago, peterboat said:

Just as well that CRT are installing turbines on all the weirs up here then isnt it? I dont know why people are complaining it will happen the technology is leaping ahead so in a few years when your silent boat cruises down the canal you will wonder what all the fuss was about

I didn't know that, they must have been reading my mind. I look forward to more, it just seems so logical to me.

[b0atman]

So commercial TV has a top watched programme come the AD break the generating powers that be are ready for the kettles going on .This scenario will be happening at School and work home times M-F .I hope that the construction industry is geared up for all the power outlets that are going to be required .WHAT copper is getting short supply ? which is one reason why electrification of trains is slowing I believe.

Electric boating on the LLangollen could be feasible powered by water flow.

 

[system 4-50]

There will be a long transition period where you can run existing nasty engines but are not allowed to buy new ones. So buy yourself a couple of spare new diesel engines now and store them under the bed until you need them, together with the pots of real paint and other discontinued items. 

[peterboat]

8 minutes ago, system 4-50 said:

There will be a long transition period where you can run existing nasty engines but are not allowed to buy new ones. So buy yourself a couple of spare new diesel engines now and store them under the bed until you need them, together with the pots of real paint and other discontinued items. 

Will you be able to buy the diesel to put in them?

[MtB]

2 hours ago, Murflynn said:

there are 2 other factors that the powers-that-be seem to avoid all the time:

1. the human population is far too high to be sustainable whatever form of fuel we use.

2. our habits of travelling long distances and transporting goods from the other side of the world, or across our own country, need to change.

 

.................  oh, and pray tell me how do we replace hundreds of thousands of jet planes?  I predict that cheap air travel will be hounded out of existence by punitive taxes on the fuel they use.

 

Electric aeroplanes. 

I'll give it a year before a technologically naïve MP says this in all seriousness.

[system 4-50]

6 minutes ago, peterboat said:

Will you be able to buy the diesel to put in them?

Not directly, but you might be able to buy a sheikdom or two quite cheaply on ebay.

[MtB]

A political by-product of the dash for electric cars will be a reduction in the significance to the west of the middle east and their oil reserves.

This could even be the unspoken primary motivator.