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Brexit 2017

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2 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

since a 10% tariff on imported cars

Has that figure been agreed then? Didn`t realize that. Time was that "Jack the lad" wanted to be seen in a Jaguar (then produced in the UK) now with tattoos a BMW is the car of choice. Where did that come from ?? I know that`s only a small % but then reps. seem to have BMWs or Mercs. Me I`m into British classics. They smell good and in my opinion look good. Plus they are fun to drive. Perhaps that`s why I`ve loved canals for over 50 years.

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10 hours ago, Phil. said:

Don't worry, in the event of a Corbyn victory you won't have to advise me to leave I will be off like a shot, or at least my money and assets will. 

You haven't thought that one through, have you?

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3 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

solar panels

Thought that Chinese solar panels had made a number of Chinese billionaires? If that`s the result of a loss leader then let`s get on! Also interesting how they`ve developed in the e-industry. Perhaps it`s time we stepped back and looked at the success stories of others and realized that just joining or remaining in a big club may not be the way forward.

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On the subject of living abroad -which in this case is not directly related to the EU- I have had bitter confrontations with my sister, for whom I have a great deal of affection, over the subject of pensions. She and her British both by birth emigrated to Canada over 40 years ago. They are Canadian citizens but also hold a British passport. Having paid in my sisters case 9 years UK National Insurance and then when asked some years ago did she want to top up her pension contributions said yes to what I feel was a nominal sum and now receives more than my wife who because she was not employed for the 8 years my children were growing up had her rights reduced. She was never given the top up right for some reason.  

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49 minutes ago, jddevel said:

Thought that Chinese solar panels had made a number of Chinese billionaires? If that`s the result of a loss leader then let`s get on! Also interesting how they`ve developed in the e-industry. Perhaps it`s time we stepped back and looked at the success stories of others and realized that just joining or remaining in a big club may not be the way forward.

They are big into electric cars as well [China], an english company has just designed an electric motor within the wheel it is going to be made in China initially but it will allow  cars to be easily retro fitted with electric power

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2 hours ago, Higgs said:

 

It might be worthwhile you checking a few of your own posts. Glass houses, and all that.

I didn't realise I was thereby disqualified from cracking any jokes. Somebody with a greater sense of humour than your good self may have chuckled. 

1 hour ago, jddevel said:

She was never given the top up right for some reason.

That would be "the rules". Whether they were HMRC or EU rules, I suspect it was the former, but the latter will get blamed by some. Take back control...

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2 hours ago, jddevel said:

Has that figure been agreed then? Didn`t realize that. Time was that "Jack the lad" wanted to be seen in a Jaguar (then produced in the UK) now with tattoos a BMW is the car of choice. Where did that come from ?? I know that`s only a small % but then reps. seem to have BMWs or Mercs. Me I`m into British classics. They smell good and in my opinion look good. Plus they are fun to drive. Perhaps that`s why I`ve loved canals for over 50 years.

The 10% figure is the WTO tariff on cars, so yes, we have agreed it, with the WTO (nothing to do with the EU)

Edited by Wanderer Vagabond

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23 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

 (nothing to do with the EU)

We live in hope!!

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I am hoping Donald will do us a no tariff deal replace all those EU cars with nice Yank tanks!! and it would reduce the cost of the spares for my old one:)

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52 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

The 10% figure is the WTO tariff on cars, so yes, we have agreed it, with the WTO (nothing to do with the EU)

WTO tariffs are not compulsory.  The UK could apply a zero tariff on cars, and given our desire for free trade that would be a likely outcome.  However, should the EU impose a 10% tariff on cars imported from the UK, we would reluctantly have to reciprocate but be in no doubt where the blame would be.

The average WTO tariff across ALL goods is 2.3%, but as stated above, none are compulsory.

The whole purpose of WTO tariffs is to ensure fair treatment of all countries.  In the absence of a Free Trade Agreement, neither the EU nor the UK could single each other out for application of a tariff without imposing the same tariff on other countries.

I would hazard a guess the the UK will apply zero tariffs on bananas and oranges, unlike the current EU situation, simply because the UK has no domestic interest in pricing these products up to protect home growers

George

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1 hour ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

The 10% figure is the WTO tariff on cars, so yes, we have agreed it, with the WTO (nothing to do with the EU)

But as a combined figure of both the developed countries and the developing are members of the WTO is huge and they therefore conform to their rules surely the 10% cancels its self out and it`s only innovation and competitiveness that prevails? 

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2 hours ago, furnessvale said:

WTO tariffs are not compulsory.  The UK could apply a zero tariff on cars, and given our desire for free trade that would be a likely outcome.  However, should the EU impose a 10% tariff on cars imported from the UK, we would reluctantly have to reciprocate but be in no doubt where the blame would be.

The average WTO tariff across ALL goods is 2.3%, but as stated above, none are compulsory.

The whole purpose of WTO tariffs is to ensure fair treatment of all countries.  In the absence of a Free Trade Agreement, neither the EU nor the UK could single each other out for application of a tariff without imposing the same tariff on other countries.

I would hazard a guess the the UK will apply zero tariffs on bananas and oranges, unlike the current EU situation, simply because the UK has no domestic interest in pricing these products up to protect home growers

George

I have absolutely no doubt where the blame will lie...... with those who chose to leave the market.:rolleyes:

The EU wouldn't be singling out the UK, they would be applying quite legitimate WTO tariffs unless they choose to give better terms.

I suppose that instead of buying a car I can just get myself all the bananas and oranges I could wish for!

Edited by Wanderer Vagabond

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1 hour ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

I have absolutely no doubt where the blame will lie...... with those who chose to leave the market.:rolleyes:

The EU wouldn't be singling out the UK, they would be applying quite legitimate WTO tariffs unless they choose to give better terms.

I suppose that instead of buying a car I can just get myself all the bananas and oranges I could wish for!

Why would they, there is no benefit to them imposing tariffs.

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2 minutes ago, Phil. said:

Why would they, there is no benefit to them imposing tariffs.

So why do tariffs exist at all then? I would suggest it is probably to give your home market an edge over competition. If tariffs are imposed on car production the incentive would be for manufacturers would be to move production to where no tariffs apply (EU). They may (or may not) leave a rump production line in the UK to serve the UK market tariff free but since our vehicle production is all foreign owned anyway, why would they stay to pay tariffs to export to the EU? Don't believe that just because they have invested here it demonstrates anything since if they close production it would all be written off against tax elsewhere. I note that Vauxhall in Ellesmere Port (now part of French PSA) have already shed 650 jobs since being taken over.Bring in a tariff and pretty much all of the jobs will go to France (such a brilliant idea to sell all of our industry to foreign concerns, don't you think?)

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6 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

So why do tariffs exist at all then? I would suggest it is probably to give your home market an edge over competition. If tariffs are imposed on car production the incentive would be for manufacturers would be to move production to where no tariffs apply (EU). They may (or may not) leave a rump production line in the UK to serve the UK market tariff free but since our vehicle production is all foreign owned anyway, why would they stay to pay tariffs to export to the EU? Don't believe that just because they have invested here it demonstrates anything since if they close production it would all be written off against tax elsewhere. I note that Vauxhall in Ellesmere Port (now part of French PSA) have already shed 650 jobs since being taken over.Bring in a tariff and pretty much all of the jobs will go to France (such a brilliant idea to sell all of our industry to foreign concerns, don't you think?)

Yes but production lines are usually run for one particular model, with other models being made elsewhere. So if tariffs are applied, to the half dozen or so models of various manufacturers that are made here, do you not think that reciprocal tariffs will not be applied by us, to the many other models not made here. I would suspect we import more cars than we export, in which case the tariffs disadvantage the eu more than it does us. So again why would they. The only reason to do this is if the organisation that is the eu want to create problems for us. Whether the individual countries of the eu will let them at the end of the day is debatable. It is the individual countries that will have to explain why their workers are being laid off, not Junker et al.

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14 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

So why do tariffs exist at all then? I would suggest it is probably to give your home market an edge over competition. If tariffs are imposed on car production the incentive would be for manufacturers would be to move production to where no tariffs apply (EU). They may (or may not) leave a rump production line in the UK to serve the UK market tariff free but since our vehicle production is all foreign owned anyway, why would they stay to pay tariffs to export to the EU? Don't believe that just because they have invested here it demonstrates anything since if they close production it would all be written off against tax elsewhere. I note that Vauxhall in Ellesmere Port (now part of French PSA) have already shed 650 jobs since being taken over.Bring in a tariff and pretty much all of the jobs will go to France (such a brilliant idea to sell all of our industry to foreign concerns, don't you think?)

GM american company and been loosing money hand over fist for years suspect they had to sell vauxhall and opel to PSA to get some cash? I had no doubt in my mind when PSA took them over that it was to close them down

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13 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

such a brilliant idea to sell all of our industry to foreign concerns, don't you think?

In the case of Vauxhall Motors, which was acquired by US General Motors leviathan in about 1925, that may not strictly be relevant. GM has a history of flogging off unprofitable plant with conditions attached. They sold Saab in 2011 but wouldn't let the Chinese build the old models, all of which were based on the Vauxhall/Opel platform. Sweden is an EU member ...  

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1 minute ago, Phil. said:

Yes but production lines are usually run for one particular model, with other models being made elsewhere. So if tariffs are applied, to the half dozen or so models of various manufacturers that are made here, do you not think that reciprocal tariffs will not be applied by us, to the many other models not made here. I would suspect we import more cars than we export, in which case the tariffs disadvantage the eu more than it does us. So again why would they. The only reason to do this is if the organisation that is the eu want to create problems for us. Whether the individual countries of the eu will let them at the end of the day is debatable. It is the individual countries that will have to explain why their workers are being laid off, not Junker et al.

Just so I understand this correctly, we put on reciprocal tariffs thereby increasing the cost of imported cars to UK customers and it will disadvantage the EU more than it does us, how does that work?

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2 minutes ago, peterboat said:

M american company and been loosing money hand over fist for year

Anything to do with the Astra being such a crappy little car?

Cars are about 4% of the UK's GNP. I'd be much more worried about aerospace (especially Airbus).

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