White Ensign

[OldGoat]

 

Um, so what about the Cockleshell heroes (canoes launched from a submarine, for a commando raid in France in WW2).

 

And I quite often have a kayak on the roof, does that make me a narrow ship not a narrow boat?

Arrgghh - Perhaps I should have been more pedantic; such boat should be carried externally and ready for instant launch - a lifeboat for instance or the captain's launch.

 

My clarification came straight from the horse's mouth - Rear Admiral xxxx RN (retd:) - contrary to some thought many admirals actually went to sea - in their younger days...

[Captain Pegg]

Arrgghh - Perhaps I should have been more pedantic; such boat should be carried externally and ready for instant launch - a lifeboat for instance or the captain's launch.

 

My clarification came straight from the horse's mouth - Rear Admiral xxxx RN (retd:) - contrary to some thought many admirals actually went to sea - in their younger days...

Now that makes a lot more sense OG.

 

I must admit when I read the original post I thought you were suffering over exposure to the 'Locks... Towing... Etiquette...' thread.

 

JP

[RLWP]

 

How many Station Roads lead to a bus station?

 

Oooh, now - I like that kind of challenge!

 

Richard

[Victor Vectis]

 

 

They are "railway stations", or (if no ambiguity) simply "stations". Bus stations were so named to distinguish them from stations, not the other way around. How many Station Roads lead to a bus station?

Agreed. I loathe 'train station'. It was even used in the Daily Torygraph today, dammit.

 

But, we do have a 'Station Street' here in Ryde that is nowhere near a railway. I think the station referred to is the fire station that used to be there.

[BruceinSanity]

They are "railway stations", or (if no ambiguity) simply "stations". Bus stations were so named to distinguish them from stations, not the other way around. How many Station Roads lead to a bus station?

 

But "station" had a much broader use long before railways: https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/station

 

So I don't think you can claim that "railway/train station" is a retronym necessitated by the appearance of "bus station".

[Mac of Cygnet]

But "station" had a much broader use long before railways: https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/station

 

So I don't think you can claim that "railway/train station" is a retronym necessitated by the appearance of "bus station".

 

Wow! A new word! Is it real?

[Dalesman]

 

I think like many things the term tug boats is one imported from across the pond in recent years. I much prefer just to call tugs..... tugs!

 

As for train station!!!!!

 

Howard

Well where I worked we had tug boats, supply boats, and crew boats and this was not in the USA

[BruceinSanity]

Wow! A new word! Is it real?

Certainly is. A retronym is a word or phrase for some existing object necessitated by the development of modern alternatives. The usual example is "acoustic guitar". Before electric guitars, they were all just guitars. "Landline telephone" would be another example.

[Murflynn]

for many years Dartmouth had a railway station but no rails.

 

how do you explain that?

[Captain Pegg]

for many years Dartmouth had a railway station but no rails.

 

how do you explain that?

I'll hazard a guess it's because it was a ferry terminal and was owned by the GWR?

[Mike Todd]

for many years Dartmouth had a railway station but no rails.

 

how do you explain that?

see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dartmouth_railway_station(we are all trivia cheats now!)

[Captain Pegg]

see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dartmouth_railway_station(we are all trivia cheats now!)

No. Some of us know some sh*t.

[Athy]

What a fabulous bit of information. That, and the addition of "retronym" to my vocabulary, has made my day.

I now have to listen to six CDs of Otis Redding in order to write a review of them. I love Otis Redding, but six CDs of live concert performances is going to test my attention span. I shall endeavour to keep alert by thinking of other examples of retronyms.

[howardang]

Well where I worked we had tug boats, supply boats, and crew boats and this was not in the USA

 

I agree, it just grates on me but I know it is illogical because I sometimes use the name supply boats, but tug boat just sound wrong to my old fashioned ear.

 

Howard

Edited December 8, 2016 by howardang

[Athy]

 

I agree, it just grates on me but I know it is illogical because I sometimes use the name supply boats, but tug boat just sound wrong to my old fashioned ear it just sounds wrong.

 

Howard

It was in common use as far back as 1933, though in American English.

[Tam & Di]

I guess it depends upon context, but I think if you said something like "I saw a tug yesterday" to the man on the Clapham omnibus he would know you were talking of some craft that towed another. Similarly if you said "I'll meet you at the station" he would assume (all other things being equal) that you meant the place where trains stop.

[Tam & Di]

 

Wow! A new word! Is it real?

 

I was looking into flag history for another reason and came across the word vexillogist that was new to me. It was in the context of whether or not one could properly use the term Union Jack if the flag was not flown on the jack staff, and I took it to be another word for a pedant . It was not in my Shorter English Dictionary, but the internet informs me that: Vexillology is the scientific study of the history, symbolism and usage of flags or, by extension, any interest in flags in general. The word is a synthesis of the Latin word vexillum ("flag") and the Greek suffix -logia ("study.")

 

This thread could reasonably be renamed the vexillology thread I guess.

[Athy]

 

 

 

This thread could reasonably be renamed the vexillology thread I guess.

That could revive it if interest starts to flag, yes.

[Machpoint005]

But "station" had a much broader use long before railways: https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/station

 

So I don't think you can claim that "railway/train station" is a retronym necessitated by the appearance of "bus station".

 

Oh, but I think I can. Road transport before railways had staging posts, stages, and inns, but not stations. Bus stations came after (railway) stations.

I wasn't suggesting that the original use of the word was on the railway as that would be expressing ideas well above my station!

 

(and thanks for 'Gare SNCF', Athy -- I'd forgotten that one. I maintain that yer average Frenchman would still associate la gare with the railway without being told, though!).

 

 

 

(edited for gender)

Edited December 8, 2016 by Machpoint005

[Athy]

 

 

(and thanks for 'Gare SNCF', Athy -- I'd forgotten that one. I maintain that yer average Frenchman would still associate la gare with the railway without being told, though!).

 

 

 

(edited for gender)

...and you would be absolutely right. Not sure of the wisdom of editing your gender, though.

[Tam & Di]

...and you would be absolutely right. Not sure of the wisdom of editing your gender, though.

 

Back in the late 50s when there was still National Service a friend, dressed in his army uniform, was dashing around Paris trying to find a station. Unfortunately his accent left something to be desired and he was pronouncing "gare" as it might sound as an English word i.e. similar to "care". To a Frenchman it sounded as if he was seeking "la guerre", and he couldn't understand the reaction he got it until it was explained that they thought he was looking for the war.

[Athy]

 

Back in the late 50s when there was still National Service a friend, dressed in his army uniform, was dashing around Paris trying to find a station. Unfortunately his accent left something to be desired and he was pronouncing "gare" as it might sound as an English word i.e. similar to "care". To a Frenchman it sounded as if he was seeking "la guerre", and he couldn't understand the reaction he got it until it was explained that they thought he was looking for the war.

Good story; just to confuse the enemy, their metro stations are "stations", not "gares".

 

Mrs. Athy, not a French specialist, once asked for a packet of fags in a tabac on the Rue de Rivoli and was offered a telephone card. She has never been confident about asking for goods in French shops ever since.

[WotEver]

Mrs. Athy, not a French specialist, once asked for a packet of fags in a tabac on the Rue de Rivoli and was offered a telephone card. She has never been confident about asking for goods in French shops ever since.

 

Ahh, but the Parisiennes are a snobby lot. My French is poor but I've always been told my accent is good but in a Tabac in Paris I struggled to be understood when I asked for "Un paquet de Marlboro s'il vous plaît". I had no such problems in a little village down south.

[Tam & Di]

To wander yet further I used to smoke roll-ups, and I realised that when we were boating and coming towards something that would eventually require some reaction I would immediately reach for the tobacco tin. Much later as a barging school I used to explain to trainees that it was a mistake to see a potential problem in the distance and react too early. I'd tell them that rather than immediately slowing right down it would be better to roll a fag, and then by the time they'd lit up it was either time to deal with the problem or it had gone away. Telling our first trainees from the US to roll a fag did get me a funny look though.

[WotEver]

Telling our first trainees from the US to roll a fag did get me a funny look though.

 

Telling them to take a drag on one confuses them totally. Then suggest that they have spotted dick for pudding.