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another battery question - sorry


hackenbush

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apologies for my complete ignorance...



I'm deeply concerned! I've lost power from my one leisure battery and hoping I haven't killed it. I've only been using a couple of led lights and water pump, all quite sparingly so thought that running the engine in neutral every couple of days for an hour should keep them charged. I've been doing this "blind" though as I haven't had a way of monitoring. However the lights went out this morning.



I bought one of these today: http://www.maplin.co...ultimeter-uz82d mainly because my budget is almost non-existent right now. Is this going to help me get some idea of the trouble I'm in?


or should I exchange it for one of these?: http://www.maplin.co...r-checker-fu00a



I will read all the info on how to maintain the batteries but my main issue is to get the lights back on by tomorrow evening


It sounds like running in neutral is not the answer or am I confused?


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Neither will do the job you want them too. The meter you have is difficult/impossible to read to 0.1 volts when set to measure a 12V system. The second is worse in only having LEDs.

 

You need a digital clamp type multimeter that measures DC Amps using the clamp. Probably £30 to £50 from Maplin, cheaper from Ebay.

 

For now start the engine and set to about 1500 RPM (will do for most engines) and run like that for two hours. Set the revs back to about 1000 RPM for the rest of the day.

 

You say that you charged in neutral but do not give any revs. If it was on idle then you never produced a meaningful charge. You may have a button to push in, a button to pull out or the whole handle pulls out on the control to allow you to rev the engine in neutral.

 

Do this every day until you get a suitable meter or at least once a week but you need revs for daily two hour charges.

 

Once you get the meter measure the battery voltage first thing in the morning when you get up with nothing electrical running. When it drops to 12.2 volts it is vital that you recharge the batteries if you want a decent battery life. Change the meter to read DC Amps and clamp around a domestic battery cable well away from any others. Keep charging until the meter stops falling and fails to fall over a further hour.

 

It may be too late, you may have sulphated and thus wrecked the battery.

 

Edited to correct some spellings

Edited by Tony Brooks
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Neither will do the job you ant them too. The meter you have is difficult/impossible to read to 0.1 volts when set to measure a 12V system. The second is worse in only having LEDs.

 

You need a digital clamp type multimeter that measures DC Amps using the clamp. probably £30 to £50 from Maplin, cheaper from Ebay.

 

For now start the engine and set to abut 1500 RPM (will do for most engines) and run like that for two hours. Set the revs back to about 1000 RPM for the rest of the day.

 

You say that you charged in neutral but do not give an revs. If it was on idle then you never produced a meaningful charge.

Thanks for the very instructive reply. I switched on the engine and revved it and the galley light I'd accidentally left in the on position instantly flicked on. I'm guessing that's a good sign that the battery isn't shot.

I'm not sure of the revs but I have the handle at a right angle...

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Thanks for the very instructive reply. I switched on the engine and revved it and the galley light I'd accidentally left in the on position instantly flicked on. I'm guessing that's a good sign that the battery isn't shot.

I'm not sure of the revs but I have the handle at a right angle...

No, that's a good sign that you're charging system is working. You're battery may still be shot.

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I don't know much about electrics despite having A level Physics and thus some grip on the theory.

 

However I was with hackenbush for his trip last month from March to Denham, so I know what was on his boat then and can maybe offer some ideas.

There was only one (new) leisure battery, but room in the box for another which he can't yet afford. The old leisure battery which he'd used moving from Cambridge to March was not thought to be in good shape, but we put it in the cratch and used it to power the tunnel light, which lasted through Blisworth tunnel without obviously fading. He also has a starter battery (thought to be OK) which is isolated overnight. We were doing ten hour days, which presumably kept the batteries well charged, and indeed found that the lights were fine. But for the last four weeks he won't have taken the boat far.

 

Until he earns some more money and/or gets some back from the surveyor who said the boat's leaky hull (since mended) was fine, he's got to keep his spending to a minimum and manage with what he's got. Fortunately his electricity use is very low, just some LED lights and the little fluorescent tube in the galley if he leaves his 12V fridge off for the winter.

 

He's got two solar panels which work but need to be connected up, and although there won't be much sunshine available for months I said I'd see getting those connected as a priority as soon as the money is available to do so. After that, either the second battery or the right equipment to measure what's going on would seem to be the next purchase.

 

So meanwhile hang in there please; I recommend you do the job to get hold of some money, hound the dodgy surveyor, move enough to keep CRT happy, keep electricity use to a minimum, and build up your understanding of meters and the right way to use the engine to recharge. Things should get better in the Spring...

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I don't know much about electrics despite having A level Physics and thus some grip on the theory.

 

However I was with hackenbush for his trip last month from March to Denham, so I know what was on his boat then and can maybe offer some ideas.

There was only one (new) leisure battery, but room in the box for another which he can't yet afford. The old leisure battery which he'd used moving from Cambridge to March was not thought to be in good shape, but we put it in the cratch and used it to power the tunnel light, which lasted through Blisworth tunnel without obviously fading. He also has a starter battery (thought to be OK) which is isolated overnight. We were doing ten hour days, which presumably kept the batteries well charged, and indeed found that the lights were fine. But for the last four weeks he won't have taken the boat far.

 

Until he earns some more money and/or gets some back from the surveyor who said the boat's leaky hull (since mended) was fine, he's got to keep his spending to a minimum and manage with what he's got. Fortunately his electricity use is very low, just some LED lights and the little fluorescent tube in the galley if he leaves his 12V fridge off for the winter.

 

He's got two solar panels which work but need to be connected up, and although there won't be much sunshine available for months I said I'd see getting those connected as a priority as soon as the money is available to do so. After that, either the second battery or the right equipment to measure what's going on would seem to be the next purchase.

 

So meanwhile hang in there please; I recommend you do the job to get hold of some money, hound the dodgy surveyor, move enough to keep CRT happy, keep electricity use to a minimum, and build up your understanding of meters and the right way to use the engine to recharge. Things should get better in the Spring...

Agree, getting the solar connected should be high on his list, especially if he already has all the bits there to do it. As a popular supermarket like to say "every little helps"

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You won't know about the battery until tomorrow morning but even then if you do not charge it for long enough today a flat battery tonight or tomorrow may just mean that you did not charge it enough today.

I've been charging every day since. So far so good

I don't know much about electrics despite having A level Physics and thus some grip on the theory.

 

However I was with hackenbush for his trip last month from March to Denham, so I know what was on his boat then and can maybe offer some ideas.

There was only one (new) leisure battery, but room in the box for another which he can't yet afford. The old leisure battery which he'd used moving from Cambridge to March was not thought to be in good shape, but we put it in the cratch and used it to power the tunnel light, which lasted through Blisworth tunnel without obviously fading. He also has a starter battery (thought to be OK) which is isolated overnight. We were doing ten hour days, which presumably kept the batteries well charged, and indeed found that the lights were fine. But for the last four weeks he won't have taken the boat far.

 

Until he earns some more money and/or gets some back from the surveyor who said the boat's leaky hull (since mended) was fine, he's got to keep his spending to a minimum and manage with what he's got. Fortunately his electricity use is very low, just some LED lights and the little fluorescent tube in the galley if he leaves his 12V fridge off for the winter.

 

He's got two solar panels which work but need to be connected up, and although there won't be much sunshine available for months I said I'd see getting those connected as a priority as soon as the money is available to do so. After that, either the second battery or the right equipment to measure what's going on would seem to be the next purchase.

 

So meanwhile hang in there please; I recommend you do the job to get hold of some money, hound the dodgy surveyor, move enough to keep CRT happy, keep electricity use to a minimum, and build up your understanding of meters and the right way to use the engine to recharge. Things should get better in the Spring...

Yes, Peter, solar panels are top of priority list. And a way of monitoring battery life and amp usage. It will definitely be more cost effective than having to constantly run the engine.

At the present time I'm sitting on the deck as the co2 alarm is sounding. You have any knowledge of such matters?!

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Why do people keep having this dig at posters? as Spadefoot said, you all know what the poster meant. We know its wrong,

You know that nobody is ever allowed to have a fat finger moment, a senior moment, or a dodgy auto correct or any combination of these, we all have to be perfectly correct all of the time even though the world knows exactly what is meant.

Phil

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I have just installed this and for the price it works very well, it only shows discharge current unfortunately.

Which is of very little use. Wire the meter the other way round so that it shows charge current and it will be far more informative.

http://thunderboat.boards.net/thread/817/battery-charging-primer

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You know that nobody is ever allowed to have a fat finger moment, a senior moment, or a dodgy auto correct or any combination of these, we all have to be perfectly correct all of the time even though the world knows exactly what is meant.

Phil

perhaps you do not belong to the generation that received a clip round the ear every time they made a stoopid mistake in physics class.

 

I do, and as a result a mistake like CO2 or amps per hour must be like heresy to a devout Christian (I say must be 'cos I ain't one rolleyes.gif ).

 

my (least) favourite one, often repeated on Quest Channel is 'capable of generating 500 megawatts per day'.

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Are you really sure that you have read the instructions, installed and operated that Drok meter correctly? Something that only reads current one way is spectacularly useless on a boat where the balancing act is to monitor current in and out of the battery ant to keep the battery charged.

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Having now looked at the link I'm not convinced that it can show bI-directional current. It appears to be more of a load meter which, on its own, is of singularly little use on a boat.

 

If it wouldn't blow up with the shunt wires reversed (a supplier contact would be required to confirm this) then it could be useful as I stated originally to show charge current.

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Having now looked at the link I'm not convinced that it can show bI-directional current. It appears to be more of a load meter which, on its own, is of singularly little use on a boat.

 

If it wouldn't blow up with the shunt wires reversed (a supplier contact would be required to confirm this) then it could be useful as I stated originally to show charge current.

 

 

In which case two could be installed in series, with one fitted backwards, to get current measuring in both directions. And still have change from £30. And I recently stumped up £130 for a Victron MBV not having noticed theses devices on ebay....!

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