Foxton. Grrrrrrrrr.

[nicknorman]

We arrived at the bottom of Foxton at 14:30. Stated closing time is 16:00. No boats waiting to go up. I walked up the flight to find the lockie who told me that we were too late to get up tonight, since there were 4 boats coming. I argued the toss of course, and spoke to the "manager". I pointed out that since the first boat down was only 1/2 way down the first flight, we could come up the lower flight and, if they waited about 15 mins, we could pass in the middle and everybody would get through. That was dismissed out of hand. So now we're stuck at the bottom for the next 18 hours or so. Grrrrr!

 

Ok there are worse places to be stuck and if there was a lock failure it would be unavoidable. But it is a human problem caused by stupid people with a tiny bit of power. It is a nice sunny day, you'd think that a volocky or two wouldn't mind staying on for 15mins and of course it's 1/2 term so lots of gongoozlers. Why the flight has to be locked at 16:00 on a lovely day, espcapes me. (Yes they do lock it, I checked. I asked why they locked it when they didn't lock Watford, Bratch etc, got the usual patronising answer that it was to protect us from ourselves etc). Grrrrr. Jeff has to be at Long Buckby to get a train to London on Friday morning so now to going to be a rush instead of a relaxing trip.

[Guest]

Can you imagine them telling that to a working boat skipper in days gone by.

 

I suspect he would be in the drink....

[Machpoint005]

Just out of interest -- is there a posted "last passage to commence by..." time?

I would have thought 14:30 was early enough to guarantee a transit.

[Guest]

Just out of interest -- is there a posted "last passage to commence by..." time?

I would have thought 14:30 was early enough to guarantee a transit.

 

Not if you wait for all the boats coming down the whole flight before you start the ascent I wouldn't have thought.

 

I always understood the purpose of the small 'pound' part way up/down the flight was to allow boats to pass.

[Machpoint005]

 

Not if you wait for all the boats coming down the whole flight before you start the ascent I wouldn't have thought.

 

I always understood the purpose of the small 'pound' part way up/down the flight was to allow boats to pass.

 

Coming down one boat to a flight, or more than one at a time?

[Guest]

 

Coming down one boat to a flight, or more than one at a time?

 

I may have read Nicks post incorrectly regarding the Lockie's intentions but it should be possible for Nick to pass the first boat coming down and the second assuming that is following in the centre pound.

 

Then let Nick up the second part of the flight.

 

The locky seems to be saying these boast were here at the top first so they have to come all the way down before you can go up,

[nicknorman]

I may have read Nicks post incorrectly regarding the Lockie's intentions but it should be possible for Nick to pass the first boat coming down and the second assuming that is following in the centre pound.

 

Then let Nick up the second part of the flight.

 

The locky seems to be saying these boast were here at the top first so they have to come all the way down before you can go up,

Exactly. We could have come up the first 5 and waited for the downgoing boats to pass, then ascended the 2nd 5 whilst the last boat down went down the bottom 5. Since the first boat down was in the middle lock of the 5 they would have had to wait 2 locks worth whilst we ascended, surely no more than 10 or 15 mins (allowing for us to drain the full bottom lock before entry). Transitting the whole flight takes 45 mins which is of course 4.5 mins per lock.

 

The last boat came out at 15:35, they locked the flight and went home. If I had been allowed to follow my plan we'd have all been out by 16:00.

Just out of interest -- is there a posted "last passage to commence by..." time?

I would have thought 14:30 was early enough to guarantee a transit.

Yes, last boat in at 15:15. But that is no use if you aren't allowed in! There is no "last boat to request transit" so the "last boat in" times is in no way helpful to the boater, it merely gives CRT justification for denying passage.

[Split Pin]

Just downloaded a boaters guide and this information is copied from itFoxton Locks

 

Winter opening times for 2016/17,

Opening Times(19Sep16-16Mar17):
Foxton Locks Winter opening times for 2016/17 have been confirmed.
19 September 2016- 23 October 2016 Mon- Thurs, 8:00am to 4:00pm (last boat in 3:15pm)

Fri- Sun, 9:00am to 5:00pm (last boat in 4:15pm)
24 October 2016;-16 March 2017 Mon - Thurs, 9:00am to 3:30pm (last boat in 2:45pm) Fri-Sun, 9:00am to 3:30pm(last boat in 2:45pm)
As locks can be very busy, please allow yourself plenty of time to ensure passage It takes approximately 45minutesto pass through the flight and you must
be through the flight byt he time of closure. Last boat will be allowed through the lock 45 minutes prior to closure

Just downloaded a boater guide and theses are from it.

 

Seems to me that they decided not to allow anyone to start up despite the fact that they could have passed in the middle and still made it out before closing time.

 

Steve

[Neil2]

 

We arrived at the bottom of Foxton at 14:30. Stated closing time is 16:00. No boats waiting to go up. I walked up the flight to find the lockie who told me that we were too late to get up tonight, since there were 4 boats coming. I argued the toss of course, and spoke to the "manager". I pointed out that since the first boat down was only 1/2 way down the first flight, we could come up the lower flight and, if they waited about 15 mins, we could pass in the middle and everybody would get through. That was dismissed out of hand. So now we're stuck at the bottom for the next 18 hours or so. Grrrrr!

Ok there are worse places to be stuck and if there was a lock failure it would be unavoidable. But it is a human problem caused by stupid people with a tiny bit of power. It is a nice sunny day, you'd think that a volocky or two wouldn't mind staying on for 15mins and of course it's 1/2 term so lots of gongoozlers. Why the flight has to be locked at 16:00 on a lovely day, espcapes me. (Yes they do lock it, I checked. I asked why they locked it when they didn't lock Watford, Bratch etc, got the usual patronising answer that it was to protect us from ourselves etc). Grrrrr. Jeff has to be at Long Buckby to get a train to London on Friday morning so now to going to be a rush instead of a relaxing trip.

 

I thought the Watford flight was locked outside hours of operation?

Edited October 18, 2016 by Neil2

[nicknorman]

I thought the Watford flight was locked outside hours of operation?

Apparently not.

[john6767]

If that had happened to me I would not have been happy I know that, so I share your frustration. It is annoying when people just make up their own rules to suite themselves. It is not as though they do not regularly cross a boat going in the opposite direction in the middle pound.

[nicknorman]

Jeff has just walked up the flight. There is a CRT workboat in the upper flight doing some maintenance. I guess that's the real reason why they didn't want us to come up, it would have delayed them starting their work and they'd have got to go home 20 minutes later than they will now do.

[matty40s]

If you need Jeff picking up and taking to station, let me know

. No need to rush

[nicknorman]

If you need Jeff picking up and taking to station, let me know

. No need to rush

That's very kind Matty, thanks. We have 2 days to do the trip so that should be OK except that I can see the same scenario arising when we get to Watford, although if they do indeed not lock the flight we'll come down after hours. So I probably won't know if we'll need your help until Thurs evening. Would you care to PM me a mobile number? How far away are you?

[lydfordcastle]

Amazingly exactly the same thing happened to me about 20 odd years ago but I experienced the added difficulty of having to wheel two severely disabled passengers down the flight for their dinner and then back up again afterwards. Despite my entreaties the husband and wife lockie team would not budge ; this was before volockies and before the footpath was as wheelchair friendly as it is now.

So when I returned home I went into print to BW which I gather quite a number of other boaters had already done, and the lockie team didn't work for BW much longer after that.

[Joe the plumber]

The amusing bit will be tomorrow morning when, if you get the same lock keeper at the top cottage we did two weeks ago on the Wednesday morning, it's the first to speak to him who is first into the locks, regardless of who has been waiting at the locks for the longest.

 

We moored up right next to the top lock as we'd just missed the 3.15pm cut-off on the Tuesday, but then had to wait for a boat moored the other side of Bridge 60 to go past us as the skipper was the first one onto the lock keeper's list. We were also going to have to wait for the boat moored behind us who were second onto the list, but Mrs JtP made her feelings of disappointment known to them and they let us go first.

 

In future (and of absolutely no help to you I'm afraid Nick), even if we're first in the 'night before' queue there, we're going to go for a walk first thing in the morning until about 10am, and then just join whatever queue has formed. Our experience the other week briefly made us cross, and that wasn't what we'd gone on holiday to do.

 

Mind you, pop to Bridge 61 tonight for a few, and have one of the smashing sausage and egg cobs from the Top Lock Cafe tomorrow morning, and all will be right with the world!

[matty40s]

That's very kind Matty, thanks. We have 2 days to do the trip so that should be OK except that I can see the same scenario arising when we get to Watford, although if they do indeed not lock the flight we'll come down after hours. So I probably won't know if we'll need your help until Thurs evening. Would you care to PM me a mobile number? How far away are you?

Will do.

Watford is definitely left open , very useful it has proved this year or me.

[adam1uk]

That's very kind Matty, thanks. We have 2 days to do the trip so that should be OK except that I can see the same scenario arising when we get to Watford, although if they do indeed not lock the flight we'll come down after hours. So I probably won't know if we'll need your help until Thurs evening. Would you care to PM me a mobile number? How far away are you?

 

Watford is left unlocked these days, so you can go through whenever you like.

[adam1uk]

Foxton was an utter shambles when we went down in September. Arriving at the top, I went to speak to the lock keeper, who said the lockie in charge was at the bottom -- so he radioed down to him so we were in the book. The lockie at the top said there were three boats coming up, and then we were third in the queue at the top.

 

When the uphill boats had all ascended, the lock keeper waved the first boat into the top lock. I was just about to close the gate, when the lockie at the bottom radioed up to say there was another boat on the way up. The top lock keeper told him he'd already got a boat in the lock, and maybe it could be allowed down to the middle. The bottom lock keeper said that wasn't possible. The boat in the top lock had to reverse out; as the queue had all shuffled up, there was nowhere for it to wait, so it came alongside us, and we all waited for the best part of an hour.

 

When the uphill boat has ascended, we all started off down hill. When the first boat was almost at the middle, the bottom lock keeper asked them to wait in the last lock of the top staircase, as he'd let another one come up! He'd apparently believed the crew knew what they were doing and would quickly reach the waiting point in the middle -- even though it was a Canal Boat Club out of Market Harborough, who'd never done a lock before.

 

So all of us in the upper staircase had to wait. There was a boat in each of the five locks.

 

When the uphill boat arrived at the middle, the lock keeper was with it -- and watched as they closed the top gate behind them. It was only after the crew of the first downhill boat waved and shouted that he realised it would be a good idea for the gate to be open.

 

When it was our turn to empty the fifth lock, I waited ages for the lock keeper to raise the red paddle (which is across the other side of the middle pound). I then lifted the white paddle. The lock keeper screamed at me to drop it, which I did, thinking there must be some sort of emergency. About ten seconds later, he whistled his approval to lift the paddle again. When we finally got down there, I told him that I did not expect to be yelled at in such a matter UNLESS there was an emergency -- which there clearly hadn't been.

 

I got the impression that the so-called lead volunteer lock keeper was completely out of his depth, didn't really understand what was going on, and just liked the power to order people about. Notably, the other volunteers around appeared to have no respect for him either.

[nicknorman]

I fired off an email of complaint to CRT (SE region). I got a quick reply from Vicky Martin's deputy (she's "out of office") saying it was being looked into. The Foxton "manager" Mark has just been to see me on the boat, we had a long chat and I must say he is pretty good at placating the irate customer. It was all about his desire to get the lock gate repaired without having a stoppage. He was pretty reasonable and apologetic about it and we went on to have a long chat about the volunteers. He said we would be first in tomorrow and that he would open up at 8am if that would help. He obviously didn't realise that us and early mornings don't fit well together!

 

So all credit to CRT for handling my complaint.

 

I'd say that if anyone has a problem with a volockie on the flight they should speak to Mark as he is pleasant and sensible.

[The Lockie]

I thought the volockies were there to assist if required? Is it different at Foxton? Dont like the idea of volunteers "in charge".

 

I certainly wouldn't countenance one shouting orders to me in " my" lock

[nicknorman]

I thought the volockies were there to assist if required? Is it different at Foxton? Dont like the idea of volunteers "in charge".

I certainly wouldn't countenance one shouting orders to me in " my" lock

Well according to Mark (who is a "proper" employed lockie) that's correct. I guess it's slightly different at a place like Foxton because someone needs to be "in charge" of the queuing process / who's next. He also said that volockies were taught to only shout at boaters if life was in danger, but he also went on to say that just like any walk of life there are some good volockies and some bad ones, fortunately the latter well in the minority.

[The Lockie]

They either need more training to work it properly or do the sensible thing and get full time paid last lockstaff. Its a shame though that it cant be left to the boaters, but thats a whole different issue,it saddens me how some supposedly experienced boaters have such little motivation to learn how to do things properly. Just a general observation nick not meant as a slight on your skills!!

[FadeToScarlet]

Can you imagine them telling that to a working boat skipper in days gone by.

 

I suspect he would be in the drink....

Unlikely, as striking an employee of the canal company wouldn't go down well.

 

But they would likely, from what I've read, tie the boat up in the lock mouth, to ensure they'd be first through in the morning.

[Guest]

Unlikely, as striking an employee of the canal company wouldn't go down well.

But they would likely, from what I've read, tie the boat up in the lock mouth, to ensure they'd be first through in the morning.

Indeed, it wasn't an entirely serious suggestion TBH.