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Right, thanks for that Martin, I'll do that next time I want to refer to an old Topic.

I haven't really got the hang of working computers yet, . . . . much better with stuff that runs on paraffin.

Hi Tony,

I have now acquired a 14kg Danforth anchor and 2 150n automatic lifejackets - what type and length of chain/rope do you advise I appreciate weight is good BUT my wife and I do also need to be able to lift it to deploy it and that is a concern due to age/and the usual infirmity issues/hips/knees/backs etc. The boat is 55ft and we do have a small chuckable grappling anchor already.

Edited by Halsey
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Hi Tony,

I have now acquired a 14kg Danforth anchor and 2 150n automatic lifejackets - what type and length of chain/rope do you advise I appreciate weight is good BUT my wife and I do also need to be able to lift it to deploy it and that is a concern due to age/and the usual infirmity issues/hips/knees/backs etc. The boat is 55ft and we do have a small chuckable grappling anchor already.

 

My experience and knowledge with regard to ground tackle is mainly from much larger commercial vessels, and invariably limited to using whatever the vessel I happened to be on at the time had been equipped with, so I'm not really the best one to ask.

Bearing in mind that your ground tackle needs to be adequate to satisfy your Insurers as well as being adequate for wherever you're going, you would get better info. from forum member Alan de Enfield than me with regard to chain/rope sizes etc. There are several topics, including a recent one, in which Alan has posted a lot of very sound advice, including recommendations from 'official' bodies.

I'm a bit short of time right now, but I will come back, probably tonight, with some thoughts and suggestions on how you can best rig-up the ground tackle for easiest and most effective use if needed.

Edited by Tony Dunkley
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All done now - as running out of time for deliveries before we leave - 30m new 12mm nylon rope, a "used" 14kg Danforth anchor and 5m of new 12mm galvanised anchor chain and 2 150n automatic lifejackets - total cost £200 incl delivery and collection petrol - not too bad for my peace of mind.

Thanks to all contributors,the wider internet and of course - my good friend eBay!

 

BFN

Edited by Halsey
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All done now - as running out of time for deliveries before we leave - 30m new 12mm nylon rope, a "used" 14kg Danforth anchor and 5m of new 12mm galvanised anchor chain and 2 150n automatic lifejackets - total cost £200 incl delivery and collection petrol - not too bad for my peace of mind.

Thanks to all contributors,the wider internet and of course - my good friend eBay!

 

BFN

A bit late now but we were recommended to get a 20kg jobby for a 60ft NB BUT it was very heavy for somebody like my wife to lift should she ever have had to on her own, so something lighter might have been a better idea.

 

??

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14Kg anchor is a bit 'light', but in normal conditions the Trent is not particularly fast flowing.

 

Mostly the Trent seems to be from 6 feet to 20 feet deep. The tidal section will vary depending on the size and state of the tide.

With 100% chain you should have 3x water depth so something like 20 metres of chain.

If using chain and rope then 7x depth is ideal so with your 5 metres of chain your chain + rope will be sufficient, particularly as Nylon rope does have a 'spring / stretch' effect that is good for anchoring.

 

Make sure that the chain is connected to the anchor with a moused shackle

Ensure your rope is well spliced onto the chain

Ensure the bitter-end (the 'loose end') of the rope is firmly attached to a strong point on your boat - if you do not have a strong point (the T-Stud is not necessarily strong enough) you can make a bridle to reach two mooring cleats which will help spread the load.

 

In an emergency the anchor and chain/rope MUST NOT be just thrown/kicked overboard as you will just end up with a knotted up heap on the river bed which will do little to arrest your movement.

The anchor, chain/rope should be lowered overboard and 'paid' out as the boat drifts it will lay the chain/rope out perfectly.

 

Act promptly - if there is a problem, don't try and sort it out, deploy your tackle and then try and sort out the problem. If you deploy it early enough there is plenty of time to do it properly and get the desired result - ie, stopping safely and secured.

 

In the event that your anchor is not heavy enough and you are 'dragging' the anchor, get your grapnel anchor, or any other heavy weight, and slide it down the rope to help hold the chain in the horizontal position.

Edited by Alan de Enfield
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If the lifejackets are not 'new' then check when they were last serviced.

The majority of automatic lifejackets use a salt 'tablet' to keep the firing pin away from the gas cylinder - theses tablets dissolve in water and fire off the cylinder inflating the life jacket.

 

The salt tablets have a life of about 2 years as they absorb the moisture in the air and then become useless. They should be replaced every two years unless stored in vacuum storage bags with dessicant crystals, in which case 3 or even 4 years is OK.

 

The gas cylinders should be weighed annually.

 

If they have no service records then you can get service kits on ebay (about £16-£20 a time) and there are simple to follow videos on You Tube.

 

If you have purchased new lifejackets then forget the above.

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If the lifejackets are not 'new' then check when they were last serviced.

The majority of automatic lifejackets use a salt 'tablet' to keep the firing pin away from the gas cylinder - theses tablets dissolve in water and fire off the cylinder inflating the life jacket.

 

The salt tablets have a life of about 2 years as they absorb the moisture in the air and then become useless. They should be replaced every two years unless stored in vacuum storage bags with dessicant crystals, in which case 3 or even 4 years is OK.

 

The gas cylinders should be weighed annually.

 

If they have no service records then you can get service kits on ebay (about £16-£20 a time) and there are simple to follow videos on You Tube.

 

If you have purchased new lifejackets then forget the above.

Life jackets are brand new 2016 direct from the manufacturer - thanks

If the lifejackets are not 'new' then check when they were last serviced.

The majority of automatic lifejackets use a salt 'tablet' to keep the firing pin away from the gas cylinder - theses tablets dissolve in water and fire off the cylinder inflating the life jacket.

 

The salt tablets have a life of about 2 years as they absorb the moisture in the air and then become useless. They should be replaced every two years unless stored in vacuum storage bags with dessicant crystals, in which case 3 or even 4 years is OK.

 

The gas cylinders should be weighed annually.

 

If they have no service records then you can get service kits on ebay (about £16-£20 a time) and there are simple to follow videos on You Tube.

 

If you have purchased new lifejackets then forget the above.

14Kg anchor is a bit 'light', but in normal conditions the Trent is not particularly fast flowing.

 

Mostly the Trent seems to be from 6 feet to 20 feet deep. The tidal section will vary depending on the size and state of the tide.

With 100% chain you should have 3x water depth so something like 20 metres of chain.

If using chain and rope then 7x depth is ideal so with your 5 metres of chain your chain + rope will be sufficient, particularly as Nylon rope does have a 'spring / stretch' effect that is good for anchoring.

 

Make sure that the chain is connected to the anchor with a moused shackle

Ensure your rope is well spliced onto the chain

Ensure the bitter-end (the 'loose end') of the rope is firmly attached to a strong point on your boat - if you do not have a strong point (the T-Stud is not necessarily strong enough) you can make a bridle to reach two mooring cleats which will help spread the load.

 

In an emergency the anchor and chain/rope MUST NOT be just thrown/kicked overboard as you will just end up with a knotted up heap on the river bed which will do little to arrest your movement.

The anchor, chain/rope should be lowered overboard and 'paid' out as the boat drifts it will lay the chain/rope out perfectly.

 

Act promptly - if there is a problem, don't try and sort it out, deploy your tackle and then try and sort out the problem. If you deploy it early enough there is plenty of time to do it properly and get the desired result - ie, stopping safely and secured.

 

In the event that your anchor is not heavy enough and you are 'dragging' the anchor, get your grapnel anchor, or any other heavy weight, and slide it down the rope to help hold the chain in the horizontal position.

Many thanks it's good to have my decisions/actions validated - J

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Life jackets are brand new 2016 direct from the manufacturer - thanks

 

Many thanks it's good to have my decisions/actions validated - J

Just a last question re TIMING of our trip .............. if its possible to answer this, to achieve the most favourable river/tide conditions, is there a time in the late April/early May period that we should avoid??

Edited by Halsey
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Just a last question re TIMING of our trip .............. if its possible to answer this, to achieve the most favourable river/tide conditions, is there a time in the late April/early May period that we should avoid??

 

Not really, it's all down to whether or not there's an exceptionally wet spell at the time.

 

Tide times move on by an approximate average of around half an hour per tide twice each day, so at the time of year you'll be making the short journeys between Torksey and Stockwith, and Stockwith and Keadby there'll always be a daylight tide for your moves.

To avoid any possibility whatsoever of what could be an alarming first time encounter with an Aegre, don't be on the river anywhere between Gainsborough and Keadby at local Low Water, or 'Flood' [which differs greatly from LW time at Hull] during the period from the first to the fourth day after the New and Full Moon.

 

Edit to add:

On big tides [springs] expect Flood [LW] at Keadby around 2 hours before HW at Hull, and at Gainsborough anytime between the time of HW at Hull and 15 to 20 minutes after HW Hull.

Edited by Tony Dunkley
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Full moon is 22nd April so avoid 23rd - 27th April

New moon is the 6th May so avoid 6th - 10th May

 

Neap (small) tides are 30th April, 1st may, 2nd May (4.0 metres on the 1st)

Spring (big) tides are 7th, 8th, 9th May (6.0 metres on the 8th)

 

High water Hull on 1st May is 13:45 hours, and on the 2nd is 15:07 and the 3rd is 16:12 hours. (times are BST)

 

The charts will give you the 'LOCAL' tidal differences (height / times) to Hull, for various parts of the Trent

Edited by Alan de Enfield
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Full moon is 22nd April so avoid 23rd - 27th April

New moon is the 6th May so avoid 6th - 10th May

 

Neap (small) tides are 30th April, 1st may, 2nd May

Spring (big) tides are 7th, 8th, 9th May

 

High water Hull on 1st May is 13:45 hours, and on the 2nd is 15:07 and the 3rd is 16:12 hours. (times are BST)

 

The charts will give you the 'LOCAL' tidal differences (height / times) to Hull, for various parts of the Trent

 

Thanks for putting up those dates and times Alan.

The Tide books that ABP send us got lost in the Post this year, so I'm without one until the replacement arrives.

 

Edit to add:

A bit of extra info. for anyone wanting to avoid the Trent Aegre, and the similar one in the Ouse between Goole and Cawood.

A fairly good, reliable generalization is that you won't get any sort of Aegre at all up the Trent, or the Ouse, unless the tide height difference between LW and HW at Hull is more than 20 feet [6 metres], at which there is the possibility of a very small one, but only if there's no significant amount of 'fresh' in either river.

Edited by Tony Dunkley
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Full moon is 22nd April so avoid 23rd - 27th April

New moon is the 6th May so avoid 6th - 10th May

 

Neap (small) tides are 30th April, 1st may, 2nd May (4.0 metres on the 1st)

Spring (big) tides are 7th, 8th, 9th May (6.0 metres on the 8th)

 

High water Hull on 1st May is 13:45 hours, and on the 2nd is 15:07 and the 3rd is 16:12 hours. (times are BST)

 

The charts will give you the 'LOCAL' tidal differences (height / times) to Hull, for various parts of the Trent

Many thanks for this - it seems to me we that we should concentrate on aiming for neap tides so that's 30 April -2 May incl - when is the next period?

 

I am only really concerned about turning into/against the tide flow and mooring or locking as 18hp driving 20 tons isn't all that powerful albeit driving a 24x20 prop but my DM2 isn't used to flat out use or anything like it.

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Many thanks for this - it seems to me we that we should concentrate on aiming for neap tides so that's 30 April -2 May incl - when is the next period?

 

I am only really concerned about turning into/against the tide flow and mooring or locking as 18hp driving 20 tons isn't all that powerful albeit driving a 24x20 prop but my DM2 isn't used to flat out use or anything like it.

 

Sunday May 15th is next neap, and. is OK for the moon / Aegre.

4.0 metres HW at Hull at 14:10 hours.

 

The day before, or a couple of days after, are still small tides

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Sunday May 15th is next neap, and. is OK for the moon / Aegre.

4.0 metres HW at Hull at 14:10 hours.

 

The day before, or a couple of days after, are still small tides

VERY many thanks - can I assume its a 2 week cycle that I'm keeping an eye on i.e. the next neap period will be around the 29th?

 

The 13/14th looks like the best target for us starting Cromwell to Torksey on the 13/14th then Torksey to West Stockwith 15/16 depending on whether we venture up the Fossdyke or not and then West Stockwith to Keadby on the 16th/17th or 2 weeks later if we go up the Chesterfield - we would like to do the Chesterfield but we are deep drafted (2ft 8ins)so that may not be good for us depending on actual water conditions whenwe get there.

 

All good fun - I certainly feel much better equipped and informed now - thanks to CWDF.

Edited by Halsey
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Mothers maiden name - originates from Hitchin area?

 

 

Ok Thanks. I'll check but I think I may have a distant relative<s> out that way. Just checked.

 

 

Victoria and Susan <sisters> were the only two out that way. I'll pm you if it's something you know about.

Edited by mark99
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VERY many thanks - can I assume its a 2 week cycle that I'm keeping an eye on i.e. the next neap period will be around the 29th?

 

The 13/14th looks like the best target for us starting Cromwell to Torksey on the 13/14th then Torksey to West Stockwith 15/16 depending on whether we venture up the Fossdyke or not and then West Stockwith to Keadby on the 16th/17th or 2 weeks later if we go up the Chesterfield - we would like to do the Chesterfield but we are deep drafted (2ft 8ins)so that may not be good for us depending on actual water conditions whenwe get there.

 

All good fun - I certainly feel much better equipped and informed now - thanks to CWDF.

 

If we happen to get a longish dry spell in late April and early May, then you would be better to do Cromwell to Torksey on bigger tides [springs], ie. a week earlier or later.

If there isn't any 'fresh' in the river, then Neaps can sometimes struggle to make even 3' over the outer cill at Torksey.

 

The Moon's full cycle is about 29 days, ie. full moon to full moon or new moon to new moon, with the first and last quarters [half moon] halfway in between.

The biggest Springs are usually the 3rd, 4th or 5th tide after the new or full moon, and the smallest Neaps the 3rd, 4th or 5th tide after half moon.

 

PS.

Make sure you get a copy of these Trent Boating Association Charts before you go. I've never seen or used them so I don't know much about them other than having seen one or two pages copied in a post on this Forum, but people who do use them seem to get on alright with shallow draughted boats like yours. I would think Alan [de Enfield], or 'Scholar Gypsy' will be able to tell you where to get them from.

Edited by Tony Dunkley
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What would be the best way to deal with the Aegre? My 35 ft boat has a high bow but a small low (. 5m above waterline) cruiser stern. My gut would be to take it head on, would there be time to turn if I saw it coming up behind, I'd imagine side on would be a problem, would stern on be a problem?

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  • 1 month later...

Hi all (esp Alan and Tony),

 

After all that planning "life" has got in the way and we are not now making the journey for domestic (land related reasons)we may do it later in the year on what would then be a return trip going the other way!

 

Thanks for all the help I hope the thread was of use to others.

 

J

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  • 1 year later...

If anyone's interested all the kit mentioned here is now LISTED IN THE FOR SALE SECTION - 2 lifejackets and chain and rope all as new, anchor used but that's not an issue and all bought last year as a result of this thread. Text only please to 07764 186095 is the ONLY way to get me as we are on the boat and moving about (Greater Midlands then Thames then Midlands - June July August respectively) and the phone is generally off during the day.

That's 30m new 12mm nylon rope, a "used" 14kg Danforth anchor, 5m of new 12mmx 78mm galvanised anchor chain with bag and shackles and 2 new "Bluewave" 150n automatic Adult lifejackets (in original packaging) - total cost £200 - £150 wanted no offers  - happy to split the 2 lifejackets from the rest at £75 + £85 (the rest) again no offers please.

BFN

Edited by Halsey
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