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Builder's plates from John Harker Ltd, Knottingley


Giant

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Does anybody have, or has anyone ever seen or photographed, a builder's plate from any vessel built by Harker's?

 

We were told by Steve Waddington that our boat did once had one, but we also know that they were very commonly pilfered.

 

I'd be interested in trying to produce a replica, but I've never seen even an image of an original one. Have you?

 

The yard ran under their ownership for 50 years from 1929 to 1979 and built over 300 boats, mostly Humber barges and tankers, but also other types and even a couple of narrowboats in later years.

 

There is a full list of the vessels they built here, if it jogs any ideas: http://www.knottingley.org/history/harkerbuilt.htm

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  • 2 weeks later...

Does anybody have, or has anyone ever seen or photographed, a builder's plate from any vessel built by Harker's?

 

We were told by Steve Waddington that our boat did once had one, but we also know that they were very commonly pilfered.

 

I'd be interested in trying to produce a replica, but I've never seen even an image of an original one. Have you?

 

The yard ran under their ownership for 50 years from 1929 to 1979 and built over 300 boats, mostly Humber barges and tankers, but also other types and even a couple of narrowboats in later years.

 

There is a full list of the vessels they built here, if it jogs any ideas: http://www.knottingley.org/history/harkerbuilt.htm

I got to talk to the owner of a Harker's narrowboat today. I asked him about builders plates, he has owned the boat since 1970s , he has never seen one. He has moored this boat with us since 1982 and co-incidently another Harker narrowboat was here for many years until late last year. That didn't have a plate either. Both boats are ,to all intents and purposes identical in design. What they lack in style is made up for by having a lot of space inside with a rather boxy cabin. The boats' length is 46ft. Both now have Lister SR2 engines though one(possibly both?) originally had a single cylinder "Kittywake" diesel which was rather underpowered for use on the Yorkshire Ouse where she was in the 70s. The story I was told is: they were built for the company, one for use of the directors and one for the workers. Things didn't go to plan as nobody wanted to use them and they were sold off after a few years. The boat still with us has had a lot of hull repairs done recently and is being re-fitted now,but the departed one was in very poor condition and in fact sank on its way into Manchester. The previous owner sold it as scrap but the new owner was convinced it was repairable- I think it was headed for the L & L canal, I don't know if it ever got there or finished up at Cox & Dank's shipbreakers!

Bill

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  • 6 months later...

An update to this - it seems that they did in fact exist!

 

We have just acquired a copy of "Tankers Knottingley" by Alan H. Faulkner, dated 1976. On page 23 is a large drawing of the builder's plate for MARTINDALE H, reading "Built by John Harker Ltd, Shipbuilders & Engineers, Knottingley Yorks" with the year of build below (1948 for that vessel). Helpfully the dimensions (13.5" x 8") are given in the caption. So we have all we need now to make a replica of the one that GOODWILL would have once had.

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And we've now also turned up this photo of one, from the archives of the Yorkshire Waterways Museum who have a searchable collection on their new website:

 

w04744.jpg

 

This one appears to be of a slightly different earlier design - the caption for it says it reads "John Harker Ltd Shipbuilders 1934 Knottingley"

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And we've now also turned up this photo of one, from the archives of the Yorkshire Waterways Museum who have a searchable collection on their new website:

 

 

 

This one appears to be of a slightly different earlier design - the caption for it says it reads "John Harker Ltd Shipbuilders 1934 Knottingley"

The boat is Thomas, built for Walter Holden of Skipton for the coal traffic from the Barnsley Canal to Barnsey Mill in Barnoldswick. The traffic never started, coal coming from East Lancashire instead.

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The same Thomas that's on the weir at Castleford? - Forever, now they've built their stupid footbridge, and missed the opportunity to get the Thomas off while they were busy.

 

 

David.

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  • 2 months later...

That's really is a very good replica you've made Giant, too bad John Harker won't need them anymore, as he would surely have asked you to supply him with your plates, but there will be other people with John Harker barges that would love to have a plate like that.

 

Peter.

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  • 4 weeks later...

very smart - will be great to see the finished item with pictures of the process - are you casting it in brass / bronze?

 

That was the plan, yes. I don't have the kit to do that bit myself though - the plan is to get the pattern right then take it to someone with a suitable small foundry.

 

This one looks nice but the sheet is too thick really, and results in very deep lettering. I used a bit of plasterboard for the back because it had a good texture, but that's also too thick and would be difficult to cut down nicely. So I think I shall give it another run with some different materials.

 

Another option is to just do the whole thing out of a single acrylic sheet, using the laser to engrave the lettering, but it's tricky to do that to a decent and consistent depth.

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  • 1 year later...

Thanks to Andy Horn, I now have an actual photo of a post-war Harkers plate to work from - this one on the tanker BROCADALE H, built 1961.

harkersplate.jpg.f6fe8fe428fb3c444d8ec398be9ba606.jpg

It looks like they were engraved into thin sheet with a white infill, rather than being the thick cast brass affairs I'd been imagining from the rubbing of MARTINDALE H's plate.

So I have revised my plans - I'm going to engrave the design into some 2mm brass sheet, on a big CNC router table I've recently got fixed up. Looking at the photo, I wonder if the original was bronze rather than brass, but I could believe either. Any guesses?

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  • 1 month later...

Just to clarify on the methods:

When I started this project, I only had a printed copy of a brass rubbing to work from - I thought the original would have been a thick cast brass piece, like the plates I'd seen from Dunstons of Thorne. With that in mind I made a laser cut plastic master (post #11).

Then I saw Andy Horn's photo (post #16) which made it clear the original was engraved in thin sheet brass.

The final piece is not laser cut, but engraved with a CNC router. The delay has been getting this working properly!

This is the job in progress:

DSC_7737.jpg.357a5a140541b2a2f34acd936659c05e.jpg

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