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Boater With Home Mooring Charged With Not Making "Due Progress"


Alan de Enfield

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Sorry - a report from the Dark-Side, I'm sure there is another side to the story but if correct then there could be problems 'all round'

 

A boater who has a fully paid up marina mooring, a licence, a BSS and insurance has had his licence 'removed' because he is 'failing to make due progress'

 

C&RT are now taking him to court for being unlicensed and overstaying

 

Story here :

 

http://www.narrowboatworld.com/index.php/news-flash/6710-confused-leisure-boater

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I'll welcome details about his home mooring - ie is there a gap in a line of moored boats where his space is; or is it a friendly marina manager and a "ghost" mooring, AKA paper mooring ie there is in fact no space there for him and its a mooring of convenience.

 

Or is the place he can keep it, on his driveway 50 miles from the canal?

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I repeat - what is the other side to the story

 

But it appears as if he has no licence because C&RT revoked it for alledgedly " failing to make due progress"

 

I have seen a large number of posts on this forum stating that the difference between CCers and Home Moorers is that the CCer must make a "progressive journey" (or todays equivalent choice of words) whilst a home moorer does not.

 

Paper & Ghost moorings have been discussed but the conclusion was / is that they still comply with the requirements.

How many nights must C&RT observe you on your mooring before it is 'legitimate' ?

 

A boater with a home mooring leaves his marina on a Friday Night, moors up, moves a bit on Saturday, moors up, returns to his mooring on Sunday, and repeats it again (mooring in the same spots) the following weekend - this complies.

 

If he has been overstaying then this is a different matter and sanctions should be taken - however - no doubt someone will claim disability, mental health or family problems as sufficient justification.

Edited by Alan de Enfield
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Paper & Ghost moorings have been discussed but the conclusion was / is that they still comply with the requirements.

How many nights must C&RT observe you on your mooring before it is 'legitimate' ?

 

 

For the sake of clarity, please can you define what you think is a "paper" or "ghost" mooring.

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For the sake of clarity, please can you define what you think is a "paper" or "ghost" mooring.

 

My understanding is :

 

A paid for mooring that is on some remote part of the system ( and / or at a very low price) that the boater does not intend to visit - it does however meet the requirements of being "somewhere where the boat may be left"

 

Alledgedly there are also moorings which are sold a 'number of times' based on the knowledge that they wil not be used.

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According to the story, he "has a home mooring that he chooses not to use". Which does sound a bit like someone renting a cheap mooring somewhere oop north for a few hundred quid a year and then spending your life on visitor moorings in the middle of London - both examples from my imagination, you understand (that's what we generally think of as a paper or ghost mooring, by the way). In which case I can only say good luck to CART because it's a con job, and if you play the system, you can't complain if the system bites back.

 

I mean, why, if you weren't trying to pull a fast one, would you bother renting a mooring you actively didn't want to use? You'd get one which you wanted to use, wouldn't you? Or register as CC.

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My understanding is :

 

A paid for mooring that is on some remote part of the system ( and / or at a very low price) that the boater does not intend to visit - it does however meet the requirements of being "somewhere where the boat may be left"

 

Alledgedly there are also moorings which are sold a 'number of times' based on the knowledge that they wil not be used.

 

I'd say your example #1 isn't a "ghost" mooring as such, in that its a real mooring. #2, where a mooring is sold several times, ie although it may exist in some form, its not allocated too the boat in question, IS a ghost mooring (IMHO). A "paper" mooring is just a play on words of "ghost" mooring. Another example of it might be where a boater takes out a mooring for less than the 12 months of the licence, the mooring agreement expires, but CRT aren't informed of the change so that they effectively are now CCing (because they don't have a home mooring) but they are trying to remain under CRTs radar because the licence conditions relating to not staying more than 14 days in any one place only apply to CCers, not those with a (legitimate) home mooring.

 

I feel its important to understand the difference, since at some point this is going to come down to the black & white of the law.

 

Also, I think its important to get more info on this case and clarify exactly what the arrangements are for this boater's mooring. CRT obviously felt that they weren't satisfied by the arrangement in place.

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To have his licence revoked he must have had a warning in the past so should have no excuse. According to the home mooring rules if you spend all your time away (at a reasonable distance from your home mooring) just moving up and down the same bit of canal you are not compliant with the rules. and in effect should do the same as CC's.

As said above there is more to this story so I for one ain't going to start jumping to conclusions over CaRT's actions. But I do believe that CaRT are going to get tough on boaters if only to set an example so that others wise up and get the right licences and cruise as they should do be it CC'er or from a Home Mooring

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To have his licence revoked he must have had a warning in the past so should have no excuse. According to the home mooring rules if you spend all your time away (at a reasonable distance from your home mooring) just moving up and down the same bit of canal you are not compliant with the rules. and in effect should do the same as CC's.

As said above there is more to this story so I for one ain't going to start jumping to conclusions over CaRT's actions. But I do believe that CaRT are going to get tough on boaters if only to set an example so that others wise up and get the right licences and cruise as they should do be it CC'er or from a Home Mooring

 

Really????? Can you cite a source for this please?

 

I have a home mooring and until now I thought bridge hopping was fine.

 

Thanks.

 

MtB

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Could it be that CRT are arguing that if you are away from a home mooring all the time you are by definition continuously cruising and therefore need to stick to the CCing rules.

 

Unlikely once you apply that theory to the letter of the law. But, anythings possible, and we're all guessing, until hard facts are revealed about this case.

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I think bridge hopping is fine if you have a home mooring, PROVIDED you spend some time on your home mooring!

 

So did I until Pete and Helen's post. But it seems to hinge on spending ALL one's time away from the mooring. But as Paul C says, I think the law only requires one to have a home mooring. I see no obligation to use it in the regulations.

 

MtB

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I can understand the authorities not being happy about someone who pays for a mooring in one place but spends most of their time in a limited area which is not near their mooring - in that case, the home mooring is clearly to 'comply' with the rules rather than somewhere to keep the boat. Whether it's actually against any rules is not for me to judge.

I did briefly venture onto the dark side to skim through their piece, but it was confusing as to whether the 88 occasions recorded were on his paid for mooring, or on the Visitor mooring where it seems he's been spending a lot of time. If the former, I don't see why CRT are upset with him, but if the latter then I entirely understand.

 

Tim

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Really????? Can you cite a source for this please?

 

I have a home mooring and until now I thought bridge hopping was fine.

 

Thanks.

 

MtB

Mike I was looking at the link Jo's post #6 in which the attached document says

 

"I know of boaters who declare a home mooring but never use it – so this is a loophole isn’t it?

Yes and no. If we never observe your boat on the mooring you’ve declared, or we see you repeatedly
on the towpath in an area distant from the declared mooring, we will contact you and ask you to confirm
your mooring status. We may use powers under the data protection legislation to ask the mooring
operator to confirm that you do hold the mooring you’ve declared. But either way, if you never use the
mooring, it amounts to a false declaration which makes the licence invalid. We are just starting to apply
this approach where a ‘ghost’ mooring is suspected."
Edited by Pete & Helen
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Mike I was looking at the link Jo's post #6 in which the attached document says

 

"I know of boaters who declare a home mooring but never use it – so this is a loophole isn’t it?

Yes and no. If we never observe your boat on the mooring you’ve declared, or we see you repeatedly
on the towpath in an area distant from the declared mooring, we will contact you and ask you to confirm
your mooring status. We may use powers under the data protection legislation to ask the mooring
operator to confirm that you do hold the mooring you’ve declared. But either way, if you never use the
mooring, it amounts to a false declaration which makes the licence invalid. We are just starting to apply
this approach where a ‘ghost’ mooring is suspected."

 

 

That would be an interesting court case - C&RT say you must have a place where your boat CAN be stored / moored, but then say you are making a false declaration if you are not using it

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Mike I was looking at the link Jo's post #6 in which the attached document says

 

"I know of boaters who declare a home mooring but never use it – so this is a loophole isn’t it?

Yes and no. If we never observe your boat on the mooring you’ve declared, or we see you repeatedly
on the towpath in an area distant from the declared mooring, we will contact you and ask you to confirm
your mooring status. We may use powers under the data protection legislation to ask the mooring
operator to confirm that you do hold the mooring you’ve declared. But either way, if you never use the
mooring, it amounts to a false declaration which makes the licence invalid. We are just starting to apply
this approach where a ‘ghost’ mooring is suspected."

 

 

Oh yes, thank you.

 

THAT document. A made up Q&A session, was the consensus! Thanks for reminding me, I'd forgotten about it. It was discussed at length on here a year or so back and generally discredited but if CRT are acting on it and succeed, it will be one more method of abuse stopped off.

 

MtB

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