how good is the victron battery monitor?

[vintagescubaman]

i am considering getting a victron battery monitor (the bmv 600s model) i was wondering if anybody had any experience of it, and how it compares to other battery monitors such the smart gauge?

[nb Innisfree]

i am considering getting a victron battery monitor (the bmv 600s model) i was wondering if anybody had any experience of it, and how it compares to other battery monitors such the smart gauge?

 

We have the BMV 501, good ah counter, voltmeter and ammeter but useless as a % meter, like all shunt based monitors it keeps going out of sync.

[vintagescubaman]

now thats interesting, why does it go out of sync, and how would a monitor work without a shunt?

[nb Innisfree]

now thats interesting, why does it go out of sync, and how would a monitor work without a shunt?

 

Long story covered many times on this forum, try the search function for 'smartgauge' or go to the Smartgauge web site, all you need to know is on there.

[andy the hammer]

I have a Victron Battery monitor but it has not been set up,I have pick up the instructions a couple times but thought I will go and get a degree in electronics first as this would be easier.

Should I persist.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[Arnot]

i am considering getting a victron battery monitor (the bmv 600s model) i was wondering if anybody had any experience of it, and how it compares to other battery monitors such the smart gauge?

I work with and install a variety of battery monitoring system on a regular basis, here's my take;

 

I use the BMV-600S a lot, I install many of these every year and maintain the electrical systems on a fleet of special vehicles that use them. They give a lot of useful and accurate information and some not so useful and not so accurate information, as long as you are prepared to accept the limitations of this type of monitor then they are excellent. One of the points missed in most postings on battery monitors is that a major benefit of this device is as a charging system monitor.

 

The current and voltage information is very accurate and very useful if you can interpret it, I find that most boaters stuggle with this a bit at first but learn and really benefit. For some however, it remains a mystery but even for them if they do have a problem, the information I can get from the monitor on their behalf gives invaluable assistance in helping them sort any battery or charging system issues.

 

Installation is as easy as a shunt based monitor could be really but whoever installs it really needs to understand current paths and how to make a good high current connection. The manual is pretty much a disaster, even I struggle with the finer points. If Victron even know of clarity when it comes to instructions they only use the knowledge to avoid it. The primary information such as voltage, current and power consumed are reasonably intuitive but when you go beyond this, unless you have a good understanding of batteries and charging systems it's clear as mud.

 

Gibbo will tell you that the ampere hour counter is useless and the SOC indication is even worse and to an extent he is correct. The AH counter tells you fairly accurately how much power you have used from the highest charged point but since you won't know how much you started with this is of limited benefit. If you know how to read this in the context of the voltage and current information it is useful though. The SOC indication is based on so much guesswork it is really best ignored.

 

If you are relatively technically savvy and can use the extra information it provides, then get one. If what you want is just a clear and accurate indication of the battery SOC then buy a Smartguage.

 

Regards

 

Arnot

[nb Innisfree]

I have a Victron Battery monitor but it has not been set up,I have pick up the instructions a couple times but thought I will go and get a degree in electronics first as this would be easier.

Should I persist.

 

Regards

 

Andy

 

As Gibbo explains on the Smartgauge site the battery capacity among other things has to be entered into the monitor but as the batt capacity cannot be accurately assessed and is constantly reducing so the accuracy of the monitor alters, it's an impossible task. Ok for other readings though such as voltage, amperage and a/h consumption.

[Chris Pink]

As Gibbo explains on the Smartgauge site the battery capacity among other things has to be entered into the monitor but as the batt capacity cannot be accurately assessed and is constantly reducing so the accuracy of the monitor alters, it's an impossible task. Ok for other readings though such as voltage, amperage and a/h consumption.

 

My take on this is yes, the Smartgauge tells you the percentage of capacity you have but tells you nothing about what that capacity is, how many amp hours, or how many hours of laptop before charging is needed. Additionally it reads voltage but not current and in most installations will require a separate ammeter.

 

The Victron SOC reading is inaccurate and misleading because it knows nothing about the rate of charge or discharge, it simply reads amps in, amps out. and counts the time so giving you also amphours in amphours out. . It reads voltage and current so obviating the need for another ammeter.

 

For my purposes the Victron is my choice, and I have tried both, together with voltage readings i can make an assessment of state of charge that is close enough for me, most importantly it tells me how many amp-hours i put in last charge and how many i am using. Over time i have a good feel for efficiency of the charging process (i have two battery banks with different characteristics). SOC can be read to 10% or so by the off-load voltage.

 

I feel the Smartgauge could be the one to go for if, and this is a big if, it related its percentage to a real world AH figure. It is absolutely no use to me at all to tell me my batteries are 80% charged if I don't know what that means in AH. It reminds me of my physics teacher who used to bang on about units "is that 80% of an elephant, Pink?"

[jenlyn]

My take on this is yes, the Smartgauge tells you the percentage of capacity you have but tells you nothing about what that capacity is, how many amp hours, or how many hours of laptop before charging is needed. Additionally it reads voltage but not current and in most installations will require a separate ammeter.

 

The Victron SOC reading is inaccurate and misleading because it knows nothing about the rate of charge or discharge, it simply reads amps in, amps out. and counts the time so giving you also amphours in amphours out. . It reads voltage and current so obviating the need for another ammeter.

 

For my purposes the Victron is my choice, and I have tried both, together with voltage readings i can make an assessment of state of charge that is close enough for me, most importantly it tells me how many amp-hours i put in last charge and how many i am using. Over time i have a good feel for efficiency of the charging process (i have two battery banks with different characteristics). SOC can be read to 10% or so by the off-load voltage.

 

I feel the Smartgauge could be the one to go for if, and this is a big if, it related its percentage to a real world AH figure. It is absolutely no use to me at all to tell me my batteries are 80% charged if I don't know what that means in AH. It reminds me of my physics teacher who used to bang on about units "is that 80% of an elephant, Pink?"

 

i use the victron 600s, i find it really useful, tho as others have said, it has to be synched virtually every time you use it, i did try the sterling meter, it was ok, but not as good as the victron

[smileypete]

i am considering getting a victron battery monitor (the bmv 600s model) i was wondering if anybody had any experience of it, and how it compares to other battery monitors such the smart gauge?

If you have the ££££, go for the Smartgauge.

 

If you plan to live aboard without shoreline, a voltmeter/ammeter/Ah counter can be very useful for monitoring the health of your batts, as Chris Pink says.

 

 

I have a Victron Battery monitor but it has not been set up,I have pick up the instructions a couple times but thought I will go and get a degree in electronics first as this would be easier.

Should I persist.

The SoC (state of charge) feature of an Ah counter is best ignored until comfortable with monitoring charge and discharge using the voltmeter and ammeter:

 

Charging

 

For all lead acid batts in reasonable condition I'd consider them nearly fully charged when the charging current at 'absorption voltage' (usually 14.4V for 12V leisure batts), drops below 2% (one fiftieth) of battery bank capacity.

 

Discharging

 

For nomal 12V leisure batts I'd recharge them when the voltage remains below 12.2V all the time. This needs a bit of caution and experience as the voltage can drop below this under load but bounce back some.

 

Some links about batts:

The Car and Deep Cycle Battery FAQ

Smartgague Technical Information

Tony Brooks Training

 

cheers,

Pete.

[colin stone]

i am considering getting a victron battery monitor (the bmv 600s model) i was wondering if anybody had any experience of it, and how it compares to other battery monitors such the smart gauge?

 

I have the 602 - good at volts, amphours out and amps in and out. SOC on discharge is variable and amphours/SOC when charging is rubbish. Also have a SG/SB combo.

[blackrose]

I have a BEP DC monitor which is a shunt type, similar to the Victron model. I also have a smartgauge. Both are useful in different ways, but if I had to choose I'd go for the smartgauge.

[nb Innisfree]

I have a BEP DC monitor which is a shunt type, similar to the Victron model. I also have a smartgauge. Both are useful in different ways, but if I had to choose I'd go for the smartgauge.

 

Depends, we have batteries which have had less than 50% of their original capacity for the last 18 months or so but keep plodding on, this renders our Smartgauge useless leaving us instead with our BMV.

[blackrose]

Yes in that case I'd use my BEP monitor. I didn't plan on having both but after using the BEP monitor for a while I realised how inaccurate the SoC function was and bought a Smartgauge. I've spent over 300 quid on battery monitors, but I'm not married and don't have kids so I buy presents for my boat!

 

Anyway, if you can afford it you can't beat having both types of monitor.

[Gibbo]

I feel the Smartgauge could be the one to go for if, and this is a big if, it related its percentage to a real world AH figure. It is absolutely no use to me at all to tell me my batteries are 80% charged if I don't know what that means in AH. It reminds me of my physics teacher who used to bang on about units "is that 80% of an elephant, Pink?"

 

I refuse to get dragged into yet another argument so will not respond to any possible reply.

 

But let's get this right....

 

Knowing you have (say) 60% of your battery charge remaining is absolutely no use to you at all but knowing you have used (say) 50 Ahrs, from an unknown battery capacity is useful?

 

The latter is utterly useless.

[Chris Pink]

 

Knowing you have (say) 60% of your battery charge remaining is absolutely no use to you at all but knowing you have used (say) 50 Ahrs, from an unknown battery capacity is useful?

.

 

 

Each to their own. The former is utterly useless to me.

 

A percentage is a ratio, to be meaningful it needs qualifying.

 

Percentages are used to express how large/small one quantity is, relative to another quantity.

(my bold)

[smileypete]

Each to their own. The former is utterly useless to me.

 

A percentage is a ratio, to be meaningful it needs qualifying.

Out of interest, are you keeping tabs on the effective capacity of your two batt banks with your battery monitor?

 

If so, how's it holding up with dual charging/alternate use, are they doing OK?

 

And how does the charge efficiency compare between banks?

 

Sorry for all the questions, just curious.

 

cheers,

Pete.

[Chris Pink]

Out of interest, are you keeping tabs on the effective capacity of your two batt banks with your battery monitor?

 

If so, how's it holding up with dual charging/alternate use, are they doing OK?

 

And how does the charge efficiency compare between banks?

 

Sorry for all the questions, just curious.

 

cheers,

Pete.

 

 

The two banks seem quite stable, I have an 220AH AGM which seemed to have lost 25% of capacity - I estimate around 80AH between fully charged (when i swap the banks after it's been on charge for a week) down to off-load 12.0V . The other bank is 210 AH flooded US2200 which has a small but noticeably improvement on that.

 

My use is a laptop most working days, economic lights and a few other nibbly bits and pieces. It's actually quite difficult to accurately assess in terms of time because I have 120W of solar that is at its peak when I'm working. During the winter it will become a bit clearer. My energy audit works out at 60AH per day on a typical working day with a bit of iPlayer in the evening. The solar panels provided 100% of that up to mid-september, the generator is running 2 hours once every two days at the moment and I run it for 5 hours on a Monday when I swap the banks. One bank, on standby, is always on charge or float through a Sterling 20A charger and the other, in use, is charged by a Mastervolt 35A charger. These 2 and the laptop PSU are almost exactly what my generator, a Honda 10EUi can take.

 

Not sure about efficiency, life is too short for the maths involved, I am always using power when the generator is generating. The battery monitor doesn't give me any accurate info about state of charge, I estimate that from off-load voltage. The capacity idea simply comes from AH out and to me is more of a relative concept, ie I can work 2 days from 2 hours charge on the 35A charger.

 

I could improve the system (and will) by having identical battery types in the two banks. The AGM is 3 years old now so I'm obviously not abusing it too much. It lost a lot of the initial capacity early in life and then settled down, though after 9 months or so I think it got badly sulphated and recovered as when I bought the 2nd bank it seemed to be down to 40AH ish but that was probably down to never getting a proper charge which it does now once every 2 weeks and it much improved. It has a much shorter bulk stage and longer absorbtion stage than the flooded cells.