Rag

[Chertsey]

I've just started making my third rag rug and one thing that strikes me is just how much rag it uses - the equivalent of half a dozen entire items of clothing at least.

 

Where would working boatmen and women have got it from? Not surely just from their own cast-offs, as I imagine they wouldn't have had many clothes in the first place (storage for one thing) and would not have thrown them away lightly - as no one did in those days.

 

And surely you needed a new mop more often than you had an old coat to throw away?

 

So where did it all come from?

[denboy]

I've just started making my third rag rug and one thing that strikes me is just how much rag it uses - the equivalent of half a dozen entire items of clothing at least.

 

Where would working boatmen and women have got it from? Not surely just from their own cast-offs, as I imagine they wouldn't have had many clothes in the first place (storage for one thing) and would not have thrown them away lightly - as no one did in those days.

 

And surely you needed a new mop more often than you had an old coat to throw away?

 

So where did it all come from?

Probably from round there props when going thru textile factorys next to the canal?

[Derek R.]

Probably from round there props when going thru textile factorys next to the canal?

 

Well, there is that. But most would have come from the same place it always has - off someone's back and bed.

What used to be collected by the Rag and Bone man now goes into skips for third world countries (or so we are told - and probably just another lie), and they are usually bursting at the seams as well.

 

Things are more 'valued' when in demand, and that may well have been more the case fifty years ago than todays 'wear it once and chuck it' lifestyle. You don't 'need' much for life in a back cabin, it's just peoples 'wants' that get in the way. There's a shot in 'Inland Waterways' where 'Jack' goes in the stores to draw 'Cloth' for cleaning, and seems to get a bar of Carbolic soap as well. Church Hall 'Jumble Sales' were all the rage too. Now we have Car Boot sales and Ebay.

 

Where did it come from? - off someone's back and bed - and maybe fought for!

[alan_fincher]

Were there no charity shops near canals back then ?

 

If not, how on earth did they get their ribbon edged plates ?

[Lady Muck]

What used to be collected by the Rag and Bone man now goes into skips for third world countries (or so we are told - and probably just another lie), and they are usually bursting at the seams as well.

 

It goes in container ships, as ballast and is usually headed for China.

 

I've seen fabric scraps being sorted in mainland China - they collect all the little offcuts from garment factories. I have never seen anything like it before, huge shed, as big as the biggest barn you've ever seen, with hundreds of workers hand sorting the scraps into colours. Also shoe leather off cuts from shoemaking can be shredded and made into board. Can be used to make notebook covers etc.

 

They don't waste anything in China, but some of the stories you read in the papers out there, particular one springs to mind where a furniture factory company was discovered to be using industrial waste from local hopsitals as stuffing in its sofas and chairs. Used surgical wadding was mentioned.

[Chertsey]

Well, there is that. But most would have come from the same place it always has - off someone's back and bed.

What used to be collected by the Rag and Bone man now goes into skips for third world countries (or so we are told - and probably just another lie), and they are usually bursting at the seams as well.

 

Things are more 'valued' when in demand, and that may well have been more the case fifty years ago than todays 'wear it once and chuck it' lifestyle. You don't 'need' much for life in a back cabin, it's just peoples 'wants' that get in the way. There's a shot in 'Inland Waterways' where 'Jack' goes in the stores to draw 'Cloth' for cleaning, and seems to get a bar of Carbolic soap as well. Church Hall 'Jumble Sales' were all the rage too. Now we have Car Boot sales and Ebay.

 

Where did it come from? - off someone's back and bed - and maybe fought for!

I guess that was sort of why I was asking - it wouldn't necessarily have been cheap and easily available as we might imagine today.

[Machpoint005]

Probably from round there props when going thru textile factorys next to the canal?

Round where?

[Derek R.]

Round where?

 

From the roundy round thing under the counter - like round and round the garden . . .

 

S'inglishinnit.

[Blossom]

And surely you needed a new mop more often than you had an old coat to throw away?

 

So where did it all come from?

 

Hi Sarah

Strange that, I have just come in off MINNOW and have been making a new rag mop this afternoon. As I recall, Mops were made from Croxley blanket, not old coats. This material was obtained 'Free of charge' from the paper mills at Croxley, was browny/orange in colour and a heavy cotton open weave material. Can't remember what it was used for at Croxley but obviously something connected to paper manufacture.

Also I can't say I can ever remember seeing a 'podged rug' in a back cabin either, more often than not cabin floor boards would be covered by either red and white, or black and white 2" diamond (not checks) linoleum.

When I lived on butty BINGLEY in the 1970's, I had a 'podged rug' in the back cabin but that was more my Black Country upbringing than canals, for as kids in the 1950's we were always sat podging rugs from old coats with podgers made from half an old dolly peg and an old hessian bag as a backing.

What a wonderful habitat for blood sucking beasties podged rugs were as well!

[Chertsey]

Also I can't say I can ever remember seeing a 'podged rug' in a back cabin either, more often than not cabin floor boards would be covered by either red and white, or black and white 2" diamond (not checks) linoleum.

When I lived on butty BINGLEY in the 1970's, I had a 'podged rug' in the back cabin but that was more my Black Country upbringing than canals, for as kids in the 1950's we were always sat podging rugs from old coats with podgers made from half an old dolly peg and an old hessian bag as a backing.

What a wonderful habitat for blood sucking beasties podged rugs were as well!

Hmmm. Another myth? Or maybe a Black Country phenomenon that's been extrapolated subsequently to elsewhere?

 

What did you use for your mop in the absence of Croxley blanket?

[Blossom]

Hmmm. Another myth? Or maybe a Black Country phenomenon that's been extrapolated subsequently to elsewhere?

 

What did you use for your mop in the absence of Croxley blanket?

 

Croxley blanket. Or at least an identical material except it is a greeny/blue and I have enough for about another 12 years of mops. Can't tell you where I had it from or my eldest daughter will be most upset!

[Derek R.]

Bit of a search after Blossom's Blanket;

 

Felt blanket was used to help drain the water from the paper during the paper making process.

From a few websites;

Cotton - source of fibre for papermaking, usually in the form of linters or rags. The fibres are strong and flexible and suited to the production of fine papers.

 

Felts - material woven from either cotton or wool with a raised surface which supports the wet sheet of paper during the stages of removal of water.

 

Linen - Linum usitatissimum, term covers either flax or linen as a source of fibre, often in the form of rags. The fibres are hard and fibrillate easily.

 

Rags - formerly the principal raw material for making paper, now rarely used except for very high quality papers. Could be linen or cotton but by association also includes jute, sailcloth and hemp ropes.

 

 

From: Glossary of paper makers terminology

 

http://www.baph.org.uk/general%20reference...ing%20terms.htm

 

 

The use of felt is mentioned here in John Dickinsons patent cylinder mould.

 

http://www.baph.org.uk/imagepages/quarterly/q04p4.html

 

 

A quote from Bilt Paper:- "As the paper flows along the wire mesh and water is drained along the way, a dandy roller near the end helps to smooth out the paper. The dandy roller improves the formation of the paper web by application of pressure. When the paper reaches the end of the wire mesh it is transferred to a felt blanket which conveys it through many steam heated driers to remove the excess moisture."

 

http://www.biltpaper.com/removing.htm

 

 

That's something else I didn't know!

 

Derek

[BuckbyLocks]

Hi Sarah

Strange that, I have just come in off MINNOW and have been making a new rag mop this afternoon. As I recall, Mops were made from Croxley blanket, not old coats. This material was obtained 'Free of charge' from the paper mills at Croxley, was browny/orange in colour and a heavy cotton open weave material. Can't remember what it was used for at Croxley but obviously something connected to paper manufacture.

Also I can't say I can ever remember seeing a 'podged rug' in a back cabin either, more often than not cabin floor boards would be covered by either red and white, or black and white 2" diamond (not checks) linoleum.

When I lived on butty BINGLEY in the 1970's, I had a 'podged rug' in the back cabin but that was more my Black Country upbringing than canals, for as kids in the 1950's we were always sat podging rugs from old coats with podgers made from half an old dolly peg and an old hessian bag as a backing.

What a wonderful habitat for blood sucking beasties podged rugs were as well!

 

While there may well have been a few rag rugs in cabins, it is highly unlikely they were made by the Boaters. Much more likely is that they took a scrounged hessian sack from stock to a canalside cottage where the 'art' of rug making was well established, for conversion to a rug. Most villages had several rug makers and that was certainly the case in my childhood. (well away from the Black Country). Rags were collected from everyone around - if you could supply a few bits of your own it may have helped, but where on earth would a boater have been able to store the vast heap of the stuff needed to make even a small rug? Yet another myth I am afraid.

[Pluto]

Also I can't say I can ever remember seeing a 'podged rug' in a back cabin either, more often than not cabin floor boards would be covered by either red and white, or black and white 2" diamond (not checks) linoleum.

On the western end of the L&LC, boats often had linoleum on the cabin floor and the bench seat courtesy of the lino works at Appley Bridge. A night watchman was supposed to have been put on to guard the dump next to the canal because so much was 'disappearing'.

[Derek R.]

I reckon that's about right regarding rag rugs. I had a kit given to me for Christmas ten years ago - got through six square inches and lost patience!

Quite a few old folk had them in houses - My Nan had one - semi-circular in front the hearth. We had a little one on 'Yarmouth', but that came from Mr. Tooley at Banbury. Out the little caravan if I remember right after Louise said she liked it. We'd topped up with diesel there in '83.

 

A bit more on Croxley Blanket: Got an email back from Dickinson's, from a Mr Watson of "On the paper trail":

 

I suspect this is a drying Felt, they were discarded after 6months or so. They made good carpets also I understand for the mill workers.

 

Derek

 

PS Whilst it's not my choice, lino is more practical being easy to mop. I prefer a bit of stair runner that can be lifted easy to get the floor up, or dry out in the engine 'ole.

Edited July 6, 2009 by Derek R.

[Chertsey]

In the absence of the real thing I am minded to make our mop (well, OH is actually going to make it) with strips of that absorbent synthetic felty stuff sold as cleaning cloths - got big ones v cheap from the local market, like disposable dishcloths but about 3mm thick.

 

And the rug is actually going to go on the sidebed....

 

OK, here's another one. Did they really used to have those multi-coloured crocheted blankets? And if so, what's the good of them?

[Derek R.]

They were very attractive, warm, and could almost be looked upon as some kind of status symbol - rather like brass knobs and ribbon plates. Don't know if many were on the boats, but very popular in houses right up until designer bedding took hold.

 

Mostly made from old cardigans and jumpers I guess. Colour was everything, the ones pieced together from squares were easier to make - but you know that!!

 

Was going to add - a used fleece top has been mentioned for mop material. Not tried that though.

Edited July 7, 2009 by Derek R.

[Chertsey]

They were very attractive, warm, and could almost be looked upon as some kind of status symbol - rather like brass knobs and ribbon plates. Don't know if many were on the boats, but very popular in houses right up until designer bedding took hold.

 

Mostly made from old cardigans and jumpers I guess. Colour was everything, the ones pieced together from squares were easier to make - but you know that!!

 

Was going to add - a used fleece top has been mentioned for mop material. Not tried that though.

Must confess that to my shame that though I can podge, and do all sorts of ambitious knitting, I can't crochet to save my life.

[Water Rat.]

Hi Warrior Woman. I would like to made a rag rug. Can you tell me where to find the info I might need to get started please?

[Chertsey]

Hi Warrior Woman. I would like to made a rag rug. Can you tell me where to find the info I might need to get started please?

Oh crikey... I just sort of made it up as I went along. I am sure there are people on here who know far more about doing it traditionally properly, and could point you to resources, but... if you look at one you will see it is relatively simple. You have your rag cut into strips (mine are usually about 2 1/2 by 3/4 inch, but I cut them narrower for thicker fabrics and wider for thin ones to give the same bulk where they pass through the backing). Then you have to poke the strips through the backing canvas. Traditionally this would be an old sack; I'm currently working with a piece of hessian from the garden centre. But I did my first one on 1/4" rug canvas and I think that might have been helpful in getting a feel for the spacing of the tufts. You poke them through with a podger which as Blossom says is just a pointy bit of wood. However I cheat here, I have a pointy thing that you poke through and it then opens up its little jaws, grips a strip of rag and I pull it back through. It's a lot easier than pushing but I don't know what the thing is called.

 

You always work from the front, and each strip is like a single stitch; it passes from the front, under a thread or two, and back to the front, making two tufts. Getting them spaced right I guess is the art, mine tend to be fairly dense which I'm sure is not authentic but I like them that way. I will try to find and upload some photos when I get home.

 

But I must stress that this is just the way I have made up, I don't make any claims for authenticity or tradition for it.

[Derek R.]

(snipped)

However I cheat here, I have a pointy thing that you poke through and it then opens up its little jaws, grips a strip of rag and I pull it back through. It's a lot easier than pushing but I don't know what the thing is called.

(snipped)

 

Locker Needle Hooks - Bit like a crochet hook, and a 'prodder' is another tool. Some huge variations on rugs with different effects depending on materials used. There's a good book published by Letts under contemporary crafts called simply 'Rag Rugs' (wow) by Ann Davies ISBN 1-85238-341-0, 95 pages hardback £10.95 - mine came from a charity shop 50p!

 

Google Rag Rugs - you'll be amazed, even Youtube videos - one technique I wouldn't have thought of. Very much show exactly how.

[Chertsey]

Locker Needle Hooks - Bit like a crochet hook, and a 'prodder' is another tool. Some huge variations on rugs with different effects depending on materials used. There's a good book published by Letts under contemporary crafts called simply 'Rag Rugs' (wow) by Ann Davies ISBN 1-85238-341-0, 95 pages hardback £10.95 - mine came from a charity shop 50p!

 

Google Rag Rugs - you'll be amazed, even Youtube videos - one technique I wouldn't have thought of. Very much show exactly how.

It's not a hook. It's more like pliers really... I will have to post some pics. But of course, Google is your friend.....

[madcat]

Ive never been sure if rag rugs were a regular feature of working boat back cabins but I like them and I like making them.My gran always had a rag rug .I call the little gripper tool for pulling the fabric through the backing "nippers".

I knit blankets as well because I like them,at grans there were knitted blankets made of squares of wool left over from knitting jumpers etc for the family.

[RLWP]

 

A rag-rugging bodger?

 

available here:

 

Richard

[Chertsey]

 

A rag-rugging bodger?

 

available here:

 

Richard

 

Yes, that's the principle.