mross Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 I once saw a boat passing our marina with water spraying up through the deck boards. I assumed the weed hatch had been left open. It was a private boat and I could not get the steerer's attention. his feet were wet so he must have been aware! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sea Dog Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 Do the panel think that, noting the lack of business insurance and commercial licence, there will now be a prosecution? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mayalld Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 16 minutes ago, Sea Dog said: Do the panel think that, noting the lack of business insurance and commercial licence, there will now be a prosecution? Has a criminal offence been committed? I would imagine that CRT might revoke the licence and section 8 it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewbacka Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 Not in anyone's interest, so probably not, however CRT will probably refuse a licence unless she gives an undertaking to cease renting or do it correctly, maybe just a 6 month licence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 Perhaps the renter, deprived of a facility for which he has paid, will bring an action for recovery of the moneys, unless the landlady has already returned his payment, which would be the decent thing to do. I think he could also claim for the cost of alternative accommodation, as I think he was living on the boat, not just having a holiday on it. These would be civil actions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sea Dog Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 1 minute ago, Chewbacka said: Not in anyone's interest... I was thinking more 'pour encorager less autres' - the practice doesn't seen to be isolated, particularly since advent of airbnb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hudds Lad Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 its always a bit sad to see a sunken boat, and hopefully she learns a lesson from this (although I doubt it). but how many others are getting away with this on a daily basis, especially around the more "desirable" cities with canals? its a miracle there aren't more of these incidents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewbacka Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 5 minutes ago, Sea Dog said: I was thinking more 'pour encorager less autres' - the practice doesn't seen to be isolated, particularly since advent of airbnb. I doubt CRT would wish to be in the news pushing to prosecute a poor homeless woman who is thousands in debt having lost her boat........ Just go down the 'normal' route of short term licence, monitor rental web sites, if naughtiness is found, no licence renal and we all know what comes next.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 1 minute ago, Chewbacka said: if naughtiness is found, no licence renal Yes, she could unofficially sell a kidney to raise some money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haggis Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 24 minutes ago, Athy said: Perhaps the renter, deprived of a facility for which he has paid, will bring an action for recovery of the moneys, unless the landlady has already returned his payment, which would be the decent thing to do. I think he could also claim for the cost of alternative accommodation, as I think he was living on the boat, not just having a holiday on it. These would be civil actions. I think she said that the renter had no money to pay for the hire but because he was a nice guy she let him have her boat so I don't think he can claim anything back. haggis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rusty69 Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 1 minute ago, haggis said: I think she said that the renter had no money to pay for the hire but because he was a nice guy she let him have her boat so I don't think he can claim anything back. haggis I thought it read no money for a deposit, but could be mistaken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewbacka Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 31 minutes ago, Athy said: Perhaps the renter, deprived of a facility for which he has paid, will bring an action for recovery of the moneys, unless the landlady has already returned his payment, which would be the decent thing to do. I think he could also claim for the cost of alternative accommodation, as I think he was living on the boat, not just having a holiday on it. These would be civil actions. Considering the renter sank the boat I think the claim is weak especially if he was warned not to operate the engine with the weed hatch open. In fact if explicitly warned not to open the weed hatch I can see the owner having a claim against the renter. But if the handover was verbal, then what was said is difficult to prove. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Payne Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 Maybe she can start another crowdfunder to cover costs of taking him to court, then he can start one to pay the costs and damages. About the norm these days. Best thing she can do is move on, learn from it and dont be so stupid again. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan de Enfield Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 11 hours ago, AllanC said: Ms Samples had temporary third-party insurance while some welding was being completed on the boat So - was it uninsured before the welding started ? Was it insured fully comp before the welding started ? 1 hour ago, WotEver said: She had third party insurance. One could read that she had 'temporary 3rd party insurance' as it was previously uninsured. One could read that she had 'temporary 3rd party insurance' as purely to enable her to licence the boat, and planned to then cancel it. One could read that she had 'temporary 3rd party insurance' as her fully comp insurance had lapsed, so she took temporary cover until she could afford fully comp. Irrespective of the reason she ended up un-insured as she broke her T&Cs. Typical insurance 'condition' : 4. Usage : It is warranted the Craft shall be used for private pleasure purposes only and not let out for hire or charter or reward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_P Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 1 hour ago, mayalld said: Has a criminal offence been committed? I would imagine that CRT might revoke the licence and section 8 it. I could imagine a civil action being taken by the renter for the harm and distress caused by the inadequate housing offered. It's tricky to see how a prosecution could proceed though. When I've tried to use various Housing Acts to induce CRT to improve facilities on their residential moorings, I've found that boats are not covered because the definition of a dwelling in the acts does not include boats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machpoint005 Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 1 hour ago, Dave_P said: >> boats are not covered because the definition of a dwelling in the acts does not include boats<< ... except when it does. This, I fear, is just the sort of thing m'learned friends finance their pensions with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Todd Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 The description of now being homeless might need some qualification as it seems that she has been renting out for a while and not living on it permanently . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Nibble Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 well the hordes of the sympathetic aren't going to put their hands in their pockets for. "I caught a cold running a dodgy business" are they. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchcrawler Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 3 hours ago, Chewbacka said: I doubt CRT would wish to be in the news pushing to prosecute a poor homeless woman who is thousands in debt having lost her boat........ Just go down the 'normal' route of short term licence, monitor rental web sites, if naughtiness is found, no licence renal and we all know what comes next.......... What is all this homeless bit, she has loads of feedback on from people she rented to so there must have been quite a time when she was homeless because someone else had her home, 2 hours ago, Dave_P said: I could imagine a civil action being taken by the renter for the harm and distress caused by the inadequate housing offered. It's tricky to see how a prosecution could proceed though. When I've tried to use various Housing Acts to induce CRT to improve facilities on their residential moorings, I've found that boats are not covered because the definition of a dwelling in the acts does not include boats. Like the girl on I think it was the Lee when Midnight Diamond sank http://narrowboatworld.com/9800-weed-hatch-cover-left-off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rickent Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 Her partner lives on the boat moored next to hers I believe and this is where she "lives". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Lewis Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 3 hours ago, Hudds Lad said: its always a bit sad to see a sunken boat, and hopefully she learns a lesson from this (although I doubt it). but how many others are getting away with this on a daily basis, especially around the more "desirable" cities with canals? its a miracle there aren't more of these incidents. There was one on the River Lea recently where a rented out boat sank launching a crowdfunder to pay for the tenants lost possessions. Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchcrawler Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 28 minutes ago, Tim Lewis said: There was one on the River Lea recently where a rented out boat sank launching a crowdfunder to pay for the tenants lost possessions. Tim Nb.Midnight Diamond. Was it a fault of the boat as claimed by the tenant or operator error? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewbacka Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 1 hour ago, ditchcrawler said: What is all this homeless bit, she has loads of feedback on from people she rented to so there must have been quite a time when she was homeless because someone else had her home, Like the girl on I think it was the Lee when Midnight Diamond sank http://narrowboatworld.com/9800-weed-hatch-cover-left-off But which makes the better newspaper headline??? 1) Boat sinks leaving sad woman homeless and in debt 2) Woman rents out uninsured boat which sunk Many years ago I questioned the honesty of a presentation we were about to give, and the boss explained 'never let the facts stand in the way of a good presentation ' 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murflynn Posted July 20, 2017 Report Share Posted July 20, 2017 On 19/07/2017 at 08:23, WotEver said: ?? She had third party insurance. the statement that 'Ms Samples had temporary third-party insurance while some welding was being completed on the boat' implies that once the welding was completed she no longer had that insurance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLWP Posted July 20, 2017 Report Share Posted July 20, 2017 3 minutes ago, Murflynn said: the statement that 'Ms Samples had temporary third-party insurance while some welding was being completed on the boat' implies that once the welding was completed she no longer had that insurance. And then had - what? No insurance, permanent third party insurance or fully comprehensive insurance? Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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