Why a Narrow Boat or GRP

[Starcoaster]

Ok, yeah sure... 

Did you read/see that episode of GoT where Daenerys Targaryen sold a dragon to the slavers?

[rusty69]

15 minutes ago, Starcoaster said:

Ok, yeah sure... 

Did you read/see that episode of GoT where Daenerys Targaryen sold a dragon to the slavers?

You've got three? 

[Calranthe]

Two more days to go, RPM gauge is fixed, really enjoying reading all the different opinions.

[Starcoaster]

1 minute ago, rusty69 said:

You've got three? 

Yes. I will sell you one for a legion of Unsullied.

 

*Sales are not binding.

[magictime]

10 hours ago, Naughty Cal said:

Why restrict our cruising and accommodation for the off chance we might visit some muddy ditch in the Midlands? the Huddersfield Narrow, the Ashton, the Peak Forest, the Macclesfield, the Trent and Mersey, the Caldon, the Shropshire Union, the Llangollen, the Montgomery, the Chesterfield, the Staffordshire and Worcestershire, the Worcester and Birmingham, the BCN canals, the Stourbridge, the Stratford-upon-Avon, the Coventry, the Ashby, the Leicester Line of the Grand Union, the Oxford, or a broad waterway accessed via one or more of the above?

Fixed that for you.

In answer to your question, of course there's no reason why you should restrict your cruising and accommodation by choosing a narrow beam boat if you have little or no interest in cruising the narrow canals (or using them to access other broad waterways). I'm merely pointing out the absurdity of your suggestion that someone who chooses the restricted living space of a narrowboat thereby gains access to nothing more than 'a few muddy Midlands ditches'. 

[cuthound]

On 15/07/2017 at 12:25, Ray T said:

As a matter of academic interest in the early days of leisure use of canals there were more little GRP / wooden cruisers, some ex life boats to be seen on the cut than steel narrow boats. I have always pondered why steel boats became the norm and the little cruisers waned. I have ideas but I am keeping my theories to myself on this occasion. Photo is Braunston Marina in its early days of rescue.

As Ray T says in the early days of leisure boating on the canals, after commercial carrying had, in the main finished, steel boats were the least common.

When I started canalling in the early 70's, GRP and wooden boats outnumbered steel boat 20:1 at least. In those days steel boats were almost exclusively either full length ex-working narowboats, or cut down ex-working narrowboats of 30-36 feet Inn length. Purpose built modern steel narrowboats only became popular later (thanks to the enterprising Sam Springer and his compatriots building affordable [but basic by todays standards] steel boats).

My first canal experience in 1973 was with a full length ex-working boat, doing what is now known as the Warwickshire Ring, starting from Braunston on the GU.

As we were likely to meet and share wide locks with GRP and wooden boats we were advised "steel in first and out last" when sharing.

You will find wide locks on the southern end of the Trent & Mersey Canal, from around Burton-on-Trent to Shardlow, so you can share with narrowboatsome,  but be sure to use plenty of fenders to protect the GRP. 

Whilst steel iso better suited to the canal environment (hence it's popularity now),  GRP will be fine provided you are adequately fendered. 

Most of all I hope ypu and Paola enjoy your forthcoming trip.

[Ex Brummie]

Having started my boating with a 24ft Burnham, I still have a soft spot for cruisers. I moved to a steel boat in the late 80's when boating had become an integral part of my life, and still have that boat. Primitive by today's standards, but still very comfortable. I was glad it was steel on Sunday, when a Chas Hardern hireboat lived up to its equine name and 'galloped' into me at full chat near Wrenbury.

[Naughty Cal]

Think we will stick with plastic.

We enjoy this too much. 

[rusty69]

Will you stop posting those pics please!

 

Anyway it will probably be snowing tomorrow

[magictime]

And with photos like those, I can see why you enjoy it so much, Naughty Cal. What I don't see is why you insist on disparaging hundreds of miles of equally attractive narrow waterways, stretching from the Pennines to North Wales to Oxfordshire, as 'a few muddy Midlands ditches'. What's so hard to accept about the idea that other people's preferences and priorities might be just as valid as yours?

[WotEver]

1 hour ago, magictime said:

And with photos like those, I can see why you enjoy it so much

Personally I think it looks dead boring but I can appreciate why some would find it appealing. I'm not much of a fan of Dartmoor for much the same reason. 

[rusty69]

9 minutes ago, WotEver said:

Personally I think it looks dead boring but I can appreciate why some would find it appealing. I'm not much of a fan of Dartmoor for much the same reason. 

Yeah, it looks awful. Rubbish scenery. Im glad im not there 

[magictime]

12 hours ago, WotEver said:

Personally I think it looks dead boring but I can appreciate why some would find it appealing. I'm not much of a fan of Dartmoor for much the same reason. 

A bit flat and featureless, you mean? I know what you mean, and I certainly wouldn't cruise there in preference to a muddy Midlands ditch like this one in Cheshire:

But with the little islands and everything, I do think it looks quite nice in its own way.

Incidentally, I think I may have discovered the root of Naughty Cal's confusion over this whole 'muddy ditch' thing. Look what I just turned up in a Google images search for 'Macclesfield canal':

[WotEver]

14 minutes ago, magictime said:

A bit flat and featureless, you mean? I know what you mean, and I certainly wouldn't cruise there in preference to a muddy Midlands ditch like this one in Cheshire:

Incidentally, I think I may have discovered the root of Naughty Cal's confusion over this whole 'muddy ditch' thing. Look what I just turned up in a Google images search for 'Macclesfield canal':

Yep, that's precisely what I mean. Bland and boring

That ditch certainly looks muddy - I must stay away from Macclesfield

 

Edited July 19, 2017 by WotEver

[Naughty Cal]

3 hours ago, magictime said:

A bit flat and featureless, you mean? I know what you mean, and I certainly wouldn't cruise there in preference to a muddy Midlands ditch like this one in Cheshire:

But with the little islands and everything, I do think it looks quite nice in its own way.

Incidentally, I think I may have discovered the root of Naughty Cal's confusion over this whole 'muddy ditch' thing. Look what I just turned up in a Google images search for 'Macclesfield canal':

Yes. BEN Nevis is very flat!

And I'm sure you get this all the time on your muddy ditches.

Edited July 19, 2017 by Naughty Cal

[magictime]

1 minute ago, Naughty Cal said:

Yes. BEN Nevis is very flat!

Eh? I'm still waiting for my Specsavers appointment, but I'm pretty sure I'd notice a 1,345m mountain towering above the otherwise gently undulating shoreline shown in the photo under discussion.

[rusty69]

48 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

And I'm sure you get this all the time on your muddy ditches.

 

Wow. You don't see many of those on the canals, that is for sure. 

[Naughty Cal]

50 minutes ago, magictime said:

Eh? I'm still waiting for my Specsavers appointment, but I'm pretty sure I'd notice a 1,345m mountain towering above the otherwise gently undulating shoreline shown in the photo under discussion.

We have not seen anything gently undulating for the last two weeks!

[WotEver]

19 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

We have not seen anything gently undulating for the last two weeks!

20 hours ago, Naughty Cal said:

Err, ok. 

[magictime]

I'm honestly not sure what you're trying to prove here, Naughty Cal.

If you'd like me to 'admit' that the Caledonian canal is beautiful and that the same can no doubt be said about many other waterways that are optimally enjoyed (or only accessible) in a widebeam GRP boat, I'm happy to do so. The most negative thing I've said about any waterway you enjoy cruising is that one small area of one of them, in one photo, looks "a bit flat and featureless" - and even then I also said it looked "quite nice" and that "I can see why you enjoy it so much".

I don't see any need to insult the Caledonian, or any other waterway, in order to defend the narrow canals against the charge that they are merely 'a few muddy Midlands ditches'. It's not your choice of boat or cruising area I've been taking issue with, it's the sheer unfairness of characterising the narrow canals in that way - and by extension, I guess, the unfairness of the implication that choosing a boat with limited living space merely in order to cruise the narrow canals is somehow a stupid thing to do.

[Naughty Cal]

6 minutes ago, magictime said:

I'm honestly not sure what you're trying to prove here, Naughty Cal.

If you'd like me to 'admit' that the Caledonian canal is beautiful and that the same can no doubt be said about many other waterways that are optimally enjoyed (or only accessible) in a widebeam GRP boat, I'm happy to do so. The most negative thing I've said about any waterway you enjoy cruising is that one small area of one of them, in one photo, looks "a bit flat and featureless" - and even then I also said it looked "quite nice" and that "I can see why you enjoy it so much".

I don't see any need to insult the Caledonian, or any other waterway, in order to defend the narrow canals against the charge that they are merely 'a few muddy Midlands ditches'. It's not your choice of boat or cruising area I've been taking issue with, it's the sheer unfairness of characterising the narrow canals in that way - and by extension, I guess, the unfairness of the implication that choosing a boat with limited living space merely in order to cruise the narrow canals is somehow a stupid thing to do.

If it isn't your thing then yes it would be a very very stupid thing to do to limit your living accommodation simply to use a very limited amount of the available .UK waterways.

 

 

1 hour ago, WotEver said:

Err, ok. 

The hill we were stood on was 620ft above sea level. Hardly flat!

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kerrera

[WotEver]

26 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

If it isn't your thing then yes it would be a very very stupid thing to do to limit your living accommodation simply to use a very limited amount the many hundreds of miles of the most available picturesque UK waterways.

I've fixed that for you.

I do completely agree with your sentiments above. If you're not one of the 45,000+ folks* who enjoy narrow canals then you shouldn't waste your time and money buying a narrowboat. 

Stick to the wide open spaces.

* estimated at 1.5 users per licensed (over 30,000) narrowboat. 

[Dr Bob]

2 hours ago, Naughty Cal said:

We have not seen anything gently undulating for the last two weeks!

I think it is great to see shots of Loch Ness in sunshine! I am glad you are enjoying your trip.

We lived in Scotland for 20+ years and sailed extensively round the coast and up and down the great glen for 3 years. The problem is the weather! You can get some great days - like you are having - but they are few and far between. We spent July and Aug in 2007 anchored in Arisaig waiting for 2 consecutive days of reasonable weather. It never happened. Rain, wind etc. If Scotland had decent weather there would be 30 million people living north of the Great Glen. It doesnt. They dont live there.

We really enjoyed loch Ness .....and all the coast including Orkney/Fair Isle/Shetland but have given up fighting the elements in a 40' boat with huge sails, in preference for spending an evening in the beer garden of the Two Boats next to a muddy ditch in Long Itchington (spelling?). Both experiences are (to me) fantastic. The grass isn't always greener. On a canal boat, you dont have to set an anchor alarm .....or worse get up at 2am in the morning when the alarm goes off for no apparent reason. There is also no chance of getting eaten by the Loch Ness monster in Long Itchington. Then again you get the best scenery but it's not that bad down here.

[magictime]

32 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

If it isn't your thing then yes it would be a very very stupid thing to do to limit your living accommodation simply to use a very limited amount of the available .UK waterways.

Bingo!

By the same token, then, if it is your thing - which would be quite understandable, once one recognises how far the narrow canals are from being just 'a few muddy Midlands ditches' - limiting your living accommodation might very well be the right choice.

And come on, it's not that limited an amount of the system. There are more than four times as many miles of narrow canal in England and Wales than there are miles of canal full stop in Scotland, for instance - c. 600 miles vs. 140 miles.

[Naughty Cal]

17 minutes ago, magictime said:

Bingo!

By the same token, then, if it is your thing - which would be quite understandable, once one recognises how far the narrow canals are from being just 'a few muddy Midlands ditches' - limiting your living accommodation might very well be the right choice.

And come on, it's not that limited an amount of the system. There are more than four times as many miles of narrow canal in England and Wales than there are miles of canal full stop in Scotland, for instance - c. 600 miles vs. 140 miles.

Because it isn't and never will be our thing.

Narrowboats are too restrictive.

They're designed for one single purpose.

For any other use. They are well useless.

Who mentioned the inland narrow system? The UK has far more waters to offer than 600 miles of narrow canals. Thankfully.

 

 

27 minutes ago, Dr Bob said:

I think it is great to see shots of Loch Ness in sunshine! I am glad you are enjoying your trip.

We lived in Scotland for 20+ years and sailed extensively round the coast and up and down the great glen for 3 years. The problem is the weather! You can get some great days - like you are having - but they are few and far between. We spent July and Aug in 2007 anchored in Arisaig waiting for 2 consecutive days of reasonable weather. It never happened. Rain, wind etc. If Scotland had decent weather there would be 30 million people living north of the Great Glen. It doesnt. They dont live there.

We really enjoyed loch Ness .....and all the coast including Orkney/Fair Isle/Shetland but have given up fighting the elements in a 40' boat with huge sails, in preference for spending an evening in the beer garden of the Two Boats next to a muddy ditch in Long Itchington (spelling?). Both experiences are (to me) fantastic. The grass isn't always greener. On a canal boat, you dont have to set an anchor alarm .....or worse get up at 2am in the morning when the alarm goes off for no apparent reason. There is also no chance of getting eaten by the Loch Ness monster in Long Itchington. Then again you get the best scenery but it's not that bad down here.

Whilst we enjoy our ditch crawling on the Fossditch and Witham. The beauty of our boat for us is that we can also explore further afield on different waters and the coast.

With a tin slug we couldn't do this. We would be too restricted. We get far more choice as we stand.

Our next boat will be more restrictive which is why we are now considering keeping this one as a toy boat as well.