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identifying my Barrus Shire


wobbly ollie

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2 hours ago, MrBeethoven said:

Mine is also 1552 and with a PRM120.

The boat is from year 2000 and as far as I know it's the original engine, also dating from there or thereabouts.

It is 35hp.

 

Have you experinced any problems? I also wondered whether this size of engine with around 35hp was sufficient for a 50ft boat? Sometimes feels a little underpowered....?

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I think it all depends upon what you expect and how well the prop is matched to engine and boat. I have a 1498cc Bukh in a 54ft narrowboat and I am very happy with it on the tidal Trent, Thames in flood, and down through the pool of London. However I did get Crowthes to specify and supply the prop.

It used to have a slightly larger pitch prop on it and that caused it to be down a tad on maximum speed but it stopped marginally better in an emergency that it does now.

To a degree I suspect a lot is down to experience. On rivers and tidal stretches it is important to know how to work with rather than against the tide/flow, how to read the water ahead, and how to make best use of the flow.

Remember the working boats may only have had abut half that power (but much larger props).

As long as the engine has been tolerably well looked after and you continue to look after it I doubt you will have to start worrying about reliability for about another 20 to 30 years. You will experience gauge 9sender) failure and need to change hoses now and again but that is true for any engine.

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5 minutes ago, wobbly ollie said:

Thats encouraging Tony . Thanks. I'd be interested to khow how to ensure that the prop size/pitch is correct? I guess that will have to wait until it comes out of the water?

Can it reach full revs when motoring in deep water against the tide? My understanding is that if it does so easily then it's probably under-propped. If it can't quite reach full revs then it's about right. If it can't get anywhere near full revs then it's probably over-propped. 

I'm sure someone will be along shortly to correct me if I'm wrong :)

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Tony's method is perfect.  I could only add that, if you can find the torque or power curve for your engine AS FITTED you should not be able to exceed the revs at which peak power or torque occurs when facing wind or current.

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32 minutes ago, WotEver said:

Yup, TB & MR have pointed out the obvious flaw in my post. It should read "can the engine reach the revs which correspond to maximum torque?"

Not if it was a plaining boat though, they may go for maximum power because it is likely to give a greater sped at the expense of fuel consumption.

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2 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

Not if it was a plaining boat though, they may go for maximum power because it is likely to give a greater sped at the expense of fuel consumption.

Yeah, but not too many narrowboats fit that category ;)

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5 hours ago, wobbly ollie said:

Have you experinced any problems? I also wondered whether this size of engine with around 35hp was sufficient for a 50ft boat? Sometimes feels a little underpowered....?

 

In reply to your 2nd question I have been very happy with it so far in almost 2 years but I have little to compare it with as had only hired narrowboats twice previously. Also, I haven't been on a river yet but on canals it suits me fine on a 45' boat.

Regarding your 1st question let's just say I'd rather not tempt fate with a reply!

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3 hours ago, wobbly ollie said:

Have you experinced any problems? I also wondered whether this size of engine with around 35hp was sufficient for a 50ft boat? Sometimes feels a little underpowered....?

I have this engine on a 55' nb and we were contemplating replacing it with a Beta Marine 43hp engine before deciding not to for various reasons. - a couple people now have commented on her "zooming along the cut" in a jokey way. (I keep to the speed limit of 6 mph) Ok, I'm not a dawdler but point is that the engine is more than capable of shifting the boat on canals. Upstream on rivers is a different matter, not a great. - Just as well I'm not fond of rivers. It's also under-propped so I do wonder how different it would be if this was corrected. 

 

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A great response as always so thanks everyone. Some of the comments are a bit beyond my understanding however. We chug along nicely on the K&A and only further afield intentions are to the Thames at Marlow or Windsor so no tidal issues. My engine does seem to a have sweet spot where if the revs are increased there us no noticable extra speed however there is a noticable increase in engine noise and vibration! So i assume the sweetspot could also be the area of maximum torque? Occassionaly boats pass (in the opposite direction) and they just seem to be going quite rapidly with less wash and revs. Dont get me wrong we didn't take Canal boating up to rush anywhere...i was just curious about measuring the engines performance to ensure that we are getting the best out of it  

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19 minutes ago, wobbly ollie said:

A great response as always so thanks everyone. Some of the comments are a bit beyond my understanding however. We chug along nicely on the K&A and only further afield intentions are to the Thames at Marlow or Windsor so no tidal issues. My engine does seem to a have sweet spot where if the revs are increased there us no noticable extra speed however there is a noticable increase in engine noise and vibration! So i assume the sweetspot could also be the area of maximum torque? Occassionaly boats pass (in the opposite direction) and they just seem to be going quite rapidly with less wash and revs. Dont get me wrong we didn't take Canal boating up to rush anywhere...i was just curious about measuring the engines performance to ensure that we are getting the best out of it  

On a canal that may well be lack of water under the boat. The prop sucks water from under the boat so the stern drags in the mud. If you throttle back and the boat accelerates slightly this is probably the cause.

Compare how it goes on a river section of the K&A or the Thames, they are usually a lot deeper.

Edited by Tony Brooks
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Ahhh so deeper water makes a differences. So many factors...pitch and size of blade, depth of water, revs, torque etc. Begining to realise that I'm getting a bit out of my depth (pardon the pun) and that maybe i should be happy potterring along at 4pm and  mid revs....  

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55 minutes ago, wobbly ollie said:

Occassionaly boats pass (in the opposite direction) and they just seem to be going quite rapidly with less wash and revs.

The first part (less wash) is almost certainly down to hull shape. The second part (less revs) could also be down to hull shape and/or engine type and/or prop size. 

Or it could be your imagination ;)

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31 minutes ago, WotEver said:

The first part (less wash) is almost certainly down to hull shape. The second part (less revs) could also be down to hull shape and/or engine type and/or prop size. 

Or it could be your imagination ;)

Our boat chugs along quite nicely with this engine at between 1200 and 1300 revs and with very little wash. I've been assuming this was down to hull shape.

Even on the rare occasions I move at 1400 revs the wash still seems to be far less than many other boats that pass us both in the opposite direction and also when we are moored up and, one would hope, most passing boats have made at least a token effort to slow down a bit.

 

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On 6/12/2017 at 16:21, Tony Brooks said:

 

Remember the working boats may only have had abut half that power (but much larger props).

And that half-powered working boat would make decent progress when fully laden and towing another fully laden boat.

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