Jump to content

Lock solo as a beginner on a leisure craft


Calranthe

Featured Posts

15 minutes ago, LadyG said:

note particularly that returning the rope from boat to mooring ring is unsafe, so the ropes are usually secured to the shore, and the boat handler controls the boat from the deck, feeding the rope through a block.

So, how does a single-handed boater raise the paddles and open the gates ?

  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

You team up with a few well crewed boats and they do all the work while you sip a cup of tea, and adjust the ropes. A single boat would not be allowed to lock through due to water conservation.

Edited by LadyG
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would add one final tip.

When sharing a broad lock with a full length narrowboat, position your shorter boat alongside the mid point of the larger boat.

This reduces the lever arm available to the longer boat should currents attempt to swing it across the lock.

George ex nb Alton retired

Link to comment
Share on other sites

41 minutes ago, LadyG said:

You team up with a few well crewed boats and they do all the work while you sip a cup of tea, and adjust the ropes. A single boat would not be allowed to lock through due to water conservation.

So, you have never singehanded thru' ANY lock, and yet you are giving advice to a person who has never before even helmed a boat, never mind operated a lock.

  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

So, you have never singehanded thru' ANY lock, and yet you are giving advice to a person who has never before even helmed a boat, never mind operated a lock.

Correct, I am seeing things from the novice POV, so I am giving the advice I would give to any complete novice boater ............. get instruction, [in fact I said this is what I would do in her place], wear a lifejacket when locking, have reliable equipment and know how to use it. "Its nought to do wi' ought", as they say in Yorkshire. 

As previously mentioned, I framed my post from my viewpoint, on what I consider to be a sensible plan before setting out on a long journey.

I did not mention nitty gritty of boat handling, narrow or otherwise. I think it is unwise for anyone to power up and set off without any preparation, [not that I am suggesting OP is doing this], but plenty of people do it every year.

Edited by LadyG
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, LadyG said:

Correct, I am seeing things from the novice POV, so I am giving the advice I would give to any complete novice boater ............. get instruction, [in fact I said this is what I would do in her place], wear a lifejacket when locking, have reliable equipment and know how to use it. "Its nought to do wi' ought", as they say in Yorkshire. 

As previously mentioned, I framed my post from my viewpoint, on what I consider to be a sensible plan before setting out on a long journey.

I did not mention nitty gritty of boat handling, narrow or otherwise. I think it is unwise for anyone to power up and set off without any preparation, [not that I am suggesting OP is doing this], but plenty of people do it every year.

 

I am sorry (ok totally not) but why don't you just stay in your lane. There is no shortage of experienced boaters here who can offer well informed and locally/craft-relevant advice to the OP, and you are not one of them.

You literally know no more that the OP and demonstrate a much poorer propensity to be able to take advice on board and listen, so why are you doling out advice yourself when the thread has already received (and likely will continue to receive) many useful, relevant comments from highly experienced boaters within the environment in question?

At the very least if you are going to "advise" others from your position of not having even got started yet, add some sort of disclaimer to it, otherwise it simply reads as hubris.

Edited by Starcoaster
  • Greenie 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I find that every piece of safety equipment I have come across has, in addition to its designed safety benefits, a drawback of some sort. Safety glasses are an obvious example. They protect your eyes at the expense of reducing your peripheral vision somewhat. I would not recommend the use of lifejackets on non-river canals, rather I would recommend that the candidate make a choice of whether to wear one based on their knowledge of their own sure-footedness and general competence. I find wearing one inhibits movement and adds to the general complexity of the operation. Obviously if the user is already familiar with the particular jacket then this does not apply.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I also worry that a self inflating one may trap you under the boat in a narrow lock. When I challenged an RNLI instructor on this point at the London boat show he advised that for canal use a manual inflate may be a better bet.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

29 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

I also worry that a self inflating one may trap you under the boat in a narrow lock. When I challenged an RNLI instructor on this point at the London boat show he advised that for canal use a manual inflate may be a better bet.

But the OP does not have a narrowboat.

She has been advised to walk the boat through.

When the locks are full of cold dark water, and she is alone, do you suggest she just wears shorts and T-shirt?

Even with a lock full of boats, if I fell in, possibly unconscious, I'd opt to be on the surface rather than underneath.

I did not envisage a lock full of narrow boats, and neither did anyone else.

 

Edited by LadyG
Link to comment
Share on other sites

28 minutes ago, system 4-50 said:

I find that every piece of safety equipment I have come across has, in addition to its designed safety benefits, a drawback of some sort. Safety glasses are an obvious example. They protect your eyes at the expense of reducing your peripheral vision somewhat. I would not recommend the use of lifejackets on non-river canals, rather I would recommend that the candidate make a choice of whether to wear one based on their knowledge of their own sure-footedness and general competence. I find wearing one inhibits movement and adds to the general complexity of the operation. Obviously if the user is already familiar with the particular jacket then this does not apply.

This is a very good point, and relates to life jackets especially. When doing locks i.e. climbing ladders, crossing gates etc I always worry about catching part of my clothing on some bit of infrastructure just as I commit to something, e.g. stepping across the gates on a narrow lock, and half killing myself with an unexpected fall.  Especially if conditions are wet or icy. The general strappiness of a life jacket adds significantly to this risk which is a major downside of wearing one. They are as likely to cause a serious accident in my view as to save you should you fall in. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

44 minutes ago, system 4-50 said:

I find that every piece of safety equipment I have come across has, in addition to its designed safety benefits, a drawback of some sort. Safety glasses are an obvious example. They protect your eyes at the expense of reducing your peripheral vision somewhat. I would not recommend the use of lifejackets on non-river canals, rather I would recommend that the candidate make a choice of whether to wear one based on their knowledge of their own sure-footedness and general competence. I find wearing one inhibits movement and adds to the general complexity of the operation. Obviously if the user is already familiar with the particular jacket then this does not apply.

of course, this was the very argument used by the "no need for safety belts in cars" brigade.

I was brought up in the day when you were over-cautious if wearing a safety hat of any sort,  cycling/riding/racing cars. Those days have gone.

Edited by LadyG
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Starcoaster said:

 

I am sorry (ok totally not) but why don't you just stay in your lane. There is no shortage of experienced boaters here who can offer well informed and locally/craft-relevant advice to the OP, and you are not one of them.

You literally know no more that the OP and demonstrate a much poorer propensity to be able to take advice on board and listen, so why are you doling out advice yourself when the thread has already received (and likely will continue to receive) many useful, relevant comments from highly experienced boaters within the environment in question?

At the very least if you are going to "advise" others from your position of not having even got started yet, add some sort of disclaimer to it, otherwise it simply reads as hubris.

If you look at my first post, you will find that OP had had very few responses. My advice if you chose to call it that, it is based on a lifetime of boating, and includes helping those who have got into difficulties, including a double drowning of my friends. No need to dramatise the situation, that is what happens sometimes. it was cold, it was dark, and they were alone in an unsuitable vessel with no safety kit.

I stand by my post, OP should not regard my ideas as dangerous, they are sound.

 

Edited by LadyG
Link to comment
Share on other sites

26 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

This is a very good point, and relates to life jackets especially. When doing locks i.e. climbing ladders, crossing gates etc I always worry about catching part of my clothing on some bit of infrastructure just as I commit to something, e.g. stepping across the gates on a narrow lock, and half killing myself with an unexpected fall.  Especially if conditions are wet or icy. The general strappiness of a life jacket adds significantly to this risk which is a major downside of wearing one. They are as likely to cause a serious accident in my view as to save you should you fall in. 

I would not wear a lifejacket if I were in company,  but I would if locking, and alone. I would not use a crotch strap, and it may or may not be self inflating. To be frank, I much prefer a life vest/bouyancy aid for any sort of active water activity, probably the kind a canoer would use, no strappiness.

Edited by LadyG
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes but what YOU would or would not do is irrelevant when it comes to advising someone else... The OP MAY have had very few responses at first, but that's how a message forum works... the post was only made yesterday, waiting for informed advice is hugely superior to taking half-cocked advice posted as it seems simply because "someone should say something!?" Personally I prefer the ethos that if you don't know for sure what advice to give, either say nothing or explain your situation in relation to what you DO say, so that the other party can make an informed decision about how reliable your views are to their situation.

"The OP should not regard my ideas as dangerous" etc... Whether the advice is good or bad (or really, irrelevant or neither in my opinion  in this case) The OP should regard your ideas as QUESTIONABLE, given that you know nothing from your own first hand experience of any of the pertinent factors. And honestly I would be hugely lairy of taking advice on anything from someone who is so stoical about being right all the time, even when you have now demonstrated many times (and had explained back to you) that you are a pre-novice in canal terms.

Stand by your post all you like, because of course you will, but don't be surprised if others quickly point out the lack of relevant knowledge and experience behind your suggestions and how this can be at best misleading and at worst, apt to cause problems.

Someone who spouts information that they haven't won and won't heed advice from those who have is a potentially dangerous boater, and dangerous to others too if they frame that information as The Word to those who don't know who to listen to.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, Starcoaster said:

Yes but what YOU would or would not do is irrelevant when it comes to advising someone else... The OP MAY have had very few responses at first, but that's how a message forum works... the post was only made yesterday, waiting for informed advice is hugely superior to taking half-cocked advice posted as it seems simply because "someone should say something!?" Personally I prefer the ethos that if you don't know for sure what advice to give, either say nothing or explain your situation in relation to what you DO say, so that the other party can make an informed decision about how reliable your views are to their situation.

"The OP should not regard my ideas as dangerous" etc... Whether the advice is good or bad (or really, irrelevant or neither in my opinion  in this case) The OP should regard your ideas as QUESTIONABLE, given that you know nothing from your own first hand experience of any of the pertinent factors. And honestly I would be hugely lairy of taking advice on anything from someone who is so stoical about being right all the time, even when you have now demonstrated many times (and had explained back to you) that you are a pre-novice in canal terms.

Stand by your post all you like, because of course you will, but don't be surprised if others quickly point out the lack of relevant knowledge and experience behind your suggestions and how this can be at best misleading and at worst, apt to cause problems.

Someone who spouts information that they haven't won and won't heed advice from those who have is a potentially dangerous boater, and dangerous to others too if they frame that information as The Word to those who don't know who to listen to.

My advice is sound, it is not half cocked.

I do not know what your problem is, I have been through canals, just not the ones you are familiar with, the locks open, the water comes in, the boat rises. 

I cannot see that anyone would suggest she must not get an instructor, must not wear a lifejacket and must not understand how to use the equipment.

The "Word", is that a religious reference?

Edited by LadyG
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think people are being a little harsh on LadyG

Her first bit of advice afterall was

"I  would most certainly pay an instructor to help me for half a day, a lot of things could go wrong in the first few hours.."

 

Seems to make sense to me! 

  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 minutes ago, LadyG said:

My advice is sound, it is not half cocked.

I do not know what your problem is, I have been through canals, just not the ones you are familiar with, the locks open, the water comes in, the boat rises. 

I cannot see that anyone would suggest she must not get an instructor, must not wear a lifejacket and must not understand how to use the equipment.

The "Word", is that a religious reference?

The poster is a "he"

No, I don't think anyone would suggest the he must not get an instructor or wear a life jacket, but I'd suggest those suggestions lie somewhere between "possibly" and "perhaps" on the Trent and Mersey Canal. 

1 hour ago, LadyG said:

of course, this was the very argument used by the "no need for safety belts in cars" brigade.

 

There was never a credible argument that wearing a seat belt made you more likely to have an accident, although there is evidence that "feeling safe" makes some people drive less carefully. There were claims that seat belts in some instances made injuries worse. 

Back to the OP, you will start with a couple of miles of river before joining the canal. I think the best bet would be if you could get someone with experience to accompany you as far as Shardlow, after which you'll be off the river and will have gone through two locks. This need not be a paid instructor, indeed if I lived closer I'd offer myself.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, LadyG said:

But the OP does not have a narrowboat.

She has been advised to walk the boat through.

When the locks are full of cold dark water, and she is alone, do you suggest she just wears shorts and T-shirt?

Even with a lock full of boats, if I fell in, possibly unconscious, I'd opt to be on the surface rather than underneath.

I did not envisage a lock full of narrow boats, and neither did anyone else.

 

You for some reason have decided to quote me out of context. My post was agreeing with System 4-50 and giving an example. I was not advising the OP who seems to have a far better grasp of canal boating than some I could mention.

I know there are locks where it is not possible to walk boats through (Nell's lock on the South Oxford for one) so eventually the OP will have to climb a ladder. Experience has taught me how strong currents can be in a lock and how tightly a narrow beam boats fit - certainly not enough space for someone who falls in to surface beside the boat. Experience has also taught me that boats behave very differently in shallow, confined water than they do  with plenty of depth and water around them. Especially boats with fine lines, a comparatively shallow hull draft and rounded bilges or even a V hull.

Again, unlike some, the OP seems to be taking a very practical and pragmatic approach to their boating  and asking  & TAKING for advice when they think they need it. From the OP's posts I am very much with Magpie Patrick. Get someone to to help them to and through Shardlow lock the apart from the force needed on some of the wide locks the OP shoudl be fine, especially at this time of year when he can ask for help from experienced boaters. Once he gets to Burton he will be on a narrow canal and unless he comes across another GRP boat is unlikely to fit into locks with the majority of steel narrowboats.

  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, LadyG said:

 

note particularly that returning the rope from boat to mooring ring to boat is unsafe, so the ropes are usually secured to the shore [bollards or captive rings] and the boat handler controls the boat from the deck, feeding the rope through a block, so the first thing to do is to put a bowline in the shore end of the rope.

 

Interesting that Scottish Canals say that it is dangerous to pass a rope back to be held on board and that they recommend the use of a bow line. The only time I have come across this method was on the Crinan! On the broad locks on the Forth and Clyde the rope goes round a large metal hook and is passed back to the boat to be held (bow and stern) . I am fairly certain that the locks sides on both canals are the same (large stone blocks) and yes, occasionally a rope can snag but a quick flick from below usually frees it.  Having done much bigger locks than on either canal (the Weaver for example) the rope always gets passed back to the boat to be held. 

I am not questioning anything LadyG has said, I am merely passing comment on advice given by Scottish Canals who see them selves as property developers and have systematically got rid of almost anyone who had any knowledge of canals.  sad days indeed on the canals of Scotland but that is another topic !

haggis

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A lot of information both from seasoned and new people we all have different points of view, as for the life jackets, they are SN165 I believe rated for anything up to storms as sea with very quick inflation and manual inflation method, when worn (have worn them around the house) they are quite thin and comfortable, maybe I do not need it but I don't swim so I will be wearing some kind of flotation device around water. Although being 6ft2 my feet should be close to touching the bottom if I do go in.

As for the travel up the canal it may not happen, if possible we will get the boat transported to Aston Marina, from what I understand we will have a nice stretch of water on the canal before meeting a lock so we can slowly get a feel for it and praps make some friends :)

Just need to find some one with a boat trailer that can transport a boat from Sawley to Aston

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Talked to Tony unfortunately he is booked solid till end of June and we have to move it before then or be charged for moorings, on the plus side talked to some wonderful people who owned Kathleen about 15 years ago (when she was called Michelle) when we are setup in the Aston Marina they are going to come down and take us out in the boat and walk me through doing a lock. :)

  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.