Jump to content

Wrought iron hull vs steel pros and cons?


Darrenroberts

Featured Posts

iqm looking int into buying a old wrought iron hull that has passed a survey, but iam consernd about a few things 1 is the maintence on hull more complicated and 2 if I needed to have work done in the further would it beat more specialised job than a steel hull? (Costing more money?) any help would be greatly appreciated 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

But was the surveyor a specialist?  Wrought iron can't be welded (with limited exceptions).  Repairs would need to be riveted.  There are not many places left doing riveting.  In a collision, if some rivets failed, it could sink quickly.  That does not mean that a riveted boat is weak.  SS Great Britain was a good example.

  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

41 minutes ago, mross said:

But was the surveyor a specialist?  Wrought iron can't be welded (with limited exceptions).  Repairs would need to be riveted.  There are not many places left doing riveting.  In a collision, if some rivets failed, it could sink quickly.  That does not mean that a riveted boat is weak.  SS Great Britain was a good example.

Thanks for the response, point well made I'll find out if the surveyor was a specialist. The boats a converted butty and the bottom was replaced with steel (I guess replacing wood) in the 70s so persumably you must be able to weld steel to wrought iron? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 minutes ago, Darrenroberts said:

Thanks for the response, point well made I'll find out if the surveyor was a specialist. The boats a converted butty and the bottom was replaced with steel (I guess replacing wood) in the 70s so persumably you must be able to weld steel to wrought iron? 

If you name the boat you are interested in then you may get some better / local knowledge input to this thread :captain:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Machpoint005 said:

And equally, was SS Great Eastern a bad example?

Don't think so. It was scrapped because it was uneconomic to operate. Parts of its plates are still in the Mersey mud and one pulled out for a fairly recent TV programme seemed in fair condition for its age.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, mross said:

But was the surveyor a specialist?  Wrought iron can't be welded (with limited exceptions).  Repairs would need to be riveted.  There are not many places left doing riveting.  In a collision, if some rivets failed, it could sink quickly.  That does not mean that a riveted boat is weak.  SS Great Britain was a good example.

Thanks for the response, point well made I'll find out if the surveyor was a specialist. The boats a converted butty and the bottom was replaced with steel (I guess replacing wood) in the 70s so persumably you must be able to weld steel to wrought iron? 

 

1 hour ago, ditchcrawler said:

I take it this survey that it passed was not yours but a third party's. I would tell you my boat is in first class condition if I was trying to sell it to you.

Haha yeh by two surveyors, it needed minor repairs that where done in December 2016 a survey from last month said it was sound. I'd probably have one done if I went for it just so I defiantly know/ can be there to chat to an engineer of my choosing. Needs a bss doing though and I need t find out when the engine was last surveyed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Darrenroberts said:

I need t find out when the engine was last surveyed.

Engines are rarely surveyed and are not covered in a 'normal' survey.

You will need to specify you want an "engine and gear" survey and will need to find a suitable surveyor - few are actually mechanically qualified, most simply do a 'hull survey' (check the steel thickness), and switch 'things' on - if they don't 'switch-on' they are unlikely to investigate further.

 Also check what is 'covered' on their survey - it is not unusual to have a clause that anything requiring tools to access will not be surveyed. Our gear-box needed a spanner to remove the dip-stick / filler so was not looked at.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Steel can be welded to wrought iron, though you need a good welder. To see an excellent example, have a look at the old Liverpool & Manchester Railway locomotive, Lion. After ceasing to be used as a locomotive, the rear section of its main frames were cut off and the engine converted to a pump for Prince's dry dock in Liverpool. The section of the frames which had been cut off were replaced by steel at Crewe Works when Lion was refurbished for the Centenary celebrations of the L&MR. I am not sure if we have the skill to undertake such difficult welding today, given the size of locomotive main frames, but thinner boat plates should not be too difficult for a good welder.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Engines are rarely surveyed and are not covered in a 'normal' survey.

 

Did your surveyor tell you that after forgetting to check the engine? lol.  I've never known a surveyor to not check an engine during a "normal" survey.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

50 minutes ago, lulu fish said:

Did your surveyor tell you that after forgetting to check the engine? lol.  I've never known a surveyor to not check an engine during a "normal" survey.

Yes but their report about the engine usually has so many caveats it can not be relied upon to say much more than "it starts and went into gear".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, lulu fish said:

You could say that about the whole survey.

Well, all I can say is that I did more to discover the state of the engine & gearbox prior to the survey than the surveyor did. I agree surveys are filled with caveats but at least in my case the attention given to the engine was superficial and the report was caveated to reflect that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Engines are rarely surveyed and are not covered in a 'normal' survey.

You will need to specify you want an "engine and gear" survey and will need to find a suitable surveyor - few are actually mechanically qualified, most simply do a 'hull survey' (check the steel thickness), and switch 'things' on - if they don't 'switch-on' they are unlikely to investigate further.

 Also check what is 'covered' on their survey - it is not unusual to have a clause that anything requiring tools to access will not be surveyed. Our gear-box needed a spanner to remove the dip-stick / filler so was not looked at.

When I had my boat surveyed, the surveyor,  Craig Allen, undid the gearbox dipstick, and commented on the condition of the gearbox oil, removed skirtings to check the type and condition of the insulation, removed both stern and bow thruster weed hatches, to check on the condition of the internal coatings.

I guess it depends on the surveyor, but I would definately use Craig again. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If its a good hull then its a good hull. Likely to be ancient but that makes it more interesting in my opinion. Don't worry about iron and welding, A good welder can do it (Not just a bloke like me with a Clarkes welder and a box of old rods)

Edited by Bee
rubbish spelling
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Bee said:

Don't worry about iron and welding, A good welder can do it

This would depend on the quality of the wrought iron as much as the skill of the welder.  If the iron is full of slag I would not want to rely on any weld that was underwater.  What a shame the wooden bottom wasn't replaced 'like with like',  for historical as well as practical reasons.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well you'd AV a job finding enough elm these days for a like for like. I made a cabinet with elm panneling long last year and had to search every where for mature timber I ended up on waiting lists for it in the end. They use oak for restorations now don't they? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Darrenroberts said:

Well you'd AV a job finding enough elm these days for a like for like.

Our local specialist timber merchant holds stock of European Elm and it's not even prohibitively expensive. 

 
Thicknesses Available:
1", 1.5", 2", 2.5", 3" & 4"
Sizes available:
4" & wider, 6' & longer
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.