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Engine diagnosis help!!


lawzy

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Ok, this may be total rubbish and way off the mark, but putting an alternator under load causes some sort of electrical resistence within said alternator making it harder to turn. If you were running along nicely with a slightly loose belt and then switched on a 3Kw kettle, putting an instant load on the alternator, could that make the belt squeal?

Could that even stop an engine?

Its ok, you can laugh if I am off the wall with this idea.:)

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Its not a crazy idea and a large alternator on a lower powered engine can prevent the engine revving up as soon as the alternator energises. However it seem from all the above the engine turns over and refuses to start so the alternator is unlikely to be spinning fast enough to energise. You can get similar symptoms but not the refusal to fire up when a battery develops a major short and suchlike with a large alternator so not totally off the mark.

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One other thing to consider is if when the engine started squealing you stopped the engine without thinking and then had a look inside the engine bay it is possible that you have pushed over the manual stop lever on the pump which would allow the engine to spin but not fire.  If the engine did just die but is free to spin on the starter - even though it makes a squeal - I can only assume it is not firing.  If it was the high pressure pump squealing then there is probably more than enough metal particles to have blocked the injectors and probably the pump is unable to generate full pressure as well.  Curious to see what the final result is, and I hope it is not too expensive to fix.

A final thought, have you smelled the diesel in the tank?  No chance that you did not top up with petrol rather than diesel from your jerry can?? 

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18 hours ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

Just sort of thinking out loud, looking logically at what you have said happened,my understanding is that you were cruising along for about an hour when the engine started squealing and cut out and you haven't been able to restart it. If the engine is still capable of turning over, which it seems to be from what you have said, I'd be tempted to disregard the gearbox/clutch suggestions. If it were them the engine would fire up, probably make an almighty racket squealing or whatever but would still run. If either of them had catastrophically siezed and were permanently engaged then the starter motor wouldn't be able to turn the engine, if they weren't permanently engaged then the engine would start.

Another cause of failure to start would be if the injectors were no longer operating at the correct timing caused by a failure of the timing belt/chain but if that had gone you would have heard a lot of other noises (like pistons hitting valves) and a timing belt is usually toothed so would be unlikely to squeal, it would just snap, similarly a timing chain wouldn't squeal either, so I'd hopefully disregard that as well (otherwise the engine will already have substantial damage).

I think I'd put my hopes on whatever drives your fuel pump is no longer doing so for whatever reason. Perhaps blocked injectors through contamination overpressurised the pump causing failure, but that is entering the realms of pure guesswork. We'll be interested to find out what the eventual problem turns out to be (just so that we can check that our engines aren't going to do the same thing:huh:)

 

 

i have talked to my marina today as he was the only one available who could look at it this month and he said he will have a look when he can. fingers crossed its just a mouse in the engine bay and he has bypassed the off switch.

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8 hours ago, Chewbacka said:

One other thing to consider is if when the engine started squealing you stopped the engine without thinking and then had a look inside the engine bay it is possible that you have pushed over the manual stop lever on the pump which would allow the engine to spin but not fire.  If the engine did just die but is free to spin on the starter - even though it makes a squeal - I can only assume it is not firing.  If it was the high pressure pump squealing then there is probably more than enough metal particles to have blocked the injectors and probably the pump is unable to generate full pressure as well.  Curious to see what the final result is, and I hope it is not too expensive to fix.

A final thought, have you smelled the diesel in the tank?  No chance that you did not top up with petrol rather than diesel from your jerry can?? 

i can confirm the fuel is definatly red diesel and that it came from a padlocked pump labeled "red diesel" on the pump as i have a habit of checking even with my petrol car that i am indeed putting petrol in and not diesel. when the engine started squealing i was heading towards a bridge and my first instinct was put it in neutral but by that time it was already dead. i dont think i have a manual stop switch tbh the only switches in the engine bay are the electric isolator and the fuel taps. and my engine bays is rather tidy and well layed out even if i do say so myself.

 

p.s its a tad off topic but i am mildly proud of myself so here it is.

Today i went to take my boat keys to the marina fella and i had to go pick some stuff off my boat before i handed the keys over and i locked my keys inside my boat... now as you can imagine with the weekend i was having i swore a WHOLE LOT! and after i calmed down i had a rational thought, I will pick my lock using.... A KEY RING LOOP and about 5 mins later i was in so now i will be carrying around a hand full of key ring loops on my keys that i will use as disposable lock picks just incase that nightmare ever happens again. i can only say that i will now be practicing the fine art of breaking and entering my own property from now on.

Edited by lawzy
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20 minutes ago, lawzy said:

i can confirm the fuel is definatly red diesel and that it came from a padlocked pump labeled "red diesel" on the pump as i have a habit of checking even with my petrol car that i am indeed putting petrol in and not diesel. when the engine started squealing i was heading towards a bridge and my first instinct was put it in neutral but by that time it was already dead. i dont think i have a manual stop switch tbh the only switches in the engine bay are the electric isolator and the fuel taps. and my engine bays is rather tidy and well layed out even if i do say so myself.

 

p.s its a tad off topic but i am mildly proud of myself so here it is.

Today i went to take my boat keys to the marina fella and i had to go pick some stuff off my boat before i handed the keys over and i locked my keys inside my boat... now as you can imagine with the weekend i was having i swore a WHOLE LOT! and after i calmed down i had a rational thought, I will pick my lock using.... A KEY RING LOOP and about 5 mins later i was in so now i will be carrying around a hand full of key ring loops on my keys that i will use as disposable lock picks just incase that nightmare ever happens again. i can only say that i will now be practicing the fine art of breaking and entering my own property from now on.

I am impressed with your lock picking skills, but maybe you should think about getting a more secure lock???

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5 minutes ago, Chewbacka said:

I am impressed with your lock picking skills, but maybe you should think about getting a more secure lock???

ye pretty much my 1st thought but i also thought " what are the chances the local smack head can pick a lock instead of hitting it with a hammer?" so its on my list of things i will be doing before my august holiday.

i should also say its not my first lock i have picked but it is the 1st i have improvised a lockpick and succeeded

 

Edited by lawzy
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2 minutes ago, lawzy said:

ye pretty much my 1st thought but i also thought " what are the chances the local smack head can pick a lock instead of hitting it with a hammer?" so its on my list of things i will be doing before my august holiday.

 

I agree, whenever I hear of a boat break-in a subtle method of delicate lock picking does not seem to be the method of choice, more usually a bit of scaffold pole or a wreking bar:lol:.  Do smack heads have no pride in their entry methods??

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16 minutes ago, Chewbacka said:

I agree, whenever I hear of a boat break-in a subtle method of delicate lock picking does not seem to be the method of choice, more usually a bit of scaffold pole or a wreking bar:lol:.  Do smack heads have no pride in their entry methods??

it takes a certain level of mental fortitude ( by that i mean have to be able to get dressed ) to pick a lock and lets be honest there addiction would make them a jittery mess and pushing a pin up would be neigh impossible. :P

Edited by lawzy
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Sorry for not replying in so long but i have only just got to see my boaty today. 

Apparently my gearbox thought it was time for a second oil change of it own accord so maybe the oil i used was not to her taste. It starts and runs but it has aquired a knocking noise when in gear and i have noticed it has some movement sideways so im thinking this problem is caused by other 1 and it will be sorted by monday when the greese monkey has another look at it and takes it for a cruise.

 

So ye squealing gearbox that stops your engine turning over is a sign it like fancy oil i think.

 

Thanks for all your help in trying to diagnose my problem luckily it was a relitivly cheap fix to get the engine going again and hopefully just as cheap for gearbox movement.

Edited by lawzy
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