Hungry washing machine

[larryjc]

Started using the washing machine on our new boat whilst underway (we're cruising the L&L and others for the next 3 months).  Its full size and draws a lot of wiggly amps when heating the water.  I have a 110 Amp alternator and Victron 3Kw inverter.  When the water is being heated it completely maxs out the alternator and I see a current draw of up to 100 amps - only for ten minutes or so but it drags the voltage down to 11.7 volts.  So am hurting anything ?  The batteries (4 Trojans) don't seem to mind and recover with out any fuss.  But I wonder if the alternator is suffering.  I have a 2kw suitcase generator I could run at the same time as the engine to add more power to the system.  Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

[GUMPY]

Wash on the cold setting if the current worries you. Modern detergents work just as well with cold water

[NB Lola]

Agree with loddon, cold water wash is fine.  Whilst in Germany, we did this as a norm.

[Robbo]

I wouldn't worry about it, however I would make sure that the alternator is well ventilated as it's the heat (as always) that kills them.   However it sounds like the Trojans may be stressing (voltage drop) and the amount of potential amps going in and out so ideally you would have more than 4, but as it's only for short periods (and not that often?) I still wouldn't worry about it. 

Edited April 8, 2017 by Robbo

[larryjc]

We're using a 30 degree wash but I'll try and talk She Who Is Sometimes Obeyed to try cold.

[Bee]

I think that's asking a lot from batteries, it would probably be best if you could use hot water from the engine. I've never done it but I think I would try to design a system that could do that.

[bastion]

Fill the drum with hot water from your sink tap before putting the clothes in. Machines only heat water on the first cycle then use cold water.

[GUMPY]

4 minutes ago, bastion said:

Fill the drum with hot water from your sink tap before putting the clothes in. Machines only heat water on the first cycle then use cold water.

doesn't work with many machines like my onld Zanussi that pumped out any water before starting cycle 

[bastion]

My machine is a Bosch but does not do a cold setting only 30 degs 

[MtB]

On 08/04/2017 at 16:01, larryjc said:

Started using the washing machine on our new boat whilst underway (we're cruising the L&L and others for the next 3 months).  Its full size and draws a lot of wiggly amps when heating the water.  I have a 110 Amp alternator and Victron 3Kw inverter.  When the water is being heated it completely maxs out the alternator and I see a current draw of up to 100 amps - only for ten minutes or so but it drags the voltage down to 11.7 volts.  So am hurting anything ?  The batteries (4 Trojans) don't seem to mind and recover with out any fuss.  But I wonder if the alternator is suffering.  I have a 2kw suitcase generator I could run at the same time as the engine to add more power to the system.  Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

 

100 Amps is a helluva current to draw for as long as ten minutes. Not really a problem provided your batts are in good condition and the wiring fat enough and installed to a high standard.

What voltage are they just before you start the wash and they drop to 11.7v?

[MoominPapa]

Linking to my post on this a couple of years back. It's still working fine.

Canalworld linky.

 

Cheers,

 

MP.

 

[bizzard]

If the machines that hungry a 15ib Turkey should pass through the door.

[AllanC]

You can pour hot water into the detergent drawer after you have started the wash (or after the machine has pumped out the old water and starts to fill.)

[BruceinSanity]

1 hour ago, AllanC said:

You can pour hot water into the detergent drawer after you have started the wash (or after the machine has pumped out the old water and starts to fill.)

That's exactly what we do with our compact Zanussi.

[Detling]

where is the 11.7 v measured, direct on the battery terminals or after the isolators and at the 12v input to the inverter. If at the battery, it is a bit low suggesting insufficient or maybe sulfated batteries, if at the inverter input it is fine as the voltage drop along the wire is to be expected. My volts drop to about 12 or 12.1 but that is at the battery terminal and I have 600 Amp hours worth of batteries. I only permit the washing machine when the batteries have had a good fill, at least 2 hours worth, before hand. 

[jddevel]

As I`ve stated before in a previous topic I`ve done the following in my sailaway. Installed a automatic thermostatic mixing value ( the 30 to 65 degree one) using a hot supply from my calorfier and a cold supply from the cold circuit to my washing machine. Although a cold fill only the existing valve internally was a double which only drew cold water and directed it either to the wash cycle or rinse which ever the programmer requested. I purchased a second valve, inserted it in the machine and transferred the live supply to the wash valve to this new valve along with the neutral. It means that when the wash cycle calls for water it takes in at what ever temperature the mixing valve has been set to. 30 degrees for a cold wash or a maximum of 65 for a hotter one. On the rinse cycle it takes in cold from the old supply pipe from the cold pipe. Hope I`ve made sense.

[Kwacker]

Part of my job involves dismantling washing machines, and those used exclusively on cold or cool washes with low temperature detergents are universally disgusting inside, and smell like a mushroom farm. (Gently peel back the lip of the door seal where it meets the drum and see what you find)

At home, I wouldn't dream of doing it. Having seen what happens, we do at least one 60c wash (towels) per week and one 90c wash (dishcloths etc) per month using powder (Daz etc ) to sanitise the machine and clear / prevent the sludge build up. I don't know how you would do this on a boat using batteries and an inverter,  but it is certainly good for the health of the washing machine.

Modern machines are cold fill for a very good reason, it makes them far more efficient. Some new machines only need 1700w heaters because they use so little water to wash, but the heating period is a crucial part of the wash cycle. Adding hot water to a cold fill machine shortens the heating period, but also shortens the wash, reducing its performance.

[jddevel]

I would add to Kwackers` comment in that our home Miele machine started making some disturbing noises -it was 8 years old and well used- and because it has a 10 year guarantee out came the engineer. Turned out that due to us not periodically  using a very hot wash (frugal!!) Miele  had discovered that modern powders had attacked the support spider on the back of the drum. They`ve since changed the design and gave us a good discount on a new machine. Better I thought than repair the old and only have a couple of years left of the guarantee.

[GUMPY]

Washing powders are the work of the devil. Liquid or sachets of liquid for us.

Powder never fully disolves in cooler washes hence the need for a hot wash.......

Edited April 9, 2017 by Loddon

[larryjc]

Sorry - only just back on line.  Some answers.  Yest a 15lb turkey will fit, its a bloody big full size Indesit.  The batteries are brand new Trojans T105s, four of.  I make sure they've had a good hour or so of charge so are at over 90% but start volts are hard to know as my 500w of solar are already keeping the volts well up.  My monitor is a NASA which measures volts across the terminals and the Victron gives me a low volts warning in conjunction with the high current/low volts on the NASA.  As for wiring its been used like this by the previous owners for several years (old machine and batteries) and looks pretty robust to me.

This morning I am going to plug in my 2Kw suitcase generator as well as the engine to see how that copes with the heating cycle as apparently we need to wash all our sheets.   Thats all a mystery to me - I just put dirties into a magic bag and expect to see them clean a few days later.

.

 

[Nightwatch]

14 hours ago, AllanC said:

You can pour hot water into the detergent drawer after you have started the wash (or after the machine has pumped out the old water and starts to fill.)

This is what we've been doing for the past three years. Works a treat. A short length of hose from the sink tap. Listen for the main pump to start pumping in the cold and turn on the hot tap via the hose. You become accustomed as to how much and what temp you want to wash at.

 

Edited April 9, 2017 by Nightwatch

[Robbo]

As you've just got the Trojans I would suggest getting a couple more.   The amount of amps you have available in for both charging and in usage, (but more charging) are on the limits for 4 batteries where 6 wouldn't be.  You can then program your Victron to use the full 120amp as well. (By default it is only 90amp)

[bizzard]

My mums first and only washing machine was an Indesit back in the late 1960's. When she started it up for the very first time it went up in smoke. We called out the Indecent repairer man. He said that it was an Italian home market Indesit model 110v and had burnt out the motor and other bits.  He didn't know how that one got over here into the UK. It put mum off washing machines for life, she dragged her old faithful copper gas boiler out of the cellar to do the washing and never used the Indecent ever again or any other washing machine.

[larryjc]

Well that went well!  Engine and genny going and as soon as the high load came on it blew the fuse in the plug connected to the genny - mind you for some reason it was only a 10Amp one.  I'll have to try again with a new fuse on the next wash day.  But I do like the idea of using hot water and will give that a go next - any idea how much? Or is it just experimentation?

 

[Robbo]

2 minutes ago, larryjc said:

Well that went well!  Engine and genny going and as soon as the high load came on it blew the fuse in the plug connected to the genny - mind you for some reason it was only a 10Amp one.  I'll have to try again with a new fuse on the next wash day.  But I do like the idea of using hot water and will give that a go next - any idea how much? Or is it just experimentation?

 

Did you limit the Victron on the input amps?