Jump to content

Anchors Aweigh!


BargeeSpud

Featured Posts

1 hour ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

And it is clear you have no experience of the Thames on a calm summer's day, and are shooting for the lip as usual.  

What has that got to do with anything Mike, if the OP fancies carrying some safety equipment why are get so aeriated  about it?

Do you consider floatation devices an unnecessary extravagance?

Also, the phrase you are searching for is 'shooting from the hip'.

Shooting for the lip sounds like you have lost power, forgotten your anchor and are about to go over a weir.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If I formally asked the Environment Agency whether I needed an anchor on the non tidal Thames, then if they say, like a non professional might say, that in their experience you don't need one, on the basis that they haven't had a total loss or loss of life yet, then they would leave themselves wide open to being sued for loss of life, damage to property or stress. 

They would be very foolish to say that. They may of course say ( I do not know exactly what they would say, as I haven't contacted them, but reading other posts, it does look more likely) it is advisory, not compulsory in order to safely navigate the system in normal conditions. After all they advise not to cruise in strong streams, but you might find yourself in one. 

When we moved to the Thames, we placed on board a 7kg Danforth, with chain,  looking at various websites it looks like it is adequate for a 23' grp cruiser, under normally expected conditions most of the time. It happened to be a spare one off my Father. I intend to treat the Danforth as a disposable safety device, a bit like an air bag on a car, if it does the job once and saves injuries or losses, then cheap at twice the price lol.

I hope to be able to recover it, but safety of the crew and vessel take priority.

So In my opinion, I would not venture on the Thames without a suitable main anchor, but then a secondary anchor may be advised too. For that we have a 4kg grapnel. 

Even a small anchor may drag enough to keep the bow to the current, and help reduce the chances of a "broadside approach to a weir, moored boats or other dangers, whereby the river water will build up along the entire length of the boat, rather than the width of the beam, which could cause a rapid increase in water level behind and under the hull, thus increasing the "roll over" moment of the hull. 

Also a boat dragging an anchor in a current will allow a boat to steer closer to the bank, and may even allow the crew to secure the boat.

Taking longer to get to a danger, will give more time to review the situation, maybe get a vital phone call in, before the phones are swamped.

Yes, (in my opinion) you need an anchor, like your airbags in your car, you hope not to use them, but unlike your airbags in the car, you can still move the anchor to another boat, if suitable, or sell it, and the cost of ownership is minimum, for great peace of mind.

 

Richard

Edited by RD1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Suppose, instead of asking about an anchor, the op had asked whether he should wear a life jacket at all times.

Given the risk of falling overboard, and the consequences, are clearly greater than the outcome of being pushed against a weir barrier with a failed/stalled engine, those that argue you must have an anchor would presumably agree that wearing a life jacket is even more crucial.

Yet the number of life jacket wearers on the Thames I would suggest is considerably lower than boats carrying an anchor.   

Not trying to defend Mike's position as such but I see where he's coming from.  

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, Neil2 said:

Suppose, instead of asking about an anchor, the op had asked whether he should wear a life jacket at all times.

Given the risk of falling overboard, and the consequences, are clearly greater than the outcome of being pushed against a weir barrier with a failed/stalled engine, those that argue you must have an anchor would presumably agree that wearing a life jacket is even more crucial.

Yet the number of life jacket wearers on the Thames I would suggest is considerably lower than boats carrying an anchor.   

Not trying to defend Mike's position as such but I see where he's coming from.  

 

If the OP had asked about life jackets on the Thames, I for one would definitely suggest they were appropriate (although perhaps not in bed). 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Neil2 said:

Suppose, instead of asking about an anchor, the op had asked whether he should wear a life jacket at all times.

Given the risk of falling overboard, and the consequences, are clearly greater than the outcome of being pushed against a weir barrier with a failed/stalled engine, those that argue you must have an anchor would presumably agree that wearing a life jacket is even more crucial.

Yet the number of life jacket wearers on the Thames I would suggest is considerably lower than boats carrying an anchor.   

Not trying to defend Mike's position as such but I see where he's coming from.  

 

Mike, like all of us, is of course entitled to put his point of view and his opinions are always interesting to read. i just wish that occasionally we should remember the OP's question and give our various opinions without changing the thread into a pissing competition. I think it does a disservice to this forum when it happens after a genuine request for information. 

 

Howard

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, howardang said:

Mike, like all of us, is of course entitled to put his point of view and his opinions are always interesting to read. i just wish that occasionally we should remember the OP's question and give our various opinions without changing the thread into a pissing competition. I think it does a disservice to this forum when it happens after a genuine request for information. 

 

Howard

It seems an odd comment to make as I have not seen an opinion from you as yet (apologies if I have missed it) but instead two off topic comments. 

At least mtb's comments are on topic and prompt discussion. After all this is a discussion forum 

Edited by rusty69
Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, howardang said:

Mike, like all of us, is of course entitled to put his point of view and his opinions are always interesting to read. i just wish that occasionally we should remember the OP's question and give our various opinions without changing the thread into a pissing competition. I think it does a disservice to this forum when it happens after a genuine request for information. 

 

Howard

I'm not sure what a pissing competition is but I suspect at my age I wouldn't be much good at it...

I don't think I agree with the point though.  The OP was asking for views/opinions on whether members of the forum considered an anchor to be essential, given that the river authority only advise carrying one.  

I might not agree 100% but I think Mike raised some perfectly valid points, personally. 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

It seems an odd comment to make as I have not seen an opinion from you as yet (apologies if I have missed it) but instead two off topic comments. 

At least mtb's comments are on topic and prompt discussion. After all this is a discussion forum 

I have deliberately chosen not to contribute because I think there has enough been said already without my own two pennarth.  I know that this is a discussion forum, but too frequently, in my view, a perfectly straightforward question which might be interesting to many members, turns into what I described as a "pissing competition"

This is the reason ( I suspect) why many people read the postings on this forum but refrain from joining in, as I frequently do.

Howard

 

 

 

 

 

  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, howardang said:

I have deliberately chosen not to contribute because I think there has enough been said already without my own two pennarth.  I know that this is a discussion forum, but too frequently, in my view, a perfectly straightforward question which might be interesting to many members, turns into what I described as a "pissing competition"

This is the reason ( I suspect) why many people read the postings on this forum but refrain from joining in, as I frequently do.

Howard

 

 

 

 

 

What can appear to be perfectly straight forward question may not have a perfectly straight forward answer. Different people will have different options. The OP is then free to choose. 

The OP still doesn't know your opinion, so can't take it into consideration. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If it were me I'd carry 7 main anchors, 4 kedge anchors, 11 miles of chain, 2 grapnels. 14 miles of assorted rope, 201assorted shackles, 15 Mai Wests, 7 pairs of water wings, 7 lorry inner tubes, 9 life rings, 8 wet suits, Jumbo boxes of maroons, distress flares, parachute flares, 10 boxes of cooks matches to set light to them. Escorted fore, aft and on either side by tugs, salvage barge, rescue Ribs, with several spare Ribs at fall alert on standby. Platoon of life guards trotting along the bank keeping pace with me. Whilst hovering overhead and at the ready, 2 Sikorsky, 3 Whirlwind and 2 Seaking helicopters poised to rush in and winch me to safety. I packet of Elastoplast and two large safety pins.  -_-  Mr E.Pirb, Ship- shore wireless permanently switched on and tuned in to the distress band, tuned to send.  Holy Bible.

Edited by bizzard
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, bizzard said:

If it were me I'd carry 7 main anchors, 4 kedge anchors, 11 miles of chain, 2 grapnels. 14 miles of assorted rope, 201assorted shackles, 15 Mai Wests, 7 pairs of water wings, 7 lorry inner tubes, 9 life rings, 8 wet suits, Jumbo boxes of maroons, distress flares, parachute flares, 10 boxes of cooks matches to set light to them. Escorted fore, aft and on either side by tugs, salvage barge, rescue Ribs, with several spare Ribs at fall alert on standby. Platoon of life guards trotting along the bank keeping pace with me. Whilst hovering overhead and at the ready, 2 Sikorsky, 3 Whirlwind and 2 Seaking helicopters poised to rush in and winch me to safety. I packet of Elastoplast and two large safety pins.  -_-

You forgot EPIRB 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

27 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

What can appear to be perfectly straight forward question may not have a perfectly straight forward answer. Different people will have different options. The OP is then free to choose. 

The OP still doesn't know your opinion, so can't take it into consideration. 

My view is very straightforward. The OP says that the advice he has read is that an anchor should be carried. Other views have been expressed saying, in effect, anchors are not necessary. How many views (on each side of the point) are necessary to make a decision? Are you suggesting that the OP tallies up the yesses and nos and goes with the majority? That is not the way to make any decision about a question about basic common sense, which is, after all, the basis of basic seamanship!

 

Howard

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, howardang said:

My view is very straightforward. The OP says that the advice he has read is that an anchor should be carried. Other views have been expressed saying, in effect, anchors are not necessary. How many views (on each side of the point) are necessary to make a decision? Are you suggesting that the OP tallies up the yesses and nos and goes with the majority? That is not the way to make any decision about a question about basic common sense, which is, after all, the basis of basic seamanship!

 

Howard

 

 

No. I am suggesting the OP considers the pros and cons of each argument and decides on merit and budget before making a more informed decision on things he may not have thought of before. 

As you still have not offered an opinion, I'm not sure you are much help to the OP. 

 

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

No. I am suggesting the OP considers the pros and cons of each argument and decides on merit and budget before making a more informed decision on things he may not have thought of before. 

As you still have not offered an opinion, I'm not sure you are much help to the OP. 

 

 

 

 

Fine, if you can't deduce my view from what I said a few minutes ago, I'll spell it out for you; carry the correct equipment to give you the best chance in the event of running into a problem. To further clarify the point, also make sure you know what to do in a difficult situation afloat. That is basic seamanship/boatmanship or whatever you wish to call it. Now, is that clear enough for you?

 

howard

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, howardang said:

Fine, if you can't deduce my view from what I said a few minutes ago, I'll spell it out for you; carry the correct equipment to give you the best chance in the event of running into a problem. To further clarify the point, also make sure you know what to do in a difficult situation afloat. That is basic seamanship/boatmanship or whatever you wish to call it. Now, is that clear enough for you?

 

howard

Thankyou. 

You were almost guilty of entering into what you earlier described as a "pissing competition " without adding any value to the thread. 

 

I am sure the OP will consider your opinion now as part of their decision. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Thankyou. 

You were almost guilty of entering into what you earlier described as a "pissing competition " without adding any value to the thread. 

 

I am sure the OP will consider your opinion now as part of their decision. 

That's very gracious of you, and I am so grateful for your input, but I must have missed the notification that you are running this forum! :(

 

Howard

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

24 minutes ago, howardang said:

That's very gracious of you, and I am so grateful for your input, but I must have missed the notification that you are running this forum! :(

 

Howard

 

 

 

As far as I know, anyone is free to comment within forum rules.The forum is only as good as it's posters(past and present) 

 

I think you are definitely in the realms of the "pissing competion" you were earlier trying to avoid, so I will concede for the benefit of the thread. 

You win! 

Edited by rusty69
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, rusty69 said:

If the OP had asked about life jackets on the Thames, I for one would definitely suggest they were appropriate (although perhaps not in bed). 

what - having them ready to use, or actually wearing them?

I hope you do a written risk assessment every time you get in the car, before you start your journey.  :banghead:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

what - having them ready to use, or actually wearing them?

I hope you do a written risk assessment every time you get in the car, before you start your journey.  :banghead:

Would you suggest life jackets on a boat are not a good idea then? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, rusty69 said:

The forum is only as good as it's posters

 

Oh lordy, has it got that bad?

Maybe I can help bring it down another peg (no pun intended) by offering my view.

When I am on the Severn I always have the anchor attached ready to deploy and I wear a life jacket.

Strangely though when I travelled from Stratford to Worcester via the Avon and Severn I didn't ready the anchor until I got to Tewkesbury. That's a bit daft in hindsight. I had the life jacket on both because I was on a river and because I was single handing (and some of those Avon locks ain't easy).

I have spoken to enough people who can recount a bad experience on the Severn even though it can appear to be quite benign (and has never been known to be more than trickle in the summer months ;-) )

JP

Link to comment
Share on other sites

25 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

 

Oh lordy, has it got that bad?

Maybe I can help bring it down another peg (no pun intended) by offering my view.

When I am on the Severn I always have the anchor attached ready to deploy and I wear a life jacket.

Strangely though when I travelled from Stratford to Worcester via the Avon and Severn I didn't ready the anchor until I got to Tewkesbury. That's a bit daft in hindsight. I had the life jacket on both because I was on a river and because I was single handing (and some of those Avon locks ain't easy).

I have spoken to enough people who can recount a bad experience on the Severn even though it can appear to be quite benign (and has never been known to be more than trickle in the summer months ;-) )

JP

I understand that what you may do on your own boat is down to personal preference. 

I am amazed at some of the advice offered to other people on this thread, although I'm sure some of it is done to prompt discussion. 

For instance, regarding the anchor, the powers that be recommend carrying one, and any fool can see that having one is more preferable than not having one. Likewise with life jackets.why advise someone not to have one, particularly if you don't know whether they are a swimmer or not, when it  much easier and more responsible to recommend they do have one. 

Just my opinion of course. 

Edited by rusty69
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Murflynn said:

hope you do a written risk assessment every time you get in the car, before you start your journey.  :banghead:

I don't need to as manufacturers and legislation have made car driving less dangerous over the years. Thankfully,  it is yet to catch up with boat users,and hopefully common sense will prevail. 

 

Edited by rusty69
Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 hours ago, rusty69 said:

I don't need to as manufacturers and legislation have made car driving less dangerous over the years. Thankfully,  it is yet to catch up with boat users,and hopefully common sense will prevail. 

 

then clearly you ain't been through a proper elfinsafety course, like what i did with BP - 3 weeks intensive with regular 2 day refreshers.

the basis of the training was that you do not take anything for granted, and assess each situation (and car journey) individually. 

11 hours ago, rusty69 said:

Would you suggest life jackets on a boat are not a good idea then? 

did I say that?

just answer the bleeding question.  :banghead:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.