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Mooring vacancies, lack of!


Martyndj

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Due to health issue and the need to attend hospital at Coventry several times a week I decided 18 months ago that I would try and move my mooring from Braunston to Coventry (around Hawksbury) I spoke to the mooring manager and asked to be kept informed of any vacancies that were likely to come up. I watch the CRT website virtually daily and in all that time I think there has been only one suitable vacancy advertised. I do find this really odd as the number of boats moored in this area is pretty large, surly there should of been some movement in this length of time. Has anyone else had a similar experience or can give me their thoughts on this. Thanks Martyn.

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Quite a few of the old Hawkesbury Junction locals (continuous moorers...) have taken the online moorings. Whether they have been encouraged to do so by local enforcement in order to keep their boats on the water is not known, however, this has happened in several other areas.

Lots of space at Tuttle Hill, Nuneaton.

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Yes, I can understand the so called " continuous moorers" taking the vacant spots but why were they not advertised on the website? It seems to me that it is a bit of a con and it all depends on who you know, really pisses me off!!

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1 hour ago, matty40s said:

Lots of space at Tuttle Hill, Nuneaton.

Springwood Haven? You sure? 

When we were there they were full and they didn't allow liveaboards. Of course, both of those could have changed since. 

Trinity Marina on the Ashby usually have space plus have no problem with liveaboards. 

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1 minute ago, WotEver said:

Springwood Haven? You sure? 

When we were there they were full and they didn't allow liveaboards. Of course, both of those could have changed since. 

Trinity Marina on the Ashby usually have space plus have no problem with liveaboards. 

No, I meant Tuttle Hill, the online ones nearer to Nuneaton than Springwood.

There's a couple of boats there and about 4 spaces.

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Just now, matty40s said:

No, I meant Tuttle Hill, the online ones nearer to Nuneaton than Springwood.

There's a couple of boats there and about 4 spaces.

Ahh, the linear ones. Gotcha.  Again, they were full with a waiting list last time I checked but things change all the time. 

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Tuttle Hill has had more spaces than moorings at least since we have regularly been using the Coventry Canal (June 2014).

I thought perhaps CRT were deliberately running it down, although I hope not because my EoG mooring is based on 50% of Tuttle  Hill mooring charges. 

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2 minutes ago, cuthound said:

Tuttle Hill has had more spaces than moorings at least since we have regularly been using the Coventry Canal (June 2014).

 

Yeah, my interest in it predates that by a few years. 

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I have wondered that about Tuttle Hill (which is a stretch of offside moorings) too - I haven't seen those spaces advertised and I wonder if CART is trying to close it down.

Springwood Haven used to have a quite long waiting list, not sure if it still has.

Martyn, you say that you saw one suitable mooring advertised.. Why didn't you take it?

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2 minutes ago, Athy said:

What, despite their being on the offside?

Yup, dead easy to access via the quarry road. A mate lost a very well chained up outboard just after he'd finished fully refurbishing it. Windows have been smashed. A wooden boat was set fire to. 

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29 minutes ago, Athy said:

I have wondered that about Tuttle Hill (which is a stretch of offside moorings) too - I haven't seen those spaces advertised and I wonder if CART is trying to close it down.

Springwood Haven used to have a quite long waiting list, not sure if it still has.

Martyn, you say that you saw one suitable mooring advertised.. Why didn't you take it?

Athy, I was outbid, unfortunately I was in hospital when the auction ended, reckon I had more important things on my mind at the time.

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10 hours ago, Martyndj said:

Yes, I can understand the so called " continuous moorers" taking the vacant spots but why were they not advertised on the website? It seems to me that it is a bit of a con and it all depends on who you know, really pisses me off!!

I very much doubt that any vacancies were just handed out without being advertised.

we wanted to buy a 30ft butty and was aware of a space on our stretch of mooring. We rang the mooring manager who said they weren't aware of any vacancies but they would come and measure the moorings. As a result they said there was a 40ft mooring space but they couldn't just let us have it as it would have to be advertised. Luckily we won the auction.

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16 hours ago, Martyndj said:

Yes, I can understand the so called " continuous moorers" taking the vacant spots but why were they not advertised on the website? It seems to me that it is a bit of a con and it all depends on who you know, really pisses me off!!

Are you sure all the sites that may be involved are ones where Waterside Mooring sell by auction to the highest bidder?

My understanding is that after the review, revamp of the website, and the name change to Waterside Mooring, CRT now offer more of their vacancies as "Buy it Now" than by competitive auction.  If that were the case, presumably a "Buy it Now" does not have to be on the website very long at all, if someone purchases it as soon as offered, and certainly not for the minimum 2 weeks if it was being auctioned.

Bear in mind also that if any new private moorings have been created nearby CRT close down one mooring in 10 of their directly managed moorings as part of their deal about createion of marina moorings. This can result in CRT sites that appera to have spaces, but where CRT will never let th

I was a meeting with CRT on Tuesday where we met the manager of Waterside Mooring, and a specific site, (not in that area) was questioned, because boats had moved into spaces not being auctioned.  The answer was that CRT may have empty spots created by the "1 for 10" rule, and whilst they cannot let those spaces as new business, if they have boats on other nearby moorings where there are issues, (e.g. collapsing banks), they can allow movements between sites, as log as OVERALL numbers of let moorings in the area are not increased. This would result in boats appearing at a CRT site where the space was never offered on the website, of course, but it is lefitimate under te rules, not some kind of fiddle.

None of this may apply in your case, but all things to be aware of.

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20 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

 

Bear in mind also that if any new private moorings have been created nearby CRT close down one mooring in 10 of their directly managed moorings as part of their deal about createion of marina moorings. This can result in CRT sites that appera to have spaces, but where CRT will never let them.
 

 

Yes, and when you're out cruising it is useful to know where they are!

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7 hours ago, alan_fincher said:

Bear in mind also that if any new private moorings have been created nearby CRT close down one mooring in 10 of their directly managed moorings as part of their deal about createion of marina moorings. This can result in CRT sites that appera to have spaces, but where CRT will never let t

This is the most un-business like practice i have come across .CRT need to make money and renting moorings is a good income .Marinas as a business need to attract customers as part of their business plan.Most boats i have seen on online moorings would not be welcome in lots of Marinas.There is no law that CRT have to do this ? 

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1 hour ago, b0atman said:

This is the most un-business like practice i have come across .CRT need to make money and renting moorings is a good income .Marinas as a business need to attract customers as part of their business plan.Most boats i have seen on online moorings would not be welcome in lots of Marinas.There is no law that CRT have to do this ? 

But surely CRT is responding to its customers who tell them they are fed up with passing long linear moorings on tickover.

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2 hours ago, b0atman said:

This is the most un-business like practice i have come across .CRT need to make money and renting moorings is a good income .Marinas as a business need to attract customers as part of their business plan.Most boats i have seen on online moorings would not be welcome in lots of Marinas.There is no law that CRT have to do this ? 

I think CRT are certainly not less well off as a result of doing this.

Take the example in an area where maybe a CRT linear mooring is £2,000, but a marina berth perhaps double that at £4,000.

CRT loose the potential £2000, but if 10 berths are created at £4,000 each, that is £40,000.  But CRT take a connection charge from the marina operator, usually about 9%, so in this example maybe £3,600.

That's nearly double coming in against what they have agreed to forgo.

Unbusiness-like?  Quite the opposite if you are a hard businessman, surely?  CRT make far more, and no longer have to do whatever is necessary to maintain and service a linear mooring.

However the fact that it makes it harder to get moorings at a reasonable cost much harder is a very different matter of course.

I amongst others have challenged this policy in areas where demand for moorings exceeds supply, (as recently as Tuesday!), and will continue to do so whenever there is an opportunity to do so.

Also, as has been said, many people moan a great deal about having to boat past miles of linear mooring, (although for me it goes with the territory, and you expect it and allow for it).



 

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4 hours ago, alan_fincher said:

I think CRT are certainly not less well off as a result of doing this.

Take the example in an area where maybe a CRT linear mooring is £2,000, but a marina berth perhaps double that at £4,000.

CRT loose the potential £2000, but if 10 berths are created at £4,000 each, that is £40,000.  But CRT take a connection charge from the marina operator, usually about 9%, so in this example maybe £3,600.

That's nearly double coming in against what they have agreed to forgo.

Unbusiness-like?  Quite the opposite if you are a hard businessman, surely?  CRT make far more, and no longer have to do whatever is necessary to maintain and service a linear mooring.

However the fact that it makes it harder to get moorings at a reasonable cost much harder is a very different matter of course.

I amongst others have challenged this policy in areas where demand for moorings exceeds supply, (as recently as Tuesday!), and will continue to do so whenever there is an opportunity to do so.

Also, as has been said, many people moan a great deal about having to boat past miles of linear mooring, (although for me it goes with the territory, and you expect it and allow for it).



 

The policy was also part of the deal when BW introduced their New Marina Policy some years ago. Previously there had been a variety of ad hoc arrangements, and prospective marina developers never knew what attitude BW would take to a new development, and so it was difficult to make the case to invest.  The new policy, drawn up in consultation with the trade, set up standard rules across the country for all new marina developments. These included the 9% connection charge Alan refers to, and the 1 for 10 removal of online moorings, intended both to reduce the long lines of moored boats for passing boaters, and to give a bit of a boost for marina berths. 

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Plus, CRT are subject to the competition commission regs- as a very large authority, they cannot legally significantly undercut private business in the area.

So when that marina is created, with more expensive moorings, the average price for a mooring in the area jncreases- and CRT have to raise their prices too, which I'm sure they are only doing out of legal duty and in no way doing it to maximise their income.

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