Jump to content

Marina Fees and when it goes wrong


pads

Featured Posts

So much has been written about the cost of moorings and the idyllic lifestyle of living on a boat.

Only what happens when it all goes wrong?

It's mighty sad when a close community of liveaboards breaks up and scatters, but that's what is happening in Tewkesbury, River Avon. Some have been at that Marina for over 20 years but are now having to look for new moorings. Why?

An introduction of a 'residential rate' was announced on 6th March to take effect from 1st April from the usual £214 a metre for narrow boats and £266 for wide-beams to £328 a metre for all residential berth holders and that has caused 'problems' for both narrow-boats and wide-beams owners alike.

After some 'mild mannered discussion', on the 21st March the tariff was dropped to £276 for narrow-boats and £296 for wide-beams. That's still one heck of a rise percentage wise.

Thus a 60 foot (18.3 m) narrow-boat is looking at £5050 at the revised rate and the same length wide-beam £5416.
Add the ANT license of £522 plus their residential license fee of £20.
And the Council Tax at Band A £1053.45

For a 60 footer that totals narrow boats £6645 and the same length wide-beam £7011
(Not including the compulsory boat insurance).

It's suddenly got really expensive and damage has been done, big time.

Most can't afford this price hike (especially the OAPS and those on fixed incomes) and they are shipping out.

A sad state of affairs is the breaking up of long term communities.

Edited by pads
bad formatting
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, lulu fish said:

I'm guessing you haven't tried claiming benefits recently?

A couple in our marina have (recently) successfully claimed, and now get their mooring, insurance, licence and BSS costs paid for.

It did take 3 meetings, about 6 months and copious amounts of paperwork, but so it should to 'weed-out' the scroungers. If you qualify you will get it.

  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Anyone who qualifies for the guaranteed part of pension credit will usually be "Passported" for housing benefit. In effect this means they will get the benefit quickly, and mooring fees council tax and license fees will be paid up to the "Local Housing Allowance" by the local authority. This can also be backdated depending on circumstances. The paperwork is not onerous and I found council staff most helpful.

Edited by sailor0500
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Benefits. Two tried for them a while ago.
One pensioner, one working zero hours contract (who had to sell up anyway).
The pensioner was 'advised' that if he came off the water he could receive help.
The zero hours contract was told that if his hours became regular (over 20 something hours a week) then he'd get help too.
On average, he worked 15 a week.

No, claiming benefits seems like a dead loss.
 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Those rents don't strike me as unreasonable. 

If they are more than the market will bear, the marina will suffer empty berths and have to reduce prices again. 

The UK operates a market economy which is rough on people sometimes. I still prefer it to the alternatives.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, pads said:

The pensioner was 'advised' that if he came off the water he could receive help.
The zero hours contract was told that if his hours became regular (over 20 something hours a week) then he'd get help too.

So, after incorrect advice, they just 'gave up' ?

 

There used to be a poster / member here whose 'job' involved these issues, he wrote a number of detailed posts about how to claim, who to contact and what to do when rejected.

Do a search.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I for a while claimed Housing benefits in two different council areas 2007 to 2014 Not a problem if income was below £148 a week .

Now i do not know what todays figure is but the new pension is about the region where i would not have been entitled ?

The simple way to check is the online Housing benefit if this says yes then you are on a winner.

  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mooring fees will go up until we get more marinas, which at the moment is a likelihood as the bubble has not burst and a good return on investment can be had.

It will be interesting to see how the Oxford canal Napton to Hilmorton fares with a new marina making more competition.

The council tax is only applicable to residential moorings with planning permission .Is there still a reduction for single person occupancy and does spare bedrooms affect benefits ?

 

  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Though i feel for those involved - a price hike can never be viewed as welcome , i cannot help but feel that this is simply supply & demand at work . The marina  is a business and demand is increasing & i expect the demand to continue increasing . 

Its a real shame but does highlight how precarious ones  situation is when they take on a mooring on which they want to live be it an " official " residential or mooring or an under the radar type , so to speak . 

Im down south & it staggers me the " premium " folks will pay to acquire a mooring with a boat , despite there being absolutely no long term guarantee of any sort with the moorings they take on . I expect many bury thier head in the sand - " It ll never happen to me " .... well it does happen unfortunately from time to time .

In this instance there appears to have been 3-4 weeks notice of fee increases and though more notice would have been fairer the marina management aren t obliged to give more are they ? 

To me , shame though it is , its simply a sign of the times . More and more folk living on boats will result in residential berthing fees only going in one direction & those who occupy them at the time of the increase will have the option to retain it or move elsewhere . 

Edited by chubby
  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

28 minutes ago, b0atman said:

I for a while claimed Housing benefits in two different council areas 2007 to 2014 Not a problem if income was below £148 a week .

Now i do not know what todays figure is but the new pension is about the region where i would not have been entitled ?

The simple way to check is the online Housing benefit if this says yes then you are on a winner.

If in difficulty, or just needing help, contact local Citizens Advice. They are one of the few such organsiations whose advice - whilst given face to face locally - is backed by  a national system of information to ensure best advice whenever possible (of course this does sometimes involve telling people that they cannot get that which they expect!)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think it's so much the resultant charges that's at issue, it's the rate of increase.  I remember Black Wednesday when some of us were looking at a sudden massive increase in our mortgage costs and seriously wondering where we were going to find the money.  So I feel for those on the receiving end and I think the marina could rightly be accused of bad management/planning if they have suddenly realised they need to increase their charges. 

Anything that breaks up a long standing community has my sympathy.   

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Graham Davis said:

Have you?
Are you saying that my comments are incorrect?

It might be difficult but it is possible.

You made it sound simple.  Some people seem to get benefits easily, but for many it is a huge struggle to get help.  My friend has been trying to get help for nearly two years now with no success.  She is chronically ill (currently in hospital) and can't seem to get any help at all.  I am very worried about how she will survive when she gets out of hospital, she has very little savings left and isn't capable of fully supporting herself.  It has been a very frustrating year for those of us trying to help her, so it is annoying to see people say things like "they can just get benefits if they can't afford it" as if it is a simple process. It can take a very long time and is very stressful.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's called capitalism,  get as much as you can the owner/shareholders deserve it. 

 

It doesn't make it easier for you, but if the owner is overseas his income has dropped 15% since the brexit vote due to the collapse of the pound and he wants to maintain his income.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

31 minutes ago, lulu fish said:

You made it sound simple.  Some people seem to get benefits easily, but for many it is a huge struggle to get help.  My friend has been trying to get help for nearly two years now with no success.  She is chronically ill (currently in hospital) and can't seem to get any help at all.  I am very worried about how she will survive when she gets out of hospital, she has very little savings left and isn't capable of fully supporting herself.  It has been a very frustrating year for those of us trying to help her, so it is annoying to see people say things like "they can just get benefits if they can't afford it" as if it is a simple process. It can take a very long time and is very stressful.  

You dont talk much sense usualy but you are spot on with this one. I so far in life have been lucky enough to never have to claim owt but it seems to me that if you go on benefits and make a lifestyle choice of it early on in life you can claim for everything for ever. However if you have looked after yourself for years and suddenly need help or if heaven forbid you have evr been self employed you are out on your own.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's a bad system if it's hard to negotiate. How can someone with limited understanding get needed help from the system set up to provide support for those in need. It shouldn't be that only those with intelligence, patience and grim determination get help. 

  • Greenie 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Jim Riley said:

It's a bad system if it's hard to negotiate. How can someone with limited understanding get needed help from the system set up to provide support for those in need. It shouldn't be that only those with intelligence, patience and grim determination get help. 

Completely agree and I have never seen any of the associated forms but would bet my boat on it that they are far from easy and utterly confusing in many cases. For several years I had a job that was ruled by utter ollocks paperwork that confused even those of us used to it. How on earth can someone who has probably faltered throughout life with paperwork get their head round such forms? I bet the reply is there is help out there for filling them in? but will that help always be available.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

Completely agree and I have never seen any of the associated forms but would bet my boat on it that they are far from easy and utterly confusing in many cases. For several years I had a job that was ruled by utter ollocks paperwork that confused even those of us used to it. How on earth can someone who has probably faltered throughout life with paperwork get their head round such forms? I bet the reply is there is help out there for filling them in? but will that help always be available.

Ollocks?? :rolleyes::lol: uncensored boating sites are available :lol:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The citizens advice people have been helping my friend with her forms as her condition means she can't keep her hand still enough to write and it is all so confusing for her. They have been great but even they have managed to get nowhere.

 

 

Edited by lulu fish
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Jim Riley said:

It's a bad system if it's hard to negotiate. How can someone with limited understanding get needed help from the system set up to provide support for those in need. It shouldn't be that only those with intelligence, patience and grim determination get help. 

It is worse than that (depending on your point of view): for complex assessments (such as for DLA) the criteria are published but too few of the claimants are aware of this unless they seek independent advice. Advisers reasonable well trained will be aware how seemingly similar replies can lead to very different scores and hence levels of benefit. OK, so it may well be designed to weed out those whose reply to anything is that they cannot help themselves, but any system devised for relatively unskilled operation will be a blunt instrument, one that is clearly skewed towards not giving out benefits.

There is no absolute standard by which it can unarguably be agreed that above you get no benefit, below you definitely do get help. It is inevitably a relative standard - in the 70's and 80's we became increasingly as a society concerned to make sure no-one was allowed to fall through a safety net. As a result, the total bill for benefits rose substantially (although perhaps not as much as some politicians and voters would like to believe and not always for the reasons oft quoted - life expectancy is the largest factor) with the result that the banking crisis was almost designed for those with a long standing ambition to fade 'the state' out of existence. Such people set the above mentioned bar at a very low level, believing that almost anyone should be capable of supporting themselves, if only they tried hard enough.

We have not gone that far (yet!) but there is very considerable downward pressure with the result that many people who have come to assume (either as a benefit recipient or otherwise) a given level of support are now disappointed that they do not qualify. Sadly, the fact that our streets (especially those in leafy suburban Surrey) are not stuffed full of people wholly incapable of finding anywhere else to live/survive, is grist to the mill of those seeking further reductions, or at least to justify the present cuts. 

We have entered an age of 'self' and so the overall trend will be to reduce benefits downwards yet further until the whole thing collapses. The sense that I grew up with that society did mean something (not that 'there is no such thing as society') is now much maligned and taxes are seen as something to be resisted at all costs rather than a part of a way of obtaining a fairer society. Sadly even self interest does not have an effect, recognizing that even for the better off, a fairer society will make their life better as well.

I don't actualluy believe that 'they' have deliberately created a complex system solely in order to deter as many potential claimants as possible - I don't think 'they' are that clever - but it is hard to avoid the conclusion that this is exactly what has happened and that there are few in positions to change it with a will to correct the problems.

  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.