Recommendation for external paint above water line

[Mikexx]

I have little to no experience of external paints suitable for a narrowboat.

I'm looking for a couple of standard colours.

I also assume that I will apply this by roller, after a quick sanding down of the old paint to provide a key for the new.

I have no idea what the old paint is.

 

[rusty69]

3 minutes ago, Mikexx said:

I have little to no experience of external paints suitable for a narrowboat.

I'm looking for a couple of standard colours.

I also assume that I will apply this by roller, after a quick sanding down of the old paint to provide a key for the new.

I have no idea what the old paint is.

 

Suggest you put what your budget is, as that may influence peoples suggestions.

Edited March 5, 2017 by rusty69

[Richard10002]

Craftmaster is quite amazing paint, but not cheap.

Watch all of these videos, pausing and rewinding as appropriate, and you will know as much as you can about boat painting, in a relatively short space of time.

 

http://www.johnbarnard.biz/tips-tricks-videos/

[dmr]

If its an older boat are you don't want the ultimate finish then a fair few people use Dulux Weathershield though no experience myself.

If you aspire to the shiny boat way of doing things, or just prefer using really good proper paints, then there are numerous boat enamels available at the chandlers, but expect to pay about £30 per litre. I prefer International Toplac as it covers well and is easy to use. (This is NOT the same International that B&Q sell, but a big proper marine company). I don't like Rylards, it needs lots of coats to cover. Symphony is ok. Craftmaster is the dogs bits but is aimed at professionals and I don't get on with it (except for their lovely raddle and varnish) cus Im not much good . Have heard bad reports about Midland Chandlers own brand but not used it myself.

If you put the paint on with a roller then you might want a second person with a brush to brush over it for a good finish.

.................Dave

[Taslim]

58 minutes ago, dmr said:

If its an older boat are you don't want the ultimate finish then a fair few people use Dulux Weathershield though no experience myself.

If you aspire to the shiny boat way of doing things, or just prefer using really good proper paints, then there are numerous boat enamels available at the chandlers, but expect to pay about £30 per litre. I prefer International Toplac as it covers well and is easy to use. (This is NOT the same International that B&Q sell, but a big proper marine company). I don't like Rylards, it needs lots of coats to cover. Symphony is ok. Craftmaster is the dogs bits but is aimed at professionals and I don't get on with it (except for their lovely raddle and varnish) cus Im not much good . Have heard bad reports about Midland Chandlers own brand but not used it myself.

If you put the paint on with a roller then you might want a second person with a brush to brush over it for a good finish.

.................Dave

This is so true.  Following on with a good quality brush can (almost) make it look like 'ya payed someone to paint it.

This best for 'posh paint' but works for B&Q best too.

Edited March 5, 2017 by Taslim
Pushed the right button at the wrong time.

[Neil2]

Once upon a time I subscribed to the view that external paint is external paint, and the dedicated boat stuff is just another example of how you double the price of something just by placing the word "marine" in front of it.

Experience has led me to believe otherwise.  I do think you get what you pay for, but bear in mind that a lot of the high end paint is intended to be used under "commercial" conditions, so you won't necessarily get the best out of it as a DIY solution.  

I'd second Toplac as a DIY paint, it seems to tolerate being applied in the outdoors and covers easily.  It's also widely available over the counter.  

[Mikexx]

This is an old boat so not looking for a perfect sheen.

My very limited experience says that roller produces a more uniform surface than brush. So I'm surprised that two here recommend brushing after rollering.

[rusty69]

I think the preparation is at least as important as the type of paint you use, if not more so. No point putting expensive paint on a poorly prepared surface (I'm not suggesting that the OP was going to do this)

Edited March 5, 2017 by rusty69

[WotEver]

1 minute ago, Mikexx said:

My very limited experience says that roller produces a more uniform surface than brush. So I'm surprised that two here recommend brushing after rollering.

The rollered finish will have a slight texture to it which is removed by laying off with a dry brush. 

[rusty69]

1 minute ago, Mikexx said:

This is an old boat so not looking for a perfect sheen.

My very limited experience says that roller produces a more uniform surface than brush. So I'm surprised that two here recommend brushing after rollering.

Layin off with a brush get rids of the effect of the roller, leaving a better finish

[Mikexx]

2 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

I think the preparation is at least as important as the type of paint you use, if not more so. No point putting expensive paint on a poorly prepared surface (I'm not suggesting that the OP was going to do this)

I was intending to clean and flat the existing coat.

Given the area, what is the best way of doing this?

[rusty69]

2 minutes ago, Mikexx said:

I was intending to clean and flat the existing coat.

Given the area, what is the best way of doing this?

A random  orbital sander is pretty good if you have access to electricity, although watching the video linked to above, they use a scabbler to remove the paint back to the steel(probably not necessary in your case) and then an orbital sander.

 

Ive not watched it all yet, but worth a look.

Edited March 5, 2017 by rusty69

[Taslim]

2 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

A random  orbital sander is pretty good if you have access to electricity.

Wot he said. and also the comment about good prep being the 'key' (sorry!) to a good finish.

It may seem counter intuitive but as rusy69 and WotEver say it makes a noticeable difference if you follow on with a good quality brush.

 

[ditchcrawler]

When I was an apprentice sparky we painted out vans in the company colour with Valspar paint. But is any paint today the same as it was 50 years ago?

[Chewbacka]

If painting it yourself on the side of the canal you will get dust, insects and brush marks visible in the paint (close up not perfect, but is ok at 2 or 3 meters) so in my opinion there is no point buying expensive boat paint.  Also if you do not take it back to metal then any defects in the existing surface such as rusty bits rubbed down, scratches, chips etc will show, the more so with a high gloss paint.

So in my opinion buy a decent oil based paint that is not too expensive and ideally not too glossy.  I painted mine over the existing paint in Dulux weathershield when it was still an oil based gloss on the mooring using a solvent resistant roller and laying off with a brush and am very happy with it. Though I must admit that had I paid someone £10k to do it I would be most upset with the finish.

You must also give the boat a good wash down before sanding.

 

Added - Weathershield may now be waterbased, in which case I would not use it as I hate water based gloss.  Find an alternative.

[Mikexx]

1 hour ago, Chewbacka said:

Added - Weathershield may now be waterbased, in which case I would not use it as I hate water based gloss.  Find an alternative.

 

Many thanks.

I had a quick look at the Dulux Safety Data Sheets for various Weathershield products. Judging by such features as boiling point, I think the gloss is still oil based. The satin finish is certainly not and even claims to be soluble in water.

[rusty69]

1 minute ago, Mikexx said:

 

Many thanks.

I had a quick look at the Dulux Safety Data Sheets for various Weathershield products. Judging by such features as boiling point, I think the gloss is still oil based. The satin finish is certainly not and even claims to be soluble in water.

One of the benefits of Dulux or Crown is that you can pop into one of their trade centres and have the colour you want mixed up.

However,if you do choose this route, make sure you don't take your misses with you. I made that mistake, she had a Turquiose handbag with her on the day. Guess what colour our boat is?

[Chewbacka]

The easy thing to check to see if it is gloss is it should have a high VOC.  if low or very low it is probably water based.  Certainly some wethershield is water based as I bought a can for my garage door without checking.   Upon use it was obviously water based, and the can showed this to be true.

As an aside, what two presents do you give to someone you hate?  A belt sander and a tin of water based gloss.

[IDS]

As the hull sides get most of the knocks and rubs in normal use then consider the option of painting up to gunwhale on the sides with black bitumen. Then its a simple job to touch it up once a year. We were advised this option by a professional boat painter. It works for us.

[Chewbacka]

2 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

One of the benefits of Dulux or Crown is that you can pop into one of their trade centres and have the colour you want mixed up.

However,if you do choose this route, make sure you don't take your misses with you. I made that mistake, she had a Turquiose handbag with her on the day. Guess what colour our boat is?

Just be grateful it wasn't a tartan handbag............ 

[bizzard]

4 hours ago, Mikexx said:

I have little to no experience of external paints suitable for a narrowboat.

I'm looking for a couple of standard colours.

I also assume that I will apply this by roller, after a quick sanding down of the old paint to provide a key for the new.

I have no idea what the old paint is.

 

If its bitumen on there you will have to get it all off, back to bare metal before painting with any other paints or the bitumen will burn and bleed through and ruin it. The only stuff which will cover and isolate bitumen ready to paint with coloured paints is to paint over the bitumen with aluminium wood primer. This will prevent the bitumen from burning and bleeding through new paint.But the adherance of paints on the aluminium wood primer is not terribly good.

[WotEver]

36 minutes ago, Chewbacka said:

Just be grateful it wasn't a tartan handbag............ 

I hate tartan paint. It's so difficult to keep the lines straight. 

[rusty69]

3 minutes ago, WotEver said:

I hate tartan paint. It's so difficult to keep the lines straight. 

Not if you get the ready mixed stuff!

[Chewbacka]

6 minutes ago, WotEver said:

I hate tartan paint. It's so difficult to keep the lines straight. 

Not if you use the special tartan paint roller, but what ever you do never roll the same area twice...............

[David Mack]

2 hours ago, Chewbacka said:

 

Added - Weathershield may now be waterbased, in which case I would not use it as I hate water based gloss.  Find an alternative.

Dulux in the DIY sheds is water based, but Dulux sold in trade suppliers such as Decorator Centre is oil based. They are quite happy to sell to retail customers.