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Have acquired a fairly serious window leak, actual source untraceable as usual although it SEEMS, unlikely as it sounds, to be coming in under the bottom of the hopper type windows These are very simple, just an aluminium gutter at the bottom (that the glass sits in) and frame at sides with a gutter at he top and a single piece of glass that either tilts in a bit to let the air in or gets shoved against the sides with a couple of wedges.  I'm going to scrape back to the metal all round the frame and lower gutter and whack it with sealant - question is, what's best? I was thinking Sikaflex?

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44 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

I'm going to scrape back to the metal all round the frame and lower gutter and whack it with sealant

To be clear, do you mean leave the window in place, and try and form a seal between the very edge of it and the boat steelwork, or are you planning to take it off, and clean up the steel it actually sits on?

The former is at best a short term bodge.

If doing the latter I would not use any of the sealants from a tube, but would use one of those "mastic strips on a roll" that looks "putty-like".  My preferred product is Glasticord, manufactured by Evostick, although that is hard to find sold in the kind of small quantities one actually needs.

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53 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

Have acquired a fairly serious window leak, actual source untraceable as usual although it SEEMS, unlikely as it sounds, to be coming in under the bottom of the hopper type windows These are very simple, just an aluminium gutter at the bottom (that the glass sits in) and frame at sides with a gutter at he top and a single piece of glass that either tilts in a bit to let the air in or gets shoved against the sides with a couple of wedges.  I'm going to scrape back to the metal all round the frame and lower gutter and whack it with sealant - question is, what's best? I was thinking Sikaflex?

As a temporary fix, captain tolleys creeping crack cure, it works really well

  • Greenie 1
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Agree about the Tolley's creeping crack cure.  I used it on a window that had a leak in the top corner.  It took several applications but it eventually sealed up the hole.

To do the job properly needs the window taking out; never use silicone, Sikaflex or mastic, use proper window tape.  If the window has been put in with Sikaflex (not uncommon) you will find out why when you try and take it out.

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Must admit I've never found Captain Tolley's to be any use at all, it creeps OK, runs out the other end but doesn't seem to seal anything.

I'm going to have to do something with the window frame in place - I'm not sure I can actually get it out without dismantling half the boat.  So at least at first I'm going to try sealing it round the edge.

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3 minutes ago, dor said:

To do the job properly needs the window taking out; never use silicone, Sikaflex or mastic, use proper window tape.  If the window has been put in with Sikaflex (not uncommon) you will find out why when you try and take it out.

I think the window predates Sikaflex by about fifty years. Taking it out is, i think, beyond my capabilities as it would mean dismantling quite a lot of the internal boat stuff, which I really don't want to do.  It's going to have to be a bodge of some sort...

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2 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

I think the window predates Sikaflex by about fifty years. Taking it out is, i think, beyond my capabilities as it would mean dismantling quite a lot of the internal boat stuff, which I really don't want to do.  It's going to have to be a bodge of some sort...

OK, go for the bodge - plenty of people do - but try and dig out some of the crud that is there so you can get some of the silicone between the window and the hull.   And remember silicone can affect subsequent painting (in my experience, not always - maybe some silicones are more prone to causing spots than others).

Tolley's cure works well if the gap is not too big; if too big it will just run through without hardening in the gap (I almost gave up on it in my leak, but it sealed well after the fourth or fifth application).

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I have drop back portholes which have a small hole in the bottom of the ally channel that the glass sits in.  The idea is that it is difficult to stop the water getting in, so collect it in the frame and let it drain out.  On mine the little draim hole blocks up from time to time and then it overflows into the boat.

So what I a getting round to saying is check your drain holes - if you have them - before removing windows etc.

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For bodging, I know some might scoff, but I have a tube of Everbuild roof and gutter sealant which is all I could lay my hands on when I had a similar problem about three years ago.  That window is still water tight.  

That Captain Tolleys stuff is really designed for grp boat window leaks I reckon every other grp boat ever made has a tube on board.  But I agree it doesn't work very well on metal windows.  

 

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4 hours ago, tree monkey said:

As a temporary fix, captain tolleys creeping crack cure, it works really well

Unlikely to be an issue in a boat, but I can say from experience that if you turn up at a festival and they find the syringe that comes with this product, you're might have to wait some time while the uniformed man with the little dog pulls your van to bits. Especially if he finds a pack of Rizlas with a bit of cardboard missing.

So I'm told!

  • Greenie 1
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4 hours ago, Chewbacka said:

I have drop back portholes which have a small hole in the bottom of the ally channel that the glass sits in.  The idea is that it is difficult to stop the water getting in, so collect it in the frame and let it drain out.  On mine the little draim hole blocks up from time to time and then it overflows into the boat.

So what I a getting round to saying is check your drain holes - if you have them - before removing windows etc.

Mine have the same - really good places for moss to grow.. That's all been cleared out - it's a weird leak.

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4 hours ago, dor said:

OK, go for the bodge - plenty of people do - but try and dig out some of the crud that is there so you can get some of the silicone between the window and the hull.

Would you use Silcone stuff or the polyeurothane sealants that set like rubber? Not sure I've spelt either right...

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38 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

Because?

Mainly because paint hates it and any future repaint or touch-up could have loads of problems but also because it fails (even the so-called UV protected stuff) in short order. 

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Also silicone is acidic (unless you get the neutral curing stuff), which I assume is why it smells a bit like vinegar, so it will attack the paint whilst it is setting, introducing a good source of future corrosion.

.............Dave

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Holts Seelastik used to be highly regarded stuff.

dunno if its still available, I have a very very old and very precious tube thats still good, if it was silicone it would have set hard years ago. Id o think we have gone backwards with silicone.

I found this, not sure if its the same stuff or a modern replica:

http://www.hellotrade.com/holt-lloyd-international/holts-seelastik-black.html

Does anybody remember dum dum ????

...................Dave

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22 hours ago, WotEver said:

My dad used to swear by Dum Dum but you can't buy it any more. It used to come in a tIn or tube and it sealed Morris Minor panels. Closest you can get these days is http://www.frost.co.uk/eastwood-flexible-strip-caulk-dum-dum-replacement.html

I had a tin and used it loads on my mini in the ever lasting and loosing battle against corrosion. From your link, there is something a little sad about a product advertised as "the nearest thing to (the real thing)".

.............Dave

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On 02/03/2017 at 11:52, blackrose said:

All my windows are bedded in with Marineflex. 

No boat should be without a tube of Sikaflex, Marineflex or Stixall (the latter being the cheapest and just as good). 

I have to disagree on that. Stixall is a good product and I use it a lot but it does not perform as well as Sikaflex particularly where there is any movement or stress within the joint. I would say a better budget alternative would be Puraflex which is cheaper than any of them.

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