Total Newbie (Not even got a boat yet)

[Wookiee]

Hello, I am thinking about buying a boat to live on permanently. Bit of background first, my wife and I are separating after nearly 13 years. We currently have a house together which neither of us can afford on our own, she is moving in to a rented house with a new fella in Feb and will be looking to buy a house around Feb next year. So I'm looking at alternative housing options. Before we met I was considering buying a boat to live on, not just from a financial point of view. Something about the lifestyle appealed and I've never been worried about having a big place with space, big garden and so on.

I have no idea with regards to what license I would need before I could buy and live on a boat, I would prefer to have a residential mooring rather than have to be moving every few weeks due to work and so on. There is a couple of marina's locally which have some boats advertised (a couple would be within budget too). Am I better off visiting the marina's where these are for sale and asking them for advice or is it better for me to do my own research first? As said I've no idea what is involved in the purchasing side of things. This isn't a recent idea, more one that I've had for a long time and maybe the upcoming separation is a sign to make the move onto water.

If anyone could get me some pointers I would be very grateful, I'm based in Milton Keynes so if there are any residential owners on here who would be happy to meet with me in person to give me some details that would be great. Thank you for taking the time to read/post.

[Boat&Bikes]

Hello and welcome. Lots of information on this site for you. Have a search. To kick things off though, only licence required is for your boat. It's not always a cheap option to live on a boat. I think minimum of around £4,000 per year to cover mooring, licence and insurance.Depending on where you wish to moor it maybe a lot more expensive. Have a good search through our forum.

 

Ian.

[jonsnow]

first of all my friend you wouldnt buy a house without a survey .dont have the surveyor the guys you buy the boat of ,its not has cheap has it use to be so yes do has much reading as possible .dont tell them how much you have to spend .and make sure the moorings with the sale of the boat .get your mooring first then your boat .other than that i could be on here till next year ,instead you be on here till next year and read has much about engines electrics has possible.fault finding and goon the crt website .every thing from licence to moorings a based on th foot length of your boat ,bigger the boat more it cost .these just a few pointers .i lived on a boat for 25 years now .i could go on all day lol good luck

[Wookiee]

Thank you for your replies, this is local and advertised with a mooring;

http://www.mkmarina.co.uk/used-boats/details/1107.aspx

Seems to have what I need, I'm not after anything big or fancy to be honest.

[Alan de Enfield]

.and make sure the moorings with the sale of the boat .....................

 

Very, very few boats that are for sale will automatically 'come with a mooring'.

Marinas are generally privately owned and the marina owner will require you to apply for a mooring and may, or may not accept you.

 

There is absolutely no security of tenure with a rented mooring (unlike a house / flat) and you can be evicted at a moments notice (It has happened in our marina recently) for any transgressions.

Thank you for your replies, this is local and advertised with a mooring;

 

http://www.mkmarina.co.uk/used-boats/details/1107.aspx

 

Seems to have what I need, I'm not after anything big or fancy to be honest.

 

Note the mooring is available "subject to contract" not 100% guaranteed.

[jonsnow]

like i said get your mooring first and make sure the boat comes with the mooring if its for sale there.and with all the leagality off buying a boat you wouldnt take there word for the boat comes with the mooring would you !

[dmr]

Most important, houses go up in value, boats go down in value, the state is getting worse and worse at looking after people in need. You will get old and unless you are lucky enough to die on the boat you may well need to move back to the land at some time in the future. Is there any way you can use your money from the house to buy a small flat to rent out and get a boat??????

If you can't do this then just get a boat anyway but do a LOT of research first and this will require getting onto the cut, looking, and talking to boaters, not just looking at stuff on the internet (though there is a lot of good stuff).

 

Boat life is often no cheaper than renting a flat and living on a boat and doing a full time job is not easy, but in general living on a boat is much better than living in a house.

 

...............Dave

[Athy]

Welcome to the forum, Wookiee. I'm sorry to learn of the circumstances which are pushing you towards boat ownership, but good luck with your search.

The boat which you spotlight is indeed a dear little thing, in both senses of "dear": it looks cute and cosy, comes from a reputable builder, but is a lot of money for a 24-old craft of that length.

I think that Ianali, above, has rather overestimated the costs of boating. Our annual expenditure on mooring, licence and insurance, for a 45-footer, come to about £2,000, though we're moored "bankside" (in an attractive Oxfordshire village) and not in a marina. Perhaps his figures include diesel, Calor gas, servicing & c., in which case he's not too far out.

[mross]

To live on board you will need a 'residential mooring'. Most marina moorings are 'non-residential' and you need to be 'away' a few days every month. A lot of people bend the rules but then there is the risk of being evicted (you and the boat) on little or no notice.

[lulu fish]

To live on board you will need a 'residential mooring'. Most marina moorings are 'non-residential' and you need to be 'away' a few days every month.

None of the above is true.

[mross]

None of the above is true.

Well, he said he didn't want to be a continuous cruiser so it is true! Instead of just contradicting people, why not come up with some facts/evidence.

[lulu fish]

Well, he said he didn't want to be a continuous cruiser so it is true! Instead of just contradicting people, why not come up with some facts/evidence.

You are the one making the daft claim, you provide the evidence. What rule or law says that live aboard boaters have to leave their leisure mooring for a few days per month?

[mross]

It's in the planning consent that the marina has. And they put it in their terms and conditions.

 

Look here https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/enjoy-the-waterways/boating/mooring-your-boat?gclid=Cj0KEQiAwrbEBRDqxqzMsrTGmogBEiQAeSE6Zb6fAs8U9ljlMUBsGcRvOBgAOm851jWpcYX7LLi7DOMaAqkV8P8HAQ

[dmr]

Many many boaters live on non res moorings including lots of on-line CaRT moorings. It is bending some rules but CaRT appear happy about this. At some time in the future a council might make trouble and a court case might end this, but it probably won't happen. You have no security on most proper residential moorings so its much the same.

 

..............Dave

[lulu fish]

It's in the planning consent that the marina has. And they put it in their terms and conditions.

 

Look here https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/enjoy-the-waterways/boating/mooring-your-boat?gclid=Cj0KEQiAwrbEBRDqxqzMsrTGmogBEiQAeSE6Zb6fAs8U9ljlMUBsGcRvOBgAOm851jWpcYX7LLi7DOMaAqkV8P8HAQ

There is nothing on that page that confirms your claim.

[Stilllearning]

There is nothing on that page that confirms your claim.

There is the paragraph about planning permission for residential moorings...

[lulu fish]

There is the paragraph about planning permission for residential moorings...

 

I what way does that back up his claim that "Most marina moorings are 'non-residential' and you need to be 'away' a few days every month" ?

[dmr]

I think that Ianali, above, has rather overestimated the costs of boating. Our annual expenditure on mooring, licence and insurance, for a 45-footer, come to about £2,000, though we're moored "bankside" (in an attractive Oxfordshire village) and not in a marina. Perhaps his figures include diesel, Calor gas, servicing & c., in which case he's not too far out.

 

Yes, but you are not full time liveaboard? and have probably been lucky with the "big bills".

Its hard to cost boat living as there are so many ways to do it from luxury down to just about existing.

We spent £4000-6000 on boat expenses every year and that's without a mooring and me doing 90% of the maintenance.

The unexpected big bills come so often they are no longer unexpected.

Water tank guage just broke this week, thats £50. Gearbox rebuild needed soon, that will be closer to £1000, and the starter alternator is making a funny noise.........

I bet it would cost a bob or two to rebuild that lovely engine of yours!

 

.........................Dave

[mross]

@lulu fish

 

There is some helpful advice here http://www.aina.org.uk/docs/AINA%20Residential%20Use%20of%20Waterways%20Advisory%20Doc%20Feb%202011.pdf

 

and I draw your attention to this paragraph.....

 

3.1.5 Failure to obtain planning permission: Planning Enforcement
A mooring operator should always make clear to the boater, as part of the mooring
agreement, the planning designation of the mooring (and hence the permitted use) and that
they are responsible for complying with local authority planning requirements.

[mross]

 

I what way does that back up his claim that "Most marina moorings are 'non-residential' and you need to be 'away' a few days every month" ?

Here is a list of long term moorings. Those which have residential moorings are marked with an 'R' You will see that they are in a minority.

 

http://liveaboard.proboards.com/thread/1618/lists-long-term-moorings-marinas

[lulu fish]

@lulu fish

 

There is some helpful advice here http://www.aina.org.uk/docs/AINA%20Residential%20Use%20of%20Waterways%20Advisory%20Doc%20Feb%202011.pdf

 

and I draw your attention to this paragraph.....

 

3.1.5 Failure to obtain planning permission: Planning Enforcement

A mooring operator should always make clear to the boater, as part of the mooring

agreement, the planning designation of the mooring (and hence the permitted use) and that

they are responsible for complying with local authority planning requirements.

Where is the bit that says they have to leave the mooring for a few days per month?

[Athy]

 

Yes, but you are not full time liveaboard? and have probably been lucky with the "big bills".

Its hard to cost boat living as there are so many ways to do it from luxury down to just about existing.

We spent £4000-6000 on boat expenses every year and that's without a mooring and me doing 90% of the maintenance.

The unexpected big bills come so often they are no longer unexpected.

Water tank guage just broke this week, thats £50. Gearbox rebuild needed soon, that will be closer to £1000, and the starter alternator is making a funny noise.........

I bet it would cost a bob or two to rebuild that lovely engine of yours!

 

.........................Dave

Yes, fair comments, and yes it would. Er, Gardners don't go wrong, do they?

My comments were based on Ianali's suggested figure of £4,000 to cover just mooring, licence and insurance, which are constants whether one lives aboard or not (unless one is a CCer of course). I am out of touch with marina fees, but perhaps for a very long boat parked in a marina, their figures would be realistic.

[mross]

At both marinas I have used it was in the T&C's that you could not stay on your boat for more than x number of days in a month.

[Stilllearning]

Just as an example, Tingdene who run about 9 marinas, state that residential use is prohibited. No doubt most other marinas say something very similar.

[Peter X]

Thank you for your replies, this is local and advertised with a mooring;

 

http://www.mkmarina.co.uk/used-boats/details/1107.aspx

 

Seems to have what I need, I'm not after anything big or fancy to be honest.

It looks to be in reasonable condition, but that sounds quite a lot of money for a boat of that size and age. Much would depend on the condition of the hull and engine. Bear in mind that the location where you buy a boat doesn't matter much, so long as it has an engine which is in working order or can be made so. Supply and demand means that boat prices tend be lower away from London, particularly up north, to the extent that it can be wise to buy up there then move the boat to where you want it, if you have the time/inclination/crew. If a marina has spare berths, they won't exclude you because you bought your boat elsewhere.

 

The discussion about "residential" berths rather obscures what you need to know, which is that while a majority of places are "leisure" berths, being on one of those will be fine so long as you don't upset the marina owner in some way. A few marinas are picky about it, but most will be happy to turn a blind eye to someone living aboard, especially if you keep a low profile, don't annoy other boaters and take the boat out for the odd trip now and again.

 

I see that the advert gives the cabin headroom as 8'7", which would be a real plus for a Wookie. However this just shows the importance of viewing a boat, as I think that height is a mistake or misprint.