Pump out toilet blocked?!

[silverlode]

Hello!

I was in the right place at the right time and got an excellent deal on a narrowboat recently. The hull survey was all fine but the boat had been on the market a long time, not least because the previous owner had left it in a disgusting state. The toilet tank was completely full, and had been left that way for several months. I recently had it pumped out, and the people at the boatyard talked me through what they were doing, (I'm tptally new to all this) and said its good practice to rinse it out fully with water.

My problem is, I think they didn't empty the water out after rinsing! I was several hours away before I noticed, and when i pressed the flush button, there was.. nowhere for it to go. Does this sound like a full tank? Or is there another way these toilets can get blocked to an extent that even just water won't go down? And if so, is there anything I can do?

Thank you!

[Karen Lea Rainey]

You may need a stick to push down the hole, (call it a poo stick), sometimes you get a build up right beneath the drop hole, particularly if it hasnt moved for a while, you may think its full but a swirl with a stick may well cure it,

Thats what happened on my boat once,, not a nice job though,

[NB Lola]

Just checking, is this a macerator one or dump through?

[Dave Payne]

As Karen says, stick a long bit of thin wood or metal pole down the pump out hole on the outside of the boat, give it a good wiggle.

 

This is the only place you can get a blockage if you have a dump through, and happens easily, mine had one but a good rocking when pumping got rid of it.

[silverlode]

Just checking, is this a macerator one or dump through?

Just a dump through I think... I know i should know!

You may need a stick to push down the hole, (call it a poo stick), sometimes you get a build up right beneath the drop hole, particularly if it hasnt moved for a while, you may think its full but a swirl with a stick may well cure it,

Thats what happened on my boat once,, not a nice job though,

Thanks, 'll give it a try - I hope that's all it is after paying for it to be emptied!

As Karen says, stick a long bit of thin wood or metal pole down the pump out hole on the outside of the boat, give it a good wiggle.

 

This is the only place you can get a blockage if you have a dump through, and happens easily, mine had one but a good rocking when pumping got rid of it.

Thanks Dave, I'll give it a poke and see what happens...

Edited January 21, 2017 by silverlode

[Victor Vectis]

The OP said "when I pressed the flush button" so I'd guess it's a macerator.

 

And if thats the case, and it aint clearing, then.............its blocked.

 

To clear it the pan will need lifting so that the macerator and associated gubbins can be got at and dismantled. This is NOT a nice task (I nearly said job!)

(And one might wonder how I know this)

 

For future reference, if it is a macerator then you have to be careful what you put down it. Faeces, urine and water are OK. You have to be careful about any paper you use, the cheaper and nastier (ie disintegrates when it looks at water) the better.

Cotton wool buds, wet wipes sanitary products etc etc are a real no no.

 

Hope this helps.

 

ETA Just read the previous post, so just ignore the above!

Edited January 21, 2017 by Victor Vectis

[silverlode]

The OP said "when I pressed the flush button" so I'd guess it's a macerator.

 

And if thats the case, and it aint clearing, then.............its blocked.

 

To clear it the pan will need lifting so that the macerator and associated gubbins can be got at and dismantled. This is NOT a nice task (I nearly said job!)

(And one might wonder how I know this)

 

For future reference, if it is a macerator then you have to be careful what you put down it. Faeces, urine and water are OK. You have to be careful about any paper you use, the cheaper and nastier (ie disintegrates when it looks at water) the better.

Cotton wool buds, wet wipes sanitary products etc etc are a real no no.

 

Hope this helps.

 

ETA Just read the previous post, so just ignore the above!

Thank you for that - I don't know what type it is for certain, I know that sounds daft! I'm not fully on the boat but I will be from next week, so will update then.

Because I'm sure everyone is dying to know about my toilet escapades! ?

[Dave Payne]

Do you push a button and it takes stuff away, or do you press a pedal and it drops down.

[alan_fincher]

Thank you for that - I don't know what type it is for certain, I know that sounds daft! I'm not fully on the boat but I will be from next week, so will update then.

Because I'm sure everyone is dying to know about my toilet escapades!

 

A dump through has to sit directly on top of the holding tank, and typically has a lever that rotates a flap that is actually a convex shape.

 

Once that lever is operated and the flap rotated out of the way, you are peering directly into the tank, so it should be obvious if either there is a total build up of solids under the dump through, or the holding tank has been left full of liquid.

 

But if you have any other type it is more complex, and there will be no lever that opens a simple flap that allows you to peer straight into the waste. If there is an electrical button to operate it, it is probably not a dump through.

 

So should be fairly simple to work out which, but a picture would no doubt result in someone telling you what you have, probably down to an exact make and model.

 

EDIT: Please avoid pictures of actually looking down through an open flap!

Edited January 21, 2017 by alan_fincher

[silverlode]

 

A dump through has to sit directly on top of the holding tank, and typically has a lever that rotates a flap that is actually a convex shape.

 

 

Haa! No explicit photos, I promise!

 

Ok, then it's definitely a dump through, therefore it's seeming likely that it's just not been emptied...

 

Nothing else would make the flush water stay in the toilet bowl from what I understand. £15 down the pan, literally. Sigh.

[mross]

Maybe the tank is empty and there's just a dried crust at the top? Good luck!

[silverlode]

Maybe the tank is empty and there's just a dried crust at the top? Good luck!

Oh my god, maybe it is poo crust... and it's not even mine! D:

[mross]

It's not a silver lode ! If it is a poo crust, as well as punching a hole through it, you will need to break up the rest of it.

[Dave Payne]

Poke something down the hole in the loo, if it breaks through then happy days, be careful as you may some blowback!!

 

As its a dump through, only two points to look at, the hole in the bowl, or the pipe that runs from outside which should run down to near the bottom of your tank, this is the bottleneck and may be blocked.

[Boat&Bikes]

Might it be that the boatyard didn't pump it out correctly? I stopped off last Autumn at a boat club. They connected and ran the pump, then rinsed followed by a final pump out. I realised a day later that their pump must have been poorly as I had more in the tank than prior to them attempting to empty it. I won't return there...I would check it's actually been emptied.

 

Ian.

[dmr]

Sometimes the water valve sticks open and the tank fills up with clean water (which will look like sewage once it gets into the tank).

 

When you operate the flush lever then clean water flows into the bowl and down the hole, when you release the lever the water continues to flow for a short while then stops. Either the valve itself, or the operating lever can get sticky. If this was the case you should (might) have heard your fresh water pump running from time to time. Sticking issues might be more likely if the boat has stood unused for a long time?

 

.............Dave

[NB Lola]

An important point to note is the op's original statement about the tank having been full and for sale for some time. Chances are it is/was a bit crusty.

[stegra]

If you chuck a biological washing capsule (or some powder) in every now and then the enzymes help to break everything down into liquid. Even strong loo roll seems to break up well. Do this in a cassette toilet and there's no need for chemicals so you can dispose down a normal toilet if necessary.

[Ssscrudddy]

I recently changed mine from pumpout (dump through) to cassette. 1 of the problems I had was I was getting less & less use out of it each time, to the point where it would only last a week, & certainly didnt look like it had been emptied even though nothing more would come out. I assumed the pipe through which you pump out was probably rotting in the tank & didnt reach as far down as it used to.

Anyway once the tank was removed it wasnt the pipe (which was plastic & hadnt rotted), it turns out the damn tank was over half way full with dried up loo roll.

I did my research & opted for pumpout when I first bought my boat.

Everything I read said NOT to put chemicals in there (think Elsan Blue), the idea being biological action action would break down the contents into slurry.
For this stuff to broken down into slurry, it needs to be covered by liquid, hence the poo stick that people have mentioned, else you get a pile of poo & paper that isnt covered by liquid. Far better to shove it out of the way rather than fill it with loads of water. (I believe I broke mine by not peeing in it enough)

The idea of Elsan blue containing Formaldehyde is that it kills all biological action dead. (& it's perfumed). It makes no claims to do anything else. So dont use it in your tank.

Thetfords version of the stuff is called Aquakem blue, & they say they havent used formaldehyde since 2003 (although I'm sure I read somewhere it has 10% formaldehyde but I cant find it again). This Aquakem blue also claims to help liquify the waste.

There are other products as well, & as other have said Baby Bio, Biological washing powder, etc.

The point is you need to get that stuff liquified. That was the problem with my toilet, it wasnt liquifying, & over time the paper built up & stayed in the tank.

As an aside, once I'd changed to a cassette toilet & went looking for the various 'blue' products, I came across loads of posts where people did use Elsan blue or other products containing formaldehyde in their black tanks.

Edited January 22, 2017 by Ssscrudddy

[NB Lola]

Lessons are never learned about using poor quality loo paper. Our macerator works fine. We use enzyme based solutions and it all works as expected and will continue to do so as long as we use some intelligence and maintain our system.

[Iain_S]

Sometimes the water valve sticks open and the tank fills up with clean water (which will look like sewage once it gets into the tank).

 

When you operate the flush lever then clean water flows into the bowl and down the hole, when you release the lever the water continues to flow for a short while then stops. Either the valve itself, or the operating lever can get sticky. If this was the case you should (might) have heard your fresh water pump running from time to time. Sticking issues might be more likely if the boat has stood unused for a long time?

 

.............Dave

 

Very true.

And if its stuck it won't stop when the tank and loo are full, only when the water tank is empty. The only upside in this case is that the water in the cabin bilge is clean, as it has just passed across the top of the loo.

 

Don't ask how I know this.

[Ssscrudddy]

Or when you turn the water pump off until you get it unstuck...

[pophops]

It seems to me that the reason that the tank was full when you bought the boat may be because it couldn't be emptied.

Either the hose from the tank or pick-up pipe could be blocked or perhaps the hose is split or detached, in which case there would be no vacuum to draw out the waste. This may be the reason that your recent pump-out failed to empty the tank.

[dmr]

 

Very true.

And if its stuck it won't stop when the tank and loo are full, only when the water tank is empty. The only upside in this case is that the water in the cabin bilge is clean, as it has just passed across the top of the loo.

 

Don't ask how I know this.

 

I think I know how you know this. Happened to us on a hire boat many years ago but we spotted it just as the tank got to full. Now as liveaboards I have tried to get into the routine of flush bog - wait till water has stopped flowing-wash hands etc - check water has stopped again - leave bathroom. This is also another reason why the fresh water pump should be audible.

As too your overflow, I don't fully understand this. I thought the Traveller had an overflow passage then drained back into the tank, but this can be blocked by fitting the main seal "washers" back to front (there is a suitable hole in the seal washers). I have pondered this because if its the case then why does a bit of pong not escape? unless there is a mini-trap built into the overflow route?. I will have a better look next time I overhaul the bog.

 

...............Dave

[ditchcrawler]

 

I think I know how you know this. Happened to us on a hire boat many years ago but we spotted it just as the tank got to full. Now as liveaboards I have tried to get into the routine of flush bog - wait till water has stopped flowing-wash hands etc - check water has stopped again - leave bathroom. This is also another reason why the fresh water pump should be audible.

As too your overflow, I don't fully understand this. I thought the Traveller had an overflow passage then drained back into the tank, but this can be blocked by fitting the main seal "washers" back to front (there is a suitable hole in the seal washers). I have pondered this because if its the case then why does a bit of pong not escape? unless there is a mini-trap built into the overflow route?. I will have a better look next time I overhaul the bog.

 

...............Dave

I fitted one of these in the water supply line so you press it before you flush. https://www.heatandplumb.com/acatalog/ultra-self-closing-exposed-shower-valve-a3788?utm_source=google&utm_medium=Shopping&v=1484978422&gclid=Cj0KEQiAzZHEBRD0ivi9_pDzgYMBEiQAtvxt-LflO_FRp6Rwz_4UVG7ecaHz5Z1BaMwywWjnHcOvqWUaAj6F8P8HAQ