Dutch Barge on Canal Du Midi

[Ratty & Moley]

I think I may have lost all sense of sanity ! I'm thinking about purchasing a Dutch barge in France and to use it as a commercial venture. I'd love to hear from others who may have done this and especially hear from any female barge owners.

[Guest]

I think I may have lost all sense of sanity ! I'm thinking about purchasing a Dutch barge in France and to use it as a commercial venture. I'd love to hear from others who may have done this and especially hear from any female barge owners.

I would register with the Dutch Barge Association and pose your question there.

[cheshire~rose]

I think I may have lost all sense of sanity ! I'm thinking about purchasing a Dutch barge in France and to use it as a commercial venture. I'd love to hear from others who may have done this and especially hear from any female barge owners.

 

If you use Facebook there is a very helpful group on there called Women on Barges. It is a group consisting of women from all over there world who own barges of all different types but there are a large number of them based in France or with experience of France.

[Ratty & Moley]

Thank you both - have joined WOB on Facebook. I didn't even know such groups existed so thanks fir that

[NbPlod]

I worked as cook on a hotel barge in France last summer. I too have been thinking about some sort of canal based business. If you would like to compare notes, get in touch.

[bargemast]

Depending on what you have in mind as a commercial venture, if it is to make it into an hotel-barge, I think you'll better think twice (or to be safer more often)

 

There are already loads of hotel-barges on the Midi, and all over the country too.

 

Having a barge, even a very nice and comfortable one, doesn't automaticly get you the passengers you need to recuperate your investment.

 

I had one year on the Midi in '81 with an hotel-barge I owned at the time, of course this was many years before internet came in.

 

In the days that I was there, publicity was very expensiven nowadays you don't need that, all you need is a good web-site, but even then passengers need time to get used to a new-comer, they like to be able to read what previous clients had to say about their holidays on your boat.

 

Of course all of the above is of no value if you're thinking about a different commercial venture, but keep your eyes and ears open wide, as everything looks nice and beautiful, but might not be the same once you're in it.

 

Good luck with your venture.

 

Peter.

Edited December 2, 2016 by bargemast

[The Bagdad Boatman (waits)]

Tam and Di are the people to talk to.

[Tam & Di]

I think I may have lost all sense of sanity ! I'm thinking about purchasing a Dutch barge in France and to use it as a commercial venture. I'd love to hear from others who may have done this and especially hear from any female barge owners.

 

What size, and in what manner?

[bargemast]

Tam and Di are the people to talk to.

 

I think that the best people to talk to are the people that are already doing what the OP is planning to do, unless it's something completely new.

 

Tam & Di are the people to talk to if she needs a licence to drive her barge, but as they've (more or less) retired, and have sold their barge, I think I understood that they can't do licences for barges over 20m anymore.

 

The autorities have been pretty easy with foreigners operating barges in France, but they are slowly getting a bit more strict.

 

Peter.

[hounddog]

I know someone selling one, a hotel boat business on the midi, a pretty successful one as it happens. As to the OP Dutch hotel boats are pretty rare as they are not particularly space efficient - obviously a vast generalisation but the one's people point out, the pretty ones, are fairly impractical as hotel boats.

[Athy]

I know someone selling one, a hotel boat business on the midi, a pretty successful one as it happens. As to the OP Dutch hotel boats are pretty rare as they are not particularly space efficient - obviously a vast generalisation but the one's people point out, the pretty ones, are fairly impractical as hotel boats.

This perhaps explains why the few hotel boats I've seen down there have been converted péniches - bluffer shape = more internal space, I guess.

[Ratty & Moley]

What size, and in what manner?

Tam hi

 

It's 24 meters - currently moored in Vias. No longer used as a hotel barge but was in the past . 2 double cabins on suite and sofa bed in the galley for additional 2 people who would need to share a bathroom with cabin folk . Price reduced from 130k to 95.

I'm just not sure of the demand as I know there are many hotel barges about charging huge amounts of money. Being limited to 4 possibly 6 people at a push is this going to be worthwhile to run as a business ?? Appreciate your views Aileen

[hounddog]

That's the one.

[Tam & Di]

It's 24 meters - currently moored in Vias.

 

Hi,

 

As Peter says, although an International Certificate of Competence (ICC) as accepted for steering a private pleasure craft, as soon as you take even one paying guest you should really have a French Extension Grande Plaisance (EGP) as a minimum. We're the only authorised school able to examine in English, but although not absolutely retired yet we will almost certainly do so fairly shortly. After that you'd need to get the EGP from a school in Lyon or Paris. There are several operators who do rely on an ICC and generally manage to 'get away with it', though there are also a couple that had to do a quick bunk into Belgium. It depends on how much you draw attention to yourselves, but also the French have this thing where it is regarded as 'a good thing' to report anyone doing anything 'unlegal' to the authorites - it would most likely be a rival business which did that.

 

Financially it could be risky, especially if this is your only income and you had no savings to rely on until it took off. A 24m craft taking 2 couples is never going to make you rich - the people going on such a holiday are mostly Americans and they demand top comfort for their top dollar. You're more likely to rely on UK people - friends and family initially - as they are more prepared to rough it, but with the current value of the pound in free fall there will probably be even fewer of those. The Canal du Midi is already heavily over-supplied with hotel boats so you are entering a highly competitive market. From the price it sounds like the vessel could be rather sad and tired looking - even more so if you are quoting a price in €uros. Even in the present terrible market for sellers any reasonable craft in condition ready to trade is probably going to be £120.000 sterling and upwards. Any craft ≥20m must soon have a Community Certificate - the deadline is rapidly aproaching and I would suggest walking away now if it does not yet have one, or at least make that a condition of purchase.

 

Your insurance costs will be fairly high to indemnify you against risks including the often petty claims made by cheeky passengers, plus the possibility of poisoning them (I've put a smiley, but we have to have that for our trainees). Insurers would require regular dry-docking and surveys, and there would be plenty of maintenance costs too. Licence fees are very steep compared to the ridiculously cheap requirements for a private boat, but a friend who operates an up-market 30m charter ship for 6 guests got the VNF to accept that he need only pay that rate for any month in which he had bookings.

 

So that is mostly the downside. On the other hand if it is something you really want to do and can afford the possibility that it does not fly then go ahead. I've not tried to find which boat you have in mind and don't have any clear idea of its appearance, but even if Brexit means fewer UK people want to or can afford to buy barges to cruise in Europe there are still plenty of Americans and Australians to sell it to later.

[hounddog]

It's a British registered boat ( IIRC) so could have all that to deal with. From the price reduction and what I know I think the owner wants to move quickly. It's a fairly well found ship just passed its TREVNI ( again no expert ) but the downside is it's not posh and it doesn't hold many guests. Compared to, for instance, le Roi du Soleil. I believe you have crossed paths with the owner Tam.

[bargemast]

It's a British registered boat ( IIRC) so could have all that to deal with. From the price reduction and what I know I think the owner wants to move quickly. It's a fairly well found ship just passed its TREVNI ( again no expert ) but the downside is it's not posh and it doesn't hold many guests. Compared to, for instance, le Roi du Soleil. I believe you have crossed paths with the owner Tam.

 

"le Roi Soleil" is a converted Dutch barge, it's amongst the most beautiful hotel-barges on the Midi, and I'm sorry to say, I can't understand why you say that Dutch barges aren't spacious enough as hotel barges, unless you have a particular type of Dutch barge (that you didn't name) in mind.

 

There are a few boats operating that only take 4 to 6 passengers (also for licence reason) that are highly succesful for a small group of friends or a family that doesn't want to be part of a number of other guests that they don't know, and possibly don't want to be with even.

 

Peter.

[Athy]

 

 

 

There are a few boats operating that only take 4 to 6 passengers (also for licence reason) that are highly succesful for a small group of friends or a family that doesn't want to be part of a number of other guests that they don't know, and possibly don't want to be with even.

 

Peter.

I can believe that a group of only four to six may be socially attractive for passengers; but I wonder if it is equally attractive commercially for the operators.

[bargemast]

I can believe that a group of only four to six may be socially attractive for passengers; but I wonder if it is equally attractive commercially for the operators.

 

Sadly to say that I've lost track a bit with quite a lot of people that were running hotel barges with 4 to 6 passengers very successfully.

 

Less passengers on a more private cruise where people are prepared to pay top dollar for, could give a very nice income, with less overhead, as you don't need the same amount of crew, a big car, or a limousine is more luxurious than a minibus (or bigger bus).

 

If I just coïncidently happen to see any of them,(if I don't forget) I will ask them to handover their book keeping for you to study to see if it's commercially attractive enough.

 

Btw, are you thinking about a big change in life to start in this business too, or is it just curiousity ?

 

Peter.

[hounddog]

it's a tricky sum, the per person rate has to be high enough meaning the accommodation standard has to match.

 

is the Roi Soleil Dutch? I thought it was a peniche. Might be wrong.

[bargemast]

it's a tricky sum, the per person rate has to be high enough meaning the accommodation standard has to match.

 

is the Roi Soleil Dutch? I thought it was a peniche. Might be wrong.

 

Yes, I'm sorry to disappoint you but you are wrong in this case.

 

I'm fairly sure that she was converted in the Netherlands, but my memory is failing to remember where this was.

 

If you look at her sheer, do you still think that she's a converted "Péniche" ?

 

You probably know a lot about her already, but this may be nice to see for others too

 

http://boutiquehotelbarges.com/roi-soleil.php

 

Peter.

[hounddog]

A totally different class of operation to the one being discussed ( without a hell of an added investment )

[Ron T]

Tam hi

 

It's 24 meters - currently moored in Vias. No longer used as a hotel barge but was in the past . 2 double cabins on suite and sofa bed in the galley for additional 2 people who would need to share a bathroom with cabin folk . Price reduced from 130k to 95.

I'm just not sure of the demand as I know there are many hotel barges about charging huge amounts of money. Being limited to 4 possibly 6 people at a push is this going to be worthwhile to run as a business ?? Appreciate your views Aileen

Hello Aileen,we spent six months on the Midi including Vias in 2014,I know the barge and owner plus dog quite well,great bloke!Loved the barge it has plenty to offer for just a few guests and was either self catering or the owner would look after you.I'd imagine that if you got your advertising right you could have a great business welcoming paying guests.I know there were quite a few barges on the Midi then and the established barges were flat out and full,some of the lesser known ones appeared to be struggling.Will head down that way next year [leave our boat in the north]for a week or so,if you do the deal give me a yell and you've got a couple of customers.{If it is the Barge I am thinking of that is}

[Athy]

The web site is shy about giving many details of the boat's history, but I get the impression that she's a fairly new build - 1990s perhaps.

[Ron T]

The web site is shy about giving many details of the boat's history, but I get the impression that she's a fairly new build - 1990s perhaps.

I might have the wrong barge Athy but if not she is old[looked in great condition]and riveted.

[Athy]

I might have the wrong barge Athy but if not she is old[looked in great condition]and riveted.

The web site says that Le Roi Soleil is "resembling a sleek yacht of the 1930s", not that she is really a 1930s build, hence my comment.