Jump to content

Tardebigge to Gas Street then Stratford (if possible)


Eternal422

Featured Posts

Hello everyone! New member and relatively new to boating - had a day boat from Tardebigge and also myself and my wife have done the RYA Inland Waterways helmsman course over 2 days (great fun and learnt loads!).

 

We are now planning our first canal holiday in April and have hired a boat from Anglowelsh at Tardebigge for 7 days and wanting to cruise to Gas Street on the first day. However, as we won't be picking the boat up until 2pm (and the small print says you may not be away until 3pm) I'm wondering whether it's possible to get to Gas Street basin by around 7pm. Canalplan.org reckons on this being 5 hours 22 mins for the roughly 12 miles. As there are no locks I would have thought even averaging 3mph we could do this in 4 hours? Or is this too ambitious and not feasible?

 

The idea is to then go down the Farmer's Bridge locks and out eventually onto the Grand Union to head to Kingswood Junction and then onto the Stratford canal to see if we can get to Stratford before returning to Tardebigge.

 

This holiday will be just the two of us - not afraid of a bit of work throught the locks, but obviously don't want it to be too stressful as the idea of unwinding and enjoying using the journey is more important than getting anywhere specifically.

 

Any thoughts and advice would be very welcome! Thank you.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Canal plan.org has I think 2.5 mph as the default narrow canal speed. Normally one can go faster so yes I think 4 hours is feasible in a fairly shallow drafted boat. The long tunnel may slow you down a bit.

 

Yes I think you should make Stratford, you can of course return via the N Stratford which is much quicker than via the grand Union. Just be aware that the Stratford canal can get quite busy in the high season and sometimes one gets stuck behind slow coaches on the locks. Depending on the time of year you may of course have long evenings to cruise in if necessary.

 

Oh I forgot to say "welcome to the forum!".

Edited by nicknorman
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Without having put it into canalplan I would say that it is possible, but not relaxing you will need a holiday afterwards!

 

Day 1 centre of Birmingham

Day 2 Catherine de Barnes

Day 3 Kingswood junction

Day 4 Stratford

Day 5 Kingswood junction

Day 6 Hockley Heath

Day 7 Tardibigge

 

You probably can make it so you got past Kingswood and stopped short on the way back to make those two days a bit easier.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Without having put it into canalplan I would say that it is possible, but not relaxing you will need a holiday afterwards!

 

Day 1 centre of Birmingham

Day 2 Catherine de Barnes

Day 3 Kingswood junction

Day 4 Stratford

Day 5 Kingswood junction

Day 6 Hockley Heath

Day 7 Tardibigge

 

You probably can make it so you got past Kingswood and stopped short on the way back to make those two days a bit easier.

 

I would roughly agree with that. Playing around with the route in canalplan and adjusting the overnights for suitable stopping locations (with pubs) gives the following:

 

Partial first day of trip On the the Worcester and Birmingham Canal (Birmingham to King's Norton), at Gas Street Basin (as instructed). This is 13 miles, 3½ furlongs and 0 locks and will take 5 hours 22 minutes. First full day of trip On the the Grand Union Canal (Warwick and Birmingham Canal: widened section - Main Line), at Catherine de Barnes Bridge No 78 (as instructed). This is 10 miles, 7¼ furlongs and 25 locks and will take 7 hours 11 minutes. Second full day of trip On the the Stratford Canal (South), at Wootton Wawen Bridge No 53 (as instructed). This is 12 miles, 6¾ furlongs and 22 locks and will take 8 hours 22 minutes. Third full day of trip On the the Stratford Canal (South), at Bancroft Basin (as instructed). (Turn here tonight or tomorrow morning).

This is 7 miles, ½ furlongs and 17 locks and will take 5 hours 21 minutes. Fourth full day of trip On the the Stratford Canal (South), at Fleur de Lys PH (as instructed). This is 11 miles, ½ furlongs and 25 locks and will take 8 hours 26 minutes. Fifth full day of trip On the the Stratford Canal (Northern Section), at Blue Bell Cider House (as instructed). This is 6 miles, 7¾ furlongs and 28 locks and will take 7 hours 23 minutes. Last day of trip On the the Worcester and Birmingham Canal (Diglis Basin to King's Norton Junction), at Anglo-Welsh Canal Boat Hire. This is 16 miles, ½ furlongs and 1 lock and will take 6 hours 47 minutes.

This shows that you will need to put in some quite long days, but you do get half a day or so off to have a look around Stratford.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Given that you are relative novices, I'd say that canal plan is a little optimistic on lock times. It makes no allowance for delays at locks, low pounds etc.

 

Also, the 2.5mph isn't far off for Tardebigge to Gas Street when you consider the tunnels (4 of them) and passing moored boats. I'm very familiar with that stretch and I'd be surprised if you did it in under 5 hours. Under 4.5 and you're probably speeding in parts. Having said that, it seems virtually standard for hire boats to speed when heading into town between King's Norton and Brum. The canal isn't all that wide and the edges are shallow. When I've been moored along there I've had my shelves emptied when boats have passed so quick it's drawn all the water out from under my boat.

 

Canal boating holidays should be relaxing. Why start out as if you're in a race?

Edited by Dave_P
  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Canal boating holidays should be relaxing. Why start out as if you're in a race?

No, canal boat holidays should be whatever the hirer wants them to be. Maybe relaxing, or maybe challenging. In the 70s we did a week's hire from Whittington (Wolverhampton) to Llangollen and back. Another year we did Trevor to Whaley bridge and back in a week. But without speeding past moored boats or making a breaking wash of course.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No, canal boat holidays should be whatever the hirer wants them to be. Maybe relaxing, or maybe challenging. In the 70s we did a week's hire from Whittington (Wolverhampton) to Llangollen and back. Another year we did Trevor to Whaley bridge and back in a week. But without speeding past moored boats or making a breaking wash of course.

Quoting the OP: "but obviously don't want it to be too stressful as the idea of unwinding and enjoying using the journey is more important than getting anywhere specifically."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I suppose I was musing on the disconnect between that final sentence and the OPs question abut wanting to get to Gas Street on the first day. If you get to Gas Street, fine. If not, there's plenty of other places to stop between Tardebigge and Birmingham. If you get away late (quite possible) then Hopwood might suit. If you go on through the tunnel, you could moor at King's Norton, Bournville, Selly Oak or The Vale and head into Birmingham the next day. The idea of Tardebigge --> Brum --> G.U. --> Kingswood --> Lapworth Flight --> back to Tardebigge is a good one. It's the add-on down to Stratford which might be a problem. The OP seems to live in Brum so could have a day in Stratford any time he likes. My advice would be to take it fairly easy and turn on the South Stratford canal when sensible.

 

Planning too much for the pick-up day might be unwise. Also, the only day which would need a long cruise would be Gas Street to Cath-de-Barnes. I'm wondering if the route should be reversed?

 

How's this for an itinerary?

 

1. Tardebigge to Shirley (Can moor by Lyons Boatyard or Kings Norton if time is short) - pub

 

2. To Lowsonford - pub

 

3. To Wilmcote - pub (time to visit Mary Arden's farm or walk into Stratford for the evening - cab home).

 

4. To Kingswood Junction - pub

 

5. To Cath-de-Barnes - pub

 

6. To Gas Street - pub

 

7. To Tardebigge - no pub mad.gif Moor on the visitor moorings at the top of the flight before turning and heading for the boatyard in the morning to return the boat.

 

Advantages to this is that there's a better guarantee of timing the moorings to overnight in Gas Street (if that's important). It also leaves the biggest and most difficult locks to later in the week when the crew will be at the top of their game. I rather like the entry into the city centre up Farmer's Bridge too, popping out of the top lock and finding yourself right by the NIA is always quite exciting. The first part of the cruise is all level so plenty of time to get used to the boat. The first locks are at Lapworth which is probably the prettiest and most forgiving flight on the network. There's even a handy pub to stop for lunch halfway down if you're tired.

Edited by Dave_P
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The idea is to then go down the Farmer's Bridge locks and out eventually onto the Grand Union to head to Kingswood Junction and then onto the Stratford canal

 

Unless you have a boat full of hard case canal nutters (like us), going down the Stratford is less locks, less work and far prettier

 

Farmers bridge is a load of locks, the Ashtead is interesting if you like looking for the echoes of past industry, Warwick bar is OK, Camp Hill is going back up again after going down Ashtead and the GU from Bordesley is rather tedious - then you go down Knowle to bring you down to roughly where you were at the bottom of the Ashtead

 

If you want to bag bits of canal for your collection, go that way. If you want a relaxing canal holiday, go the other way

 

Richard

Edited by RLWP
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just on the mooring opportunities coming into Birmingham, Kings Norton Jn area seems to have a bad reputation for some reason and although we've never had a problem there, it's not somewhere I'd want to night stop. Ive never see any moored boats there which is always a clue. And for the places you mention further into town they are all alongside a noisy clanky and squeaky railway. I wouldn't get much sleep there!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just on the mooring opportunities coming into Birmingham, Kings Norton Jn area seems to have a bad reputation for some reason and although we've never had a problem there, it's not somewhere I'd want to night stop. Ive never see any moored boats there which is always a clue. And for the places you mention further into town they are all alongside a noisy clanky and squeaky railway. I wouldn't get much sleep there!

1. I've seen lines of moored boats at King's Norton more times than I can remember.

2. The trains stop running during the night and are sufficiently far from the canal at the vale and selly oak that they are hardly audible inside the boat anyway.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1. I've seen lines of moored boats at King's Norton more times than I can remember.

2. The trains stop running during the night and are sufficiently far from the canal at the vale and selly oak that they are hardly audible inside the boat anyway.

1. Do you mean within sight of the junction? Never seen any myself, but of course that is not to say that you haven't.

2. Never moored at the Vale but we passed it recently and I was contemplating its feasibility ... but then a train came by with its brakes on making a god awful noise. Decided against it! I don't like being woken up at 6am! Since you moor in Gas St I suggest that you might be more accustomed to noise than we are. Certainly there are plenty of boats moored at the Vale these days but it's not for us.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1. Do you mean within sight of the junction? Never seen any myself, but of course that is not to say that you haven't.

2. Never moored at the Vale but we passed it recently and I was contemplating its feasibility ... but then a train came by with its brakes on making a god awful noise. Decided against it! I don't like being woken up at 6am! Since you moor in Gas St I suggest that you might be more accustomed to noise than we are. Certainly there are plenty of boats moored at the Vale these days but it's not for us.

1. Yes. On the W&B and the end of the Stratford. Of course there's also one boat which has its permanent mooring within sight of the junction. As a guess, I reckon I've seen up to 15 boats moored up around the junction. And that's not when the festival is on!

2. The Vale is very peaceful and a lovely spot for a picnic/barbecue since it's one of the few bits of canal with a wide open public green space alongside the towpath. The main downside to the Vale is the recent towpath improvements which have created a cycle raceway and now make my cat very nervous when there.

The Vale http://s0.geograph.org.uk/geophotos/02/29/22/2292271_6c694b3d.jpg

 

Much quieter than many other rural moorings near the railway. Aynho comes instantly to mind...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wow - thank you everyone for some very useful comments ! Much food for thought.

 

I'm beginning to feel that the first partial day from Tardebigge into Gas Street might be too much - Dave_P : as you say with the Wast Hills tunnel especially the average speed would definitely be a lot lower than 4mph, let alone slowing to go past moored boats -- one of the first things we were taught on the helmsman's course :). I also don't really want it to be a race, much better to take the time and enjoy it. Given that, your suggestion of a reverse route might be a better option. I like the idea of only going as far as Wilmcote as well - we live in Rubery, so we get to Stratford fairly often anyway. Turning at Wilmcote gives us some pleasant canal without rushing to get into Bancroft Basin. I only added Stratford because I thought the Birmingham Mini Ring might not be quite enough for the week, but it seems like a little more leisurely pace would still fill the days and give us more of an enjoyable holiday. Of course, if it's raining the thought of having to cruise for 6 or 7 hours is not as appealing!

 

Going from Tardebigge towards Dickens Heath along the North Stratford on the first day is a better use of time, otherwise a short trip to Hopwood on the first day only leaves around 3 hours cruising into Gas Street on the second. Reversing the route means we can make full use of the days without having to race anywhere !

 

I'll have to play around with options and see what makes sense to us. I'll let you all know what we come up with. Really looking forward to the holiday now as the planning is making it seem closer.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wnding at Wilmcote looks like a good plan. There are 16 locks from there down into Stratford and it seems a lot of effort to go down just to turn around and come back up again.

 

FWIW I reckon it takes us 2 hrs to travel from the top of the Lapworth flight to Kings Norton Jn and then another 2hrs from there into the centre of Brum.

 

Oh, and make sure you 'enjoy' the full hydraulic experience of the lift bridge closest to the Top Lock at Lapworth!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wnding at Wilmcote looks like a good plan. There are 16 locks from there down into Stratford and it seems a lot of effort to go down just to turn around and come back up again.

 

FWIW I reckon it takes us 2 hrs to travel from the top of the Lapworth flight to Kings Norton Jn and then another 2hrs from there into the centre of Brum.

 

Oh, and make sure you 'enjoy' the full hydraulic experience of the lift bridge closest to the Top Lock at Lapworth!

Speed merchant, and that includes that lift bridge too. I reckon on 4.5 hours from Wearings Green to Birmingham, I guess I am slow.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7. To Tardebigge - no pub mad.gif Moor on the visitor moorings at the top of the flight before turning and heading for the boatyard in the morning to return the boat.

It won't be everybody's cup of tea, but the New Tardebigge pub is about half a mile from Tardebigge Wharf. Its a family chain pub, complete with Wacky Warehouse children's play area, but I have had a reasonable pint and meal in the bar there in the past.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It won't be everybody's cup of tea, but the New Tardebigge pub is about half a mile from Tardebigge Wharf. Its a family chain pub, complete with Wacky Warehouse children's play area, but I have had a reasonable pint and meal in the bar there in the past.

I know it well. Not a pub really. A sort of pub/fast food joint/children's playground mashup.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm interested to note some of the timings mentioned. I haven't boated that way for a few years, but way back in the 60s/70s then Gas St to King's Norton was around an hour and a quarter to an hour and a half, while Gas St to Tardebigge was about four. Anyone else remember?

 

Cheers

 

Dave

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm interested to note some of the timings mentioned. I haven't boated that way for a few years, but way back in the 60s/70s then Gas St to King's Norton was around an hour and a quarter to an hour and a half, while Gas St to Tardebigge was about four. Anyone else remember?

 

Cheers

 

Dave

That sounds about right. I'd allow a bit longer tbh. Edited by Dave_P
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm interested to note some of the timings mentioned. I haven't boated that way for a few years, but way back in the 60s/70s then Gas St to King's Norton was around an hour and a quarter to an hour and a half, while Gas St to Tardebigge was about four. Anyone else remember?

 

Cheers

 

Dave

It takes konger to travel anywhere these days, because of the moorerd boats everywhere

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It takes konger to travel anywhere these days, because of the moorerd boats everywhere

 

Yes, you have to try eelly hard!

 

laugh.png

 

But there arn't that many moorings from King's Norton into Brum.

Perhaps some boats at Bournville, the hydrogen boat and that other one by the University and perhaps a few at the Vale and thats about the lot.

Edited by Victor Vectis
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've been re-thinking the route, especially after Dave-P's suggestion and now coming round to this :

 

Day 1 : Pick up boat at Tardebigge :), to Lyons Boatyard : 4h13

Day 2 : to Lapworth lock 19 : 7h16 / 17 locks

Day 3 : to Wilmcote : 7h16 / 20 locks

Day 4 : to Kingswood Junction : 6h57 / 18 locks

Day 5 : to Catherine de Barnes : 2h56 / 5 locks

Day 6 : to Gas Street : 7h12 / 25 locks

Day 7 : to Alvechurch or near Tardebigge : 4h

Day 8 : to Tardebigge by 9am to return boat :(

 

I put in an overnight at Catherine de Barnes as I thought this may be a better place to stop rather than going further into Birmingham? I know that Tyseley Wharf or Camp Hill might be better places distance wise to even out the time between the days a bit but not sure they would be OK for mooring?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.