Help with history of a boat

[ieestok]

Hi all, I'm trying to find out as much as I can about the past life of a boat I have just purchased.

 

It's an old CRT seizure (and in a bit of a state) so I can't ask the previous owner any questions and I'm hitting dead ends trying to find things online - I thought you lot might be able to help me.

 

It was built by David Jones of Chester, and most results when searching this is the for-sale listing for my boat, although I've found a few mentions of a David Jones working at a Chester boatyard. Its registration number is 62624, and a search only lists its name and D. Jones as the builder, no date. The number indicates it was registered in 1980/81 but obviously this means nothing as it could have been going long before 1980.

 

I wouldn't be so interested if it wasn't for the layout of the boat. There is a traditional back cabin which is completely separate from the rest of the boat, there is no connecting door (and if there was, it would go through to the engine room). The main internal fit out appears to be from the mid 80s, but the main body of the boat doesn't look as though it's a later addition (ie converted from a working boat) and the surveyor agreed. It is also painted in the British Waterways livery, although of course this doesn't mean anything either.

 

What I'm trying to figure out is, if this boat was built in the 70s/80s, why include the traditional and separate back cabin - and if it was built earlier, should it not have been a working boat which has been converted? Were traditional back cabins ever included as a novelty sort of thing?

 

Thanks in advance for any light anybody can shed on anything.

[Ray T]

Piccy's will help please.

 

Canal Plan suggests it is this boat?

 

Perch Built by Jones D - Length : 16.76 metres ( 55 feet ) - Beam : 2.08 metres ( 6 feet 10 inches ) - Draft : 0.76 metres ( 2 feet 6 inches ). Metal hull N/A power of 30 HP. Registered with Canal & River Trust number 62624 as a Powered Motor Boat. ( Last updated on Wednesday 22nd May 2013 )

Edited November 13, 2015 by Ray T

[RLWP]

55' long, called Perch according to the Boat List

 

Richard

 

MORE: Jones D seems moderately prolific with 11 entries in the list

Edited November 13, 2015 by RLWP

[junior]

I could ask him for you if you want?

[RLWP]

I could ask him for you if you want?

 

Wouldn't that be too easy?

 

Richard

[ieestok]

I could ask him for you if you want?

 

That would be fantastic!

 

 

Piccy's will help please.

 

Canal Plan suggests it is this boat?

 

Perch Built by Jones D - Length : 16.76 metres ( 55 feet ) - Beam : 2.08 metres ( 6 feet 10 inches ) - Draft : 0.76 metres ( 2 feet 6 inches ). Metal hull N/A power of 30 HP. Registered with Canal & River Trust number 62624 as a Powered Motor Boat. ( Last updated on Wednesday 22nd May 2013 )

 

Yep, that's the boat... Just figuring out how to post pictures haha

[ieestok]

Don't have many good images but this should vaguely illustrate what I'm talking about

 

 

 

If there's anything in particular I can see if I've got a photo

[RLWP]

Bow and stern would help.

 

Richard

[Ray T]

Sorry to go off topic but in a recent thread some one asked who was the original painter of the decal:

 

 

 

Your drop down table has remarkable similarities:

 

 

Looks original art work to me.

 

Are we a little closer to knowing the painter?

 

Paging Mr Moore.

Edited November 13, 2015 by Ray T

[ieestok]

Unfortunately this is the best image I have of the bow (it's not my photo) and before the pigeon box was put in its proper location...

 

 

And stern:

 

 

 

Excuse the grottiness, I will be doing her up imminently.

 

Sorry to go off topic but in a recent thread some one asked who was the original painter of the decal:

 

Your drop down table has remarkable similarities:

 

Looks original art work to me.

 

Are we a little closer to knowing the painter?

 

Paging Mr Moore.

 

It's almost exactly the same scene! Most of the castles and roses on the boat are hand painted, I wasn't aware transfers were used

 

Here is a closer photo of my table (I have some of other painted bits if that would be of use/interest!)

 

Edited November 13, 2015 by ieestok

[ditchcrawler]

I had the transfers which I used on my boat, I have a feeling they published who the original painter was as they prided themselves on making them to resemble paint. I may possibly have the paperwork somewhere as I had some left over.

[Ray T]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's almost exactly the same scene! All castles and roses throughout the boat are indeed hand painted.

 

Here is a closer photo of my table (I have some of other painted bits if that would be of use/interest!)

 

 

Thank you and yes please.

 

If it were me I would try to preserve the cabin decor.

 

Transfer copies are available here: http://www.boatshopbraunston.co.uk/canal-transfers.html

Edited November 13, 2015 by Ray T

[pete harrison]

I am sure it is this PERCH that was owned by 'young' Henry Hollingshead prior to his acquisition on CETUS (fore end) in about 1998. Mr Hollingshead still owns CETUS so it would be worth having a word with him. I think he keeps CETUS on the Shropshire Union Canal somewhere around Brewood.

[Bee]

Cor, what a mess, It'll make a nice boat though, proper flat gunwhales as well, not just folded steel, nice proportions, slightly jealous.

[ieestok]

 

Thank you and yes please.

 

If it were me I would try to preserve the cabin decor.

 

Transfer copies are available here: http://www.boatshopbraunston.co.uk/canal-transfers.html

 

My plan is to preserve as much as I can! I'm not really sure how to go about saving the door. At the very least I'll save the painted panels. I'll post pictures in a sec - it's a bit of a faff getting them on here. Cheers for the link

 

 

I am sure it is this PERCH that was owned by 'young' Henry Hollingshead prior to his acquisition on CETUS (fore end) in about 1998. Mr Hollingshead still owns CETUS so it would be worth having a word with him. I think he keeps CETUS on the Shropshire Union Canal somewhere around Brewood.

 

That's a fantastic piece of information! I would love to see photos or hear what she was like in all her original glory! How would you suggest getting in touch with Mr Hollingshead?

 

 

Cor, what a mess, It'll make a nice boat though, proper flat gunwhales as well, not just folded steel, nice proportions, slightly jealous.

 

It's a bloody lovely boat under all the grime and peeling paint, and the hull is in fantastic nick, would you believe. Been neglected for the last two years, hence ending up in CRT's possession. The surveyor was jealous himself!

[furnessvale]

 

That's a fantastic piece of information! I would love to see photos or hear what she was like in all her original glory! How would you suggest getting in touch with Mr Hollingshead?

 

 

I can't add too much to what Pete says except to add that Henry keeps Cetus on the offside just north of the main road bridge at Brewood. He is often there tinkering if not actually out on the boat.

 

One final thing, Henry is a lovely man but he suffers from a considerable speech defect which can make understanding him very difficult when you first meet him.

 

George ex nb Alton retired

[ieestok]

Don't I feel a lemon now - on closer inspection of the photos they are in fact all transfers! I didn't even think to check that, as they weren't sticking out like the big bulky vinyl things you see and they looked so good, I just assumed. More fool me. I can still post photos if you're still interested, sorry if I raised false hope

I can't add too much to what Pete says except to add that Henry keeps Cetus on the offside just north of the main road bridge at Brewood. He is often there tinkering if not actually out on the boat.

 

One final thing, Henry is a lovely man but he suffers from a considerable speech defect which can make understanding him very difficult when you first meet him.

 

George ex nb Alton retired

 

Thank you! If nobody has contact details I'll be sure to stop if I'm going past.

[Ray T]

Don't feel a lemon, yes please I for one would like to see more photo's.

 

Had me fooled too.

Edited November 13, 2015 by Ray T

[ieestok]

Don't feel a lemon, yes please I for one would like to see more photo's.

 

Had me fooled too.

 

 

It was the just-visible edge to the transfer in this one that made me realise! ^

 

 

 

 

The little castles on the doors ARE hand painted, as the two doors have quite different images (though of the same castle).

 

Sadly I have no photos of the painting on the side hatch doors, I believe it's quite similar to the green panel shown there

[dave moore]

Cue Dave Moore

 

Here I am! The panel in the table cupboard is almost certainly a transfer. They were produced in the 60s for Alan Picken who ran a company called Water folk and managed to be quite controversial even in those days. I've no idea who the artist was that painted the originals, I can only say that the work is a far cry from that painted by the dockyard painters in the last days of commercial carrying. I didn't care for them then, nor have I grown to like them latterly....good luck with the restoration.

 

Dave

[ieestok]

I've just looked up Cetus, looks like the paint job Perch used to have once upon a time, before somebody slathered two thirds of her in red oxide! Would this just be Mr. Hollingshead's taste, or would it be worth restoring the BW paint job? I would doubt she's a properly historic boat (all steel hull, just doesn't seem old enough) but if it's appropriate to her past in some capacity I most certainly would. Perhaps D. Jones would know.

 

Also thank you for the well wishes Dave.

Edited November 14, 2015 by ieestok

[Speedwheel]

I am sure it is this PERCH that was owned by 'young' Henry Hollingshead prior to his acquisition on CETUS (fore end) in about 1998. Mr Hollingshead still owns CETUS so it would be worth having a word with him. I think he keeps CETUS on the Shropshire Union Canal somewhere around Brewood.

 

Fairly certain that was a different Perch Pete. I'm sure Henry H sold it to Henry and Phyllis Johnstone. ETA - I'd stand to be corrected though.

Best pic I can find at the moment - Perch on the inside

 

Edited November 14, 2015 by Speedwheel

[ieestok]

 

Fairly certain that was a different Perch Pete. I'm sure Henry H sold it to Henry and Phyllis Johnstone. ETA - I'd stand to be corrected though.

Best pic I can find at the moment - Perch on the inside

 

 

Hmmm yes that does appear to be a different boat.

 

So it seems my only lead is to find D. Jones? Still have no ideas on data and still interested in the little back cabin. Would also love to know what colours I should be doing her up in!

[Derek R.]

(snip)

 

What I'm trying to figure out is, if this boat was built in the 70s/80s, why include the traditional and separate back cabin - and if it was built earlier, should it not have been a working boat which has been converted? Were traditional back cabins ever included as a novelty sort of thing?

 

 

Your boat would appear to have been built post 1960 (a date plucked at random), and as such is highly unlikely to have been any of the boats specifically used to carry goods. As a pleasure boat (as opposed to working boat) it would have been planned by an owner wishing to satisfy his or her requirements. The small back cabin bears a resemblance to an ex-working boat back cabin only, and may well have been created to make a cosy place to sit and make a brew. Part novelty - part practicality. There are several modern boats built with traditional back cabins, the reason in the main is that they provide a complete self contained living space in which one can sit, cook, wash, and sleep, and for many it reflects a link to the working past of the canals.

 

As to what colour to paint it, it's your boat - paint it whatever you like. But from the views seen so far, there are more pressing jobs to do. Colour schemes are the last thing to be concerned about right now.

 

Good luck with the project - hope you have deep pockets.

[ieestok]

 

Your boat would appear to have been built post 1960 (a date plucked at random), and as such is highly unlikely to have been any of the boats specifically used to carry goods. As a pleasure boat (as opposed to working boat) it would have been planned by an owner wishing to satisfy his or her requirements. The small back cabin bears a resemblance to an ex-working boat back cabin only, and may well have been created to make a cosy place to sit and make a brew. Part novelty - part practicality. There are several modern boats built with traditional back cabins, the reason in the main is that they provide a complete self contained living space in which one can sit, cook, wash, and sleep, and for many it reflects a link to the working past of the canals.

 

As to what colour to paint it, it's your boat - paint it whatever you like. But from the views seen so far, there are more pressing jobs to do. Colour schemes are the last thing to be concerned about right now.

 

Good luck with the project - hope you have deep pockets.

 

Thank you very much, this has pretty much answered my original questions, and was what I suspected.

 

Yes, of course I can paint it any colour I want, I'm just interested as to how she was first done out. What do you believe is more pressing? The first job on my list is stripping her down and painting and blacking her, as at the moment the metal is unprotected and starting to rust.

 

Thanks for the well wishes - fortunately deep pockets won't be needed, she's structurally sound, just a little rough around the edges.