BMC 1800 CAV injector pump

[Nitrowing]

I've had a diesel specialist look at my injector pump in situ - it's nearly pouring diesel out underneath - but he doesn't want to get involved with the job.

Sheaf http://www.sheafdieselservices.com said they will pop down to do the job as they're only a mile or so away.

My only problem is, they told me to expect a bill around £500

What are my realistic options?

[MtB]

Currently they appear to be pay Sheaf the £500, or learn about CAV injector pumps in a hurry and DIY.

 

I have a feeling the bod who looked at it for you and walked away knows exactly what is wrong and how expensive this is gonna be to fix, but assumed you didn't have the money, whatever he may have actually said to you.

 

MtB

[Nick G]

I have just had two CAV fuel injection pumps serviced for £144 by Fuel Injection Services of Burscough, Lancashire.

http://www.fuelinjectionservice.co.uk

I have previously used this firm to service my injectors.

 

Nick

[Nitrowing]

Mike, I did a google search on the guy and he seems to have a reputation for walking away from older engines!

Nick, if the boat was near my home, I'd do the work myself and then pay a fitter to fit it and time the pump!

 

Buying this boat has really left a bad taste in my mouth, the attitude of the marina employee and the hidden bodges refurb of the previous owner are only just balanced by the peace and quiet of being on board and the friendliness of the other boaters!

[MtB]

Buying this boat has really left a bad taste in my mouth, the attitude of the marina employee and the hidden bodges refurb of the previous owner are only just balanced by the peace and quiet of being on board and the friendliness of the other boaters!

 

 

Surely this depends on whether the marina were the vendors or if it was just on brokerage.

 

If on brokerage the marina are acting as 'estate agents' and have neither control nor responsibility for the quality of the boat being sold. That's between you and the owner.

 

OTOH if you are sure they bodged it up and sold it themselves then naming and shaming on here would serve as a warning to others.

 

 

MtB

Edited May 1, 2014 by Mike the Boilerman

[Slim]

Whilst trying to source a fuel cutout solenoid for my BMC 1.8 I've come across several " professionally overhauled" injector pumps offered by seemingly reputable companies ranging from £200 to £350. They are out there! Can't believe it would cost £300 to fit one.

 

 

 

Frank

[Northernboater]

Buying this boat has really left a bad taste in my mouth, the attitude of the marina employee and the hidden bodges refurb of the previous owner are only just balanced by the peace and quiet of being on board and the friendliness of the other boaters!

 

 

Reading into your other topics/posts you've seamed to have just bought the boat for cheap accommodation and not really looked into what it actually involves, not knowing how a boat works and what to look out for when you bought (did you get a survey?, did you buy it private or from a broker?)

 

Then you pull down the marina because you can't understand the difference between living aboard, leisure use and staying on board every night. You can't blame the marina for being cautious with a new moorer.

 

Maybe you should just move back to land, as I imagine it will only get worse with your lack of knowledge and understanding and it will probably be everyone else's fault that your having problems and not your's.

 

Just remember no one forced you to buy the boat or is forcing you to stay where you are.

Edited May 1, 2014 by Northernboater

[Nitrowing]

Northernboater, whilst I agree with some of your opinion, I think you should edit your post a bit further.

 

I've been looking in to buying a boat for about 10 years.

I can strip and rebuild anything from a 1969 Reliant 4-wheeler, Harley Davidson through to differential pressure transmitters and coriolis flow meters, make circuit board modifications to PC's and commission nuclear submarines - that is to say, if there is a problem with something I can bee 99% sure at where the problem lies.

With this privately bought boat, the previous owner has studied the art of rolling a poop in glitter where it couldn't be polished.

 

When a boat has a BSS less than 6 months old I don't expect to find:

- incorrect diesel lines

-missing diesel shut off valve

-leaking gas pipe

-under-rated electrical cables

-glow plugs wired permanently live

-oil sump leaking in to the cabin

etc etc etc

 

The problem with the marina is purely one employee. He's ex-army and a prime example of why I left the forces, he'd bust a nut if he ever got promoted to Traffic Warden! The director, conversely, is very pleasant and understanding. I will be moving on as soon as the boat is functional.

 

Move back to land? lol! Are you trying to sound like a sea-faring salty dog now? The boat is a toy. I'm using it to get to grips with the waterways before I spend 'serious' money, the same way as I bought a £200 bike to begin with all those years ago before I spent serious money. No one starts with a Rolls Royce.

[RLWP]

To be honest, £500 to remove, strip, clean, replace parts, recalibrate and refit your pump is a good price. An overhaul on its own is usually about that much

 

Richard

[Nitrowing]

Yes RWLP, I did search google before calling in Sheaf and refurbed units are £300 - Sheaf also seem to have a good reputation and the mechanic that came down this morning was a proper good chap - he didn't even frown when he realised that he was going to have to modify a spanner to get the pump off.

[bizzard]

Must have been a Reliant Kitten.

[Nitrowing]

Must have been a Reliant Kitten.

It's a Rebel, I have 2 Kittens too

[Northernboater]

Northernboater, whilst I agree with some of your opinion, I think you should edit your post a bit further.

 

I've been looking in to buying a boat for about 10 years.

I can strip and rebuild anything from a 1969 Reliant 4-wheeler, Harley Davidson through to differential pressure transmitters and coriolis flow meters, make circuit board modifications to PC's and commission nuclear submarines - that is to say, if there is a problem with something I can bee 99% sure at where the problem lies.

With this privately bought boat, the previous owner has studied the art of rolling a poop in glitter where it couldn't be polished.

 

When a boat has a BSS less than 6 months old I don't expect to find:

- incorrect diesel lines

-missing diesel shut off valve

-leaking gas pipe

-under-rated electrical cables

-glow plugs wired permanently live

-oil sump leaking in to the cabin

etc etc etc

 

 

You obviously wasted those 10 years looking for a boat, as the one you've bought seams to be a bit of a dog and looking at all those things you say you could do, it must be easier to commission a nuclear submarine then to charge a battery and get a BMC engine to run. lol. Good luck

Edited May 2, 2014 by Northernboater

[MtB]

Northernboater, whilst I agree with some of your opinion, I think you should edit your post a bit further.

 

I've been looking in to buying a boat for about 10 years.

I can strip and rebuild anything from a 1969 Reliant 4-wheeler, Harley Davidson through to differential pressure transmitters and coriolis flow meters, make circuit board modifications to PC's and commission nuclear submarines - that is to say, if there is a problem with something I can bee 99% sure at where the problem lies.

With this privately bought boat, the previous owner has studied the art of rolling a poop in glitter where it couldn't be polished.

 

When a boat has a BSS less than 6 months old I don't expect to find:

- incorrect diesel lines

-missing diesel shut off valve

-leaking gas pipe

-under-rated electrical cables

-glow plugs wired permanently live

-oil sump leaking in to the cabin

etc etc etc

 

The problem with the marina is purely one employee. He's ex-army and a prime example of why I left the forces, he'd bust a nut if he ever got promoted to Traffic Warden! The director, conversely, is very pleasant and understanding. I will be moving on as soon as the boat is functional.

 

Move back to land? lol! Are you trying to sound like a sea-faring salty dog now? The boat is a toy. I'm using it to get to grips with the waterways before I spend 'serious' money, the same way as I bought a £200 bike to begin with all those years ago before I spent serious money. No one starts with a Rolls Royce.

 

So you bought a boat to learn on, and now you are complaining about getting the education.

 

If you've really spent 10 years researching this purchase, I'm staggered that you expected a £150 BSS examination to have spotted all those faults you list. I think you have lead a sheltered life until now. In addition, it is quite feasible that none of those faults existed six months ago when the BSS was carried out. Maybe the ex-army employee you are so scathing about introduced them after the BSS.

 

I note you ignored my previous post asking about the identity of the vendor in response to your slating of the marina.

 

I'm also surprised an engineer of your self-declared calibre failed to spot this turd rolled in glitter before handing over the money. I think there is more to this than appears. I'd love to hear the ex-army employee's version of all this, lol!

 

But never mind, lesson learned (possibly). Next time you won't rely so heavily on a 6 month old. £150 safety inspection as an indicator that everything is hunky dory, and you'll get a survey as you seem to need your hand holding every step of the way. Or did you actually get a survey, as your ten years of research would have shown was a good idea if you can't inspect and spot the faults yourself?

 

 

MtB

[Nitrowing]

 

So you bought a boat to learn on, and now you are complaining about getting the education.

 

If you've really spent 10 years researching this purchase, I'm staggered that you expected a £150 BSS examination to have spotted all those faults you list. I think you have lead a sheltered life until now. In addition, it is quite feasible that none of those faults existed six months ago when the BSS was carried out. Maybe the ex-army employee you are so scathing about introduced them after the BSS.

 

I note you ignored my previous post asking about the identity of the vendor in response to your slating of the marina.

 

I'm also surprised an engineer of your self-declared calibre failed to spot this turd rolled in glitter before handing over the money. I think there is more to this than appears. I'd love to hear the ex-army employee's version of all this, lol!

 

But never mind, lesson learned (possibly). Next time you won't rely so heavily on a 6 month old. £150 safety inspection as an indicator that everything is hunky dory, and you'll get a survey as you seem to need your hand holding every step of the way. Or did you actually get a survey, as your ten years of research would have shown was a good idea if you can't inspect and spot the faults yourself?

 

 

MtB

 

I haven't complained about any of the information I've been given. If in doubt, ask.

I stated that the sale was private.

When you pay for a car MoT, do you expect them to go through your vehicle with a fine-toothed comb and find every fault? Oh, surprise, they do - that's the whole purpose of checking for safety. Incorrect cables and fuel lines (especially coupled together!) are a safety issue.

I don't expect my hand holding, though that would be nice, I also don't expect to have my throat jumped down when I ask for advice.

 

 

You obviously wasted those 10 years looking for a boat, as the one you've bought seams to be a bit of a dog and looking at all those things you say you could do, it must be easier to commission a nuclear submarine then to charge a battery and get a BMC engine to run. lol. Good luck

 

I addressed the battery charging issue - it had been wired up so the glow plugs were permanently on!

Getting old engines to run is always fun, that's why I have old cars, at least there's a chance you can sort it out yourself, rather than spend an hour just taking all the plastic out of an engine bay to discover that you need to plug a laptop in to then find out some unspecified sensor may have an intermittent fault!

In this case, I haven't drawn lucky. This is exactly the reason I didn't jump all in and spend big money on my first purchase.

[Tony Brooks]

 

When a boat has a BSS less than 6 months old I don't expect to find:

- incorrect diesel lines

-missing diesel shut off valve

-leaking gas pipe

-under-rated electrical cables

-glow plugs wired permanently live

-oil sump leaking in to the cabin

etc etc etc

 

 

 

1. In what way were they incorrect and who said so?

 

2. I do not think I have seen any boat without a diesel shut off valve on its supply pipe for many, many years. However if it has "rubber" return lines it may require one on the return a swell.

 

3. May have happened in the 6 months but I think the BSS need notifying.

 

4. Examiners are only expected to carry out a visual inspection to try to ascertain the conductor CSA - this is difficult. they are not required to measure run and do calculations. Modern tri-rated cables are often thinner than older wires yet are rated at a higher current.

 

5. Nothing to do with the BSS except in as far as the master switch should (and may without more info from you) isolate virtually all the electrics. Your linking with a battery charger makes me suspect this would be difficult to find within the BSS procedures.

 

6. Oil leaks are nothing to do with the BSS inspection.

 

What I am interesting is what your surveyor told said about the boat - or did you think that you knew enough about boats to forego a survey?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Er - no they do not. They certainly do not check cable size or for oil leaks other than those that may affect MOTable systems. They check a defined number of things, just like a BSS inspection and basically the certificate is only a statement about the state of the vehicle on the day of the inspection. Just the same as a BSS inspection .

 

If you have good grounds for believing the BSS certificate was issued incorrectly then you must talk to the BSS, but at this time I suspect that things are not as straight forward as you imply. Unfortunately the way you come across to me is that you are miffed about having bought a dog and you may not be as knowledgeable as you think you are. I agree that the items you list should have been picked up on survey but did you have one?

[PD1964]

 

So you bought a boat to learn on, and now you are complaining about getting the education.

 

If you've really spent 10 years researching this purchase, I'm staggered that you expected a £150 BSS examination to have spotted all those faults you list. I think you have lead a sheltered life until now. In addition, it is quite feasible that none of those faults existed six months ago when the BSS was carried out. Maybe the ex-army employee you are so scathing about introduced them after the BSS.

 

I note you ignored my previous post asking about the identity of the vendor in response to your slating of the marina.

 

I'm also surprised an engineer of your self-declared calibre failed to spot this turd rolled in glitter before handing over the money. I think there is more to this than appears. I'd love to hear the ex-army employee's version of all this, lol!

 

But never mind, lesson learned (possibly). Next time you won't rely so heavily on a 6 month old. £150 safety inspection as an indicator that everything is hunky dory, and you'll get a survey as you seem to need your hand holding every step of the way. Or did you actually get a survey, as your ten years of research would have shown was a good idea if you can't inspect and spot the faults yourself?

 

 

MtB

Hi MTB, I thought I'd nip this one in the bud before it gets out of hand and thanks John for the heads up.

 

I'm the Ex Army guy that the poster mentioned, funny thing is that I've never been in the Army in my life, so I don't know where that came from, this assumption may have something to do with the Posters experience when he was in the armed forces as he may of had similar experiences when he was sussed out or people just saw through his waffle, as he says this may be why he left that career.

 

I have had nothing to do with his boat or nor has the Marina where it is moored and where I help out now and then, he moved it here on a low loader and it was quite apparent on first sight that this boat was going to have and be problematic, these suspicions were confirmed after running the engine for 2 minutes as it cut out and refused to start, After several attempts to restart the owner just stood there with a blank expression on his face.

 

Having towed him to his berth I lifted the engine cover to inform him that he was out of fuel, where upon he cursed the seller. I also asked if it had a current BSC as there was no fuel cut off to check to see if it had been closed during transit even though it was marked by a plaque where it should be, also the fuel tank was not secured and was moving around freely also the lines did not conform to ISO 7840. the battery wiring looked to be the wrong gauge also for the battery Ampage. Having told him he needed fuel and may need to bleed the system to the injectors he informed me that this shouldn't be a problem for him as he has rebuilt and restored vintage cars, I suggested that he put the pram cover on for the weather protection and security and pointed out what a canvas Pram cover looked like on another boat, he said he had one and it was in the boat. This turned out to be a £4.99 plastic tarpaulin from B&Q. Not the best of starts on your new mooring.

 

With the problem of his issue with staying on the boat. The Marina informed him that there was no residential moorings but he was welcome to stay on the boat weekends and the odd night through the week. He stated that he had bought the boat to stay on when he had to work late and this would only be 1-2 nights per week possibly 3 nights at the most and this was a new job that he was starting.

 

It quickly became apparent that he was staying on the boat every night and at weekends and going home very rarely, When asked about this he seamed not to understand the difference between, living on the boat, using it every night as accommodation and leisure use.

 

I believe he is moving the boat out next Wednesday to a new Marina nearer his home.

 

Hopefully this will clear a few things up as I don't want to be on here telling everyone and his dog my issues and life story, that's why I have my narrowboat to enjoy and to keep my life private.

Edited May 2, 2014 by PD1964

[cereal tiller]

Hi MTB, I thought I'd nip this one in the bud before it gets out of hand and thanks John for the heads up.

 

I'm the Ex Army guy that the poster mentioned, funny thing is that I've never been in the Army in my life, so I don't know where that came from, this assumption may have something to do with the Posters experience when he was in the armed forces as he may of had similar experiences when he was sussed out or people just saw through his waffle, as he says this may be why he left that career.

 

I have had nothing to do with his boat or nor has the Marina where it is moored and where I help out now and then, he moved it here on a low loader and it was quite apparent on first sight that this boat was going to have and be problematic, these suspicions were confirmed after running the engine for 2 minutes as it cut out and refused to start, After several attempts to restart the owner just stood there with a blank expression on his face.

 

Having towed him to his berth I lifted the engine cover to inform him that he was out of fuel, where upon he cursed the seller. I also asked if it had a current BSC as there was no fuel cut off to check to see if it had been closed during transit even though it was marked by a plaque where it should be, also the fuel tank was not secured and was moving around freely also the lines did not conform to ISO 7840. the battery wiring looked to be the wrong gauge also for the battery Ampage. Having told him he needed fuel and may need to bleed the system to the injectors he informed me that this shouldn't be a problem for him as he has rebuilt and restored vintage cars, I suggested that he put the pram cover on for the weather protection and security and pointed out what a canvas Pram cover looked like on another boat, he said he had one and it was in the boat. This turned out to be a £4.99 plastic tarpaulin from B&Q. Not the best of starts on your new mooring.

 

With the problem of his issue with staying on the boat. The Marina informed him that there was no residential moorings but he was welcome to stay on the boat weekends and the odd night through the week. He stated that he had bought the boat to stay on when he had to work late and this would only be 1-2 nights per week possibly 3 nights at the most and this was a new job that he was starting.

 

It quickly became apparent that he was staying on the boat every night and at weekends and going home very rarely, When asked about this he seamed not to understand the difference between, living on the boat, using it every night as accommodation and leisure use.

 

I believe he is moving the boat out next Wednesday to a new Marina nearer his home.

 

Hopefully this will clear a few things up as I don't want to be on here telling everyone and his dog my issues and life story, that's why I have my narrowboat to enjoy and to keep my life private.

Thanks for that post,It made the whole situation a lot clearer.

 

CT

[Grace and Favour]

Hi MTB, I thought I'd nip this one in the bud before it gets out of hand and thanks John for the heads up.

 

<<snip>>

 

Hopefully this will clear a few things up as I don't want to be on here telling everyone and his dog my issues and life story, that's why I have my narrowboat to enjoy and to keep my life private.

Hi PD1964 - - and welcome to the forum.

 

We hope that when any current issues have blown over, that you stay and enjoy the forum and all that its many members have to offer.

[Nitrowing]

Your right I stood there with a blank face, realising that the PO has left just enough diesel in the tank to get it started and no more is when the bulb lit up to say "There's trouble ahead".

I had no problem with bleeding the injectors apart from lack of battery power, which in turn was because the glow plugs were always on - a new battery and a switch solved that... leading to getting the engine running and finding it was virtually pouring out of the injector pump.

 

The issue with the moorings... yes...I'm still not quite sure why the other boats are lived on but I got called to task because of having to do a weekend of overtime, something I made clear would be a distinct possibility from the start. Sending 10 nights in a row may not be the marina's definition of leisure mooring but then being given the reason 'the other boats pay more' is hardly a justification. Seeing as I was (and continue to be) working on the boat every night after doing a 10 hour day - I was seriously expected to travel the 70 miles to and from Cleethorpes after doing this? Surely, the quicker I'm finished and underway the happier we will both be?

 

It's to be expected that there will be a few issues when buying anything, be it a new car that wont stop beeping because the seatbelt isn't plugged, to an old boat that has been laid out internally in a bizarre fashion. Trusting someone and getting toasted wasn't part of my plan.