What Length of Ropes and is there a best type

[DandGNWales]

As some of you know we are re-fitting our Narrowboat out but have to bring her from Barrow on Soar to Chirk Marina in North Wales, so checking on the ropes they are not in very good condition, so my question today is :

 

1. Is there a certain type that will last longer than the others?

 

2. What is the typical length we would need for bow, stern and middle ropes

[grahame r]

I like nice thick soft ropes so would go for 14 or 16mm nylon.

As to length, I like to keep the centre lines just too short to reach the prop. in our case with a 57ft boat 30ft centre ropes are safe. Stern ropes are always going to be a danger so keep them maneageable to store on the counter, say 20ft. I'd go for a nice long bow line which is handy if sturdy mooring points are few and far between.

[Neil2]

Most ropes are three strand nylon these days, 12-14mm should be ok for your boat.

 

Graham makes a good point about the centre line - I've done that trick, you should coil and secure the line but inevitably it ends up just being thrown on the roof where it can slide off and will for sure head for the prop like a moth to a light bulb.

 

Don't get ropes from the chandlers - do I have to say why? Buy long lengths from one of the yacht suppliers on ebay and learn how to splice them - you need to do an eye splice and a back splice, it's easy to learn - youtube, many sites on the internet, and very satisfying. Of course you can just "cauterise" nylon rope to stop the ends fraying but splicing looks so much better.

 

As for length, well I'm one of those who believes a rope can't be too long (excepting the centre line) but plenty are too short.

[Alastair]

There is a great guide to rope here:

 

http://www.classicmarine.co.uk/Articles/Reference%20rope.htm

 

I'm a fan of the hemp-look polypropylene for mooring ropes. Looks ok and has the great property of floating in water. Apart from making it easier to retrieve if dropped, it is also less likely to get caught up in your prop.

[Neil2]

There is a great guide to rope here:

 

http://www.classicmarine.co.uk/Articles/Reference%20rope.htm

 

I'm a fan of the hemp-look polypropylene for mooring ropes. Looks ok and has the great property of floating in water. Apart from making it easier to retrieve if dropped, it is also less likely to get caught up in your prop.

I've only ever seen them in black though and it's just a personal thing but to me they do feel more "artificial" than nylon, or polyester.

 

A quick look on ebay reveals a made up set of 14mm polyprop mooring ropes for £45 which seems reasonable value.

 

14mm nylon is usually about £1 a metre so that would be quite a bit cheaper if you don't mind a bit of splicing.

[RLWP]

The black ones are a different thing. Have a look at Tradline's synthetic hemp ropes: http://www.tradline.co/MOORING-LINES-AND-LANYARDS.html

 

 

Richard

Edited October 1, 2013 by RLWP

[Neil2]

The black ones are a different thing. Have a look at Tradline's synthetic hemp ropes: http://www.tradline.co/MOORING-LINES-AND-LANYARDS.html

 

 

Richard

Yes, it's the same... but different!

 

Synthetic Hemp is a new one to me, it's still polypropylene but the fibres are seemingly spun finer to make it feel less "artificial". The stuff I was familiar with is the stiff black stuff. I like the look of it in that natural colour and I think I'll give it a try when I get the next boat. Thanks for the tip.

 

Tradline stuff is much cheaper through their ebay site http://stores.ebay.co.uk/TRADLINE-ROPE-AND-FENDERS?_rdc=1

[Mike Tee]

Its even cheaper if a few boaters get together and buy a reel (normally 220 metres), works out around 80p per metre rather than £1.80 for the 14mm.

Average on a boat - 35 to 40 metres, only needs 4 or 5 friends to get together.

 

eta - there are some on this forum who regard polypropylene as 'a horror' - I don't agree and have used synthetic hemp for years.

Edited October 1, 2013 by Mike Tee

[howardang]

Most ropes are three strand nylon these days, 12-14mm should be ok for your boat.

 

Graham makes a good point about the centre line - I've done that trick, you should coil and secure the line but inevitably it ends up just being thrown on the roof where it can slide off and will for sure head for the prop like a moth to a light bulb.

 

Don't get ropes from the chandlers - do I have to say why? Buy long lengths from one of the yacht suppliers on ebay and learn how to splice them - you need to do an eye splice and a back splice, it's easy to learn - youtube, many sites on the internet, and very satisfying. Of course you can just "cauterise" nylon rope to stop the ends fraying but splicing looks so much better.

 

As for length, well I'm one of those who believes a rope can't be too long (excepting the centre line) but plenty are too short.

Nylon is mainly used for anchor warps. The most common is polyprop.

 

Re splices, yes an eye splice is a useful one to know but rather than a back splice, the other end of a rope is better with a good whipping. Back splices can be a pain in the proverbial!

 

Howard

[FadeToScarlet]

Stern ropes are always going to be a danger so keep them maneageable to store on the counter, say 20ft.

 

Much less of a danger if they're stored on the slide, coiled in front of the steerer, ready to drop onto the dolly and use.

[tree monkey]

The black ones are a different thing. Have a look at Tradline's synthetic hemp ropes: http://www.tradline.co/MOORING-LINES-AND-LANYARDS.html

 

 

Richard

any idea what the extra loop in the far right eye splice is Richard?

[RLWP]

any idea what the extra loop in the far right eye splice is Richard?

 

Ohhh, I do wish you hadn't asked me that, I've been trying to puzzle it out

 

It might be to fasten the rope to a centre eye

 

Richard

[FadeToScarlet]

any idea what the extra loop in the far right eye splice is Richard?

It's a "soft shackle", to- as Richard said- attach it onto an eye for the centre rope

[tree monkey]

It's a "soft shackle", to- as Richard said- attach it onto an eye for the centre rope

thanks for that

 

Ohhh, I do wish you hadn't asked me that, I've been trying to puzzle it out

 

It might be to fasten the rope to a centre eye

 

Richard

sorry

[Neil2]

 

Ohhh, I do wish you hadn't asked me that, I've been trying to puzzle it out

 

It might be to fasten the rope to a centre eye

 

Richard

That's exactly what it is.

[ditchcrawler]

The black ones are a different thing. Have a look at Tradline's synthetic hemp ropes: http://www.tradline.co/MOORING-LINES-AND-LANYARDS.html

 

 

Richard

Like you I dont use back splices on my lines

Much less of a danger if they're stored on the slide, coiled in front of the steerer, ready to drop onto the dolly and use.

What, and not hanging on the tiller pin?

[Captain Fizz]

Definitely stored on the tiller pin!

[john6767]

Yes, it's the same... but different!

 

Synthetic Hemp is a new one to me, it's still polypropylene but the fibres are seemingly spun finer to make it feel less "artificial". The stuff I was familiar with is the stiff black stuff. I like the look of it in that natural colour and I think I'll give it a try when I get the next boat. Thanks for the tip.

 

Tradline stuff is much cheaper through their ebay site http://stores.ebay.co.uk/TRADLINE-ROPE-AND-FENDERS?_rdc=1

 

I have got these from Tradline's ebay shop, had them 3 years and very pleased with them.

[Ex- Member]

We must be too posh LOL

 

We use braided rope lovely and soft and nice to handle @ 16mm I annoyingly lost a length on the stern in our first week of cruising which I replaced with the centre rope, so bought this as a replacement.

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/360431033800?var=630029969374&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

 

14m was too long though so I was about to cut a 30 f/t length when it suddenly popped in to me head if I tie the ropes centre to the centre loop on the roof I'll create a suitable length readily available either side of the boat, it will also always be fixed centrally so won't get lost.

 

It just so happens that each length just reaches the ends of the cabin roof either bow & stern so you can lay a rope either side or either end of the boat. Really handy on a wide beam roof where reaching across isn't possible and very handy each end when pulling in to moor as we can both egress and pull the boat in.

 

Also we find it copes much better when mooring, it tends to stretch so takes up some of the strain on mooring pins. We also always tie up back on the boat and this smoother rope runs through the mooring pin much easier.

[Neil2]

We must be too posh LOL

 

We use braided rope lovely and soft and nice to handle @ 16mm I annoyingly lost a length on the stern in our first week of cruising which I replaced with the centre rope, so bought this as a replacement.

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/360431033800?var=630029969374&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

 

14m was too long though so I was about to cut a 30 f/t length when it suddenly popped in to me head if I tie the ropes centre to the centre loop on the roof I'll create a suitable length readily available either side of the boat, it will also always be fixed centrally so won't get lost.

 

It just so happens that each length just reaches the ends of the cabin roof either bow & stern so you can lay a rope either side or either end of the boat. Really handy on a wide beam roof where reaching across isn't possible and very handy each end when pulling in to moor as we can both egress and pull the boat in.

 

Also we find it copes much better when mooring, it tends to stretch so takes up some of the strain on mooring pins. We also always tie up back on the boat and this smoother rope runs through the mooring pin much easier.

On a big heavy widebeam that double braid stuff probably makes sense as it's supposed to be stronger (actually i thought it was less elastic than three strand nylon) but at three times the price of three strand it's a bit of a luxury on a narrowboat. As you say though, it runs through fairleads etc a lot better which is why it's pretty much de rigeur on yachts and big grp cruisers.

 

I've always used two centre ropes but that's laziness on my part - I found that whenever we came in to moor the centre line would always be on the wrong side and when you try and flip it over it gets snagged on a mushroom vent or some other detritus on the roof (I said I was lazy) once I lassoed the boathook and sent it flying into the cut. Anyway for the cost of a second rope it makes life a bit easier and certainly a good idea on a WB.

[RLWP]

Like you I dont use back splices on my lines

 

You have misunderstood a bit. The picture is off the Tradline site of their set of three mooring lines

 

I do have back a backsplice on the centre line, I can't remember what's on the other two. I like putting a stopper knot and backsplice onto a handling line, and as I never pass them through anything of small diameter, they don't cause me a problem

 

Richard

[Chalky]

I think rope length is very much dependent on boat length. Our boat is 40' however BW/CaRT have decided that mooring rings should be positioned to allow for boats that are either considerably longer or shorter! We carry an additional set of lines that we can use as either mooring lines or springs to overcome this problem.

[DHutch]

I have pinned this topic, partly as it comes up a lot, partly so it takes part in he review of pined topics when that happens.

 

We currently use 22mm polyester 3 strand, which is very nice to hold, lasts long enough for me, but is a bit more pricey and needs strong fittings if not to risk fitting failure. I in fact run a 'catch line' from the centerline to the handrail, should the centre eye fail, as the breaking strains are about the same!

 

16mm is probably more sensible in polyester, but we got a good price on a whole roll of the 22m and it is nice to hold and throw.

 

The synthetic hemp stuff is nice, and being polyprop it's lighter and, floats. Its worth having at least some polyprop onboard imo. Breaking strain is lower, but so is the cost.

 

Length

- Our centerline is really quite long, and will reach the prop, but I like it that and it does allow for things a short one wouldnt.

- Our bow line is also really pretty long, may 26ft or so, which again is long but my preference, and still miles from the prop.

- Our rear line is about 14ft which is really very short, but again my preference and rarely an issue, on rivers, we swap it out.

 

 

 

Be aware that 'soft shackles' etc make it very easy to remove the centerline, sadly last time I replaced ours I lost the first replacement.

 

 

 

 

Daniel

[Alastair]

Nylon isn't great on a big boat - if you are surging the rope round a bollard it is surprising how hot it can get - nylon melts awfully easily. The stretchyness can also result in very tight knots.

 

For handling, I much much prefer the polyprop.

 

If working with very heavy lines, ones that don't sink are real blessing when laying a long length out. I had to re-lay a mooring line in a flood - 50m of 40mm braid. Weighed nearly as much as I did, used a canoe to transport it and was nearly in tears from exhaustion by the time I'd finished. Not really a worry on a canal, I know!

[Naughty Cal]

We use braided rope as it is much easier to handle. We only use 12mm rope though as our boat isn't very heavy to handle.

 

As for length check what the minimum you require is where you intend to cruise. The absolute minimum for the Trent and use is 10m and this can be too short at times. We currently use 12m at the bow and 10m at the stern, two ropes at each end so four in total.

 

People talk about having bow or centrelines that can't reach the props but on smaller boats this doesn't really work. Our boat is only 7.2m long so ropes shorter than that wouldn't work for our cruising grounds!