junior Posted March 15, 2017 Report Share Posted March 15, 2017 8 hours ago, Cloudinspector said: Can anyone shed any light on this? https://www.apolloduck.com/feature.phtml?id=495348 As is the case with many on here, if you have a look back through the thread you'll find it as this boats been advertised a few times already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete harrison Posted March 16, 2017 Report Share Posted March 16, 2017 On 14/03/2017 at 22:15, Cloudinspector said: Can anyone shed any light on this? https://www.apolloduck.com/feature.phtml?id=495348 I remember this boat as GENERAL LEE, owned in the early 1980's by John and Madeline Forth - although they sold it in 1984 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Brightley Posted March 23, 2017 Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 Maybe not historic as such, but certainly a classic in its own right - 1971 Malcolm Braine which has one owner from new ! Looks well maintained too. It would be nice if it was acquired by someone who would look after it enthusiastically, rather than being bought as a cheap liveaboard. http://narrowboats.apolloduck.co.uk/feature.phtml?id=506604 https://www.andurilforsale.co.uk/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan_fincher Posted March 23, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 1 hour ago, John Brightley said: Maybe not historic as such, but certainly a classic in its own right - 1971 Malcolm Braine which has one owner from new ! Looks well maintained too. It would be nice if it was acquired by someone who would look after it enthusiastically, rather than being bought as a cheap liveaboard. http://narrowboats.apolloduck.co.uk/feature.phtml?id=506604 https://www.andurilforsale.co.uk/ It does indeed look very well looked after, but at the end of the day it is a 46 year old boat with a Masonite clad wooden top, and its engine hidden away in a sound insulated box. To me, however well presented, it seems staggeringly expensive, I'm afraid - certainly not a "cheap" live-aboard, surely? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan_fincher Posted March 23, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2017 (edited) I think I mist have taken this when Anduril was virtually new. I wonder why it appears to have been renumbered from "No 98" to "No 96"? Edited March 23, 2017 by alan_fincher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave moore Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 I've no idea why the number changed, perhaps a slip of the signwriter's brush? It's not unknown. Years ago I accidentally enlarged a customer's family by painting " and sons " when there was only one! Luckily he was a friend who took it in good part. Lovely to see the early photograph. Malcolm was partly responsible for my involvement in canals, I've known him since the early 60s. The lettering is the work of Ted Chetwynd, a Black Country boatyard signwriter...watching him work was the inspiration to pick up brushes when I was a teen, many years ago. Dave 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junior Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 13 hours ago, alan_fincher said: It does indeed look very well looked after, but at the end of the day it is a 46 year old boat with a Masonite clad wooden top, and its engine hidden away in a sound insulated box. To me, however well presented, it seems staggeringly expensive, I'm afraid - certainly not a "cheap" live-aboard, surely? This might be controversial, but apart from the obvious nice lines you would expect from a MB boat, it's a pretty uninspiring boat in my opinion. It's got a funny engine, in a funny box, and the interior decor looks more outdated than my grandparents house and they've been dead 15 years. Oh and the price is mental. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanM Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 (edited) I think it's a case of the owners thinking vastly more of the boat than what the reality is which I suppose is fair enough after owning it for so long but a reality check is definitely needed. On reading more of the website about the boat I see it's a wooden top too. Edited March 24, 2017 by IanM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 24 minutes ago, IanM said: On reading more of the website about the boat I see it's a wooden top too. ...as mentioned by Alan in post number..er..um...in a recent post, yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 1 hour ago, junior said: This might be controversial, but apart from the obvious nice lines you would expect from a MB boat, it's a pretty uninspiring boat in my opinion. It's got a funny engine, in a funny box, and the interior decor looks more outdated than my grandparents house and they've been dead 15 years. Oh and the price is mental. Not a fan, then? The interior is cottage-style, which many people like. I'd say timeless rather than dated. What's funny about a Mercedes 636? Quite a few older boats have them. It's probably easier to obtain spares for than a "trad" vintage engine, and it's probably period-appropriate for a boat of that age. The Dexion-type framing around it is not uncommon - I've certainly seen similar in a French & Peel tug. I think it's for safety, to prevent people from getting bits of themselves trapped in bits of the engine. You are correct about the price - but if you start too low you can't go higher (or very rarely anyway - I seem to remember seeing that exact thing done, and the boat sold at the higher price!) whereas if you pitch the price slightly high then you have room to manoeuvre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bargemast Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 3 minutes ago, Athy said: Not a fan, then? The interior is cottage-style, which many people like. I'd say timeless rather than dated. What's funny about a Mercedes 636? Quite a few older boats have them. It's probably easier to obtain spares for than a "trad" vintage engine, and it's probably period-appropriate for a boat of that age. The Dexion-type framing around it is not uncommon - I've certainly seen similar in a French & Peel tug. I think it's for safety, to prevent people from getting bits of themselves trapped in bits of the engine. You are correct about the price - but if you start too low you can't go higher (or very rarely anyway - I seem to remember seeing that exact thing done, and the boat sold at the higher price!) whereas if you pitch the price slightly high then you have room to manoeuvre. I can't say anything about this boat, but I can say something about the engine, the Mercedes OM 636 is one of the best engines Mercedes has ever built, this engine here is quite likely the only one that's installed in a narrowboat, but there are still thousends (without exagerating) installed in boats on the other side of the Channel, I even have a Mercedes OM 636 in one of my boats. You can find them also in small trucks, generators, tractors and not to forget the famous all terrain vehicle Mercedes Unimog, it's a very versatile and virtually almost indestructible engine that Mercedes produced for about 50 years. Peter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 1 minute ago, bargemast said: I can't say anything about this boat, but I can say something about the engine, the Mercedes OM 636 is one of the best engines Mercedes has ever built, this engine here is quite likely the only one that's installed in a narrowboat, but there are still thousends (without exagerating) installed in boats on the other side of the Channel, I even have a Mercedes OM 636 in one of my boats. You can find them also in small trucks, generators, tractors and not to forget the famous all terrain vehicle Mercedes Unimog, it's a very versatile and virtually almost indestructible engine that Mercedes produced for about 50 years. Peter. Good info, Peter - but I have seen them in other narrowboats, including one which we viewed when we were shopping for our first boat, which is why I particularly remember it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bargemast Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 1 hour ago, Athy said: Good info, Peter - but I have seen them in other narrowboats, including one which we viewed when we were shopping for our first boat, which is why I particularly remember it. I am amazed to learn that there are more narrowboats that have a Mercedes OM 636 engine, this was the first time I heard about one fitted in one. They must be pretty rare anyway, as in all the years that I've been reading about narrowboats, and looking regulary through the ads, I've never seen one listed before. Many years ago I had an old 1957 Mercedes 180D ex-taxi, that had done 500.000km when the car died, the engine was never overhauled and still running beautifully, it was bought by someone who was going to marinise her and put her in a boat, I wouldn't be surprised if she's still running. Peter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 10 minutes ago, bargemast said: I am amazed to learn that there are more narrowboats that have a Mercedes OM 636 engine, this was the first time I heard about one fitted in one. They must be pretty rare anyway, as in all the years that I've been reading about narrowboats, and looking regulary through the ads, I've never seen one listed before. Well, a thread on here in 2014 was about a member's 636 in his narrowboat. I've seen a for-sale advert for a 70 foot Springer fitted with one; and Paul Smith, formerly of Calcutt Marina, who writes the "Living On A Narrowboat" blog, had one in his 60-footer. No doubt there are others! I looked at its spec and was surprised to find that, for an engine introduced in 1949, it's quite high-revving, getting up to 3,600 r.p.m. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan_fincher Posted March 24, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 2 hours ago, bargemast said: I can't say anything about this boat, but I can say something about the engine, the Mercedes OM 636 is one of the best engines Mercedes has ever built, this engine here is quite likely the only one that's installed in a narrowboat, but there are still thousends (without exagerating) installed in boats on the other side of the Channel, I even have a Mercedes OM 636 in one of my boats. Yes there hav4e definitely been a t least a handful about the OM 636 in narrowboats over the years on here. Not very common, but not completely rare. I think this may have been quite a popular engine for Malcolm Braine to have used at the time, when he wasn't making use of the BMC 1500, (which he even put into much remodelled former working boats). However reliable the engine, it is surely not a significant part of the justification for such a large price tag? I would have thought most people wanting to buy something with a traditional engine room with back cabin aft of it, would be looking for something not out of place in such an arrangement. It's highly unusual, i would have thought, to have a "traditional" engine room, then hide the engine in a soundproofing box. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cereal tiller Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 2 hours ago, bargemast said: I can't say anything about this boat, but I can say something about the engine, the Mercedes OM 636 is one of the best engines Mercedes has ever built, this engine here is quite likely the only one that's installed in a narrowboat, but there are still thousends (without exagerating) installed in boats on the other side of the Channel, I even have a Mercedes OM 636 in one of my boats. You can find them also in small trucks, generators, tractors and not to forget the famous all terrain vehicle Mercedes Unimog, it's a very versatile and virtually almost indestructible engine that Mercedes produced for about 50 years. Peter. The OM636 was standard fit for Ocean 30's and IIRC the 70's built ones were manufactured in Spain?then Marinised in the UK Good machine ,pleasant sounding with the lovely wheezing noise at idle due to the Pneumatic Governor Only weakness was the TMP gearbox. 42 HP. CT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junior Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 3 hours ago, Athy said: Not a fan, then? The interior is cottage-style, which many people like. I'd say timeless rather than dated. What's funny about a Mercedes 636? Quite a few older boats have them. It's probably easier to obtain spares for than a "trad" vintage engine, and it's probably period-appropriate for a boat of that age. The Dexion-type framing around it is not uncommon - I've certainly seen similar in a French & Peel tug. I think it's for safety, to prevent people from getting bits of themselves trapped in bits of the engine. You are correct about the price - but if you start too low you can't go higher (or very rarely anyway - I seem to remember seeing that exact thing done, and the boat sold at the higher price!) whereas if you pitch the price slightly high then you have room to manoeuvre. We'll have to disagree on the difference between timeless & dated. If there is a difference of course. I wasn't diss'ing this engine as being rubbish or unpopular, i was suggesting that for a boat of this style with a trad engineroom/back cabin i would imagine most people would expect to see a Gardner or the superior Lister engine. Not a taxi engine in a tea chest. All opinions of course, and as Chris Pink/Paddles Up/Haulier P/Emma B, or whatever he was calling himself then reminded me once, he's forgotten in one afternoon more than i know about boats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 Timeless is a hoorah word, dated is a boo word! Their meanings can be very close. I know what you're saying about the sort of engine that we'd expect to find inhabiting an engine room - you are, as you probably know, preaching to the converted. But let us remember that this craft was built in 1971; in those days, dropping a big thumpy thing into a new boat was perhaps not as popular as it is now, so the choice of the Merc engine would not have seemed out of place. If it is still the original, then it was obviously a pretty good choice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan_fincher Posted March 24, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 1 hour ago, junior said: All opinions of course, and as Chris Pink/Paddles Up/Haulier P/Emma B, or whatever he was calling himself then reminded me once, he's forgotten in one afternoon more than i know about boats. Point of order, sir! Paddles Up was certainly a doppleganger, but, (somewhat unusually), was not Chris Pink. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bargemast Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 2 hours ago, cereal tiller said: The OM636 was standard fit for Ocean 30's and IIRC the 70's built ones were manufactured in Spain?then Marinised in the UK Good machine ,pleasant sounding with the lovely wheezing noise at idle due to the Pneumatic Governor Only weakness was the TMP gearbox. 42 HP. CT Another boat that was built in the UK and fitted as standard with a Mercedes OM 636 was the highly popular CATFISHER 28 they were fitted with a VOLVO hydraulic drive with 2 props and were incredibly manoeuvrable. I never knew that there were at least a handful narrowboats with this engine. Of course a higher price because of an engine like this in a traditional engineroom is not justified, and even less being hidden away in a soundproof box, which may be pleasant for the ears, but certainly not for the views of engine(room) enthousiasts. Peter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek R. Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 I thought the interior was most appealing. My Gran died forty years ago, and were the house still standing I'd have loved to move straight in. It was comforting and welcoming, just like my Gran. But that just reflects one experience and taste. Sounds like the Merc. is a good'un then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billh Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 Got an OM636 in an ex Royal Navy narrowboat(1972) here. PRM160 gearbox, skin tank oil coolers for gearbox and engine.Bowman water cooled exhaust manifold. The engine came from a written off van at 9000 miles in 1985. Loads of power, pretty reliable, no smoke ,totally boring! ( to a Kelvin and National user). Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Brightley Posted March 24, 2017 Report Share Posted March 24, 2017 (edited) As Alan Fincher says above, the Mercedes OM636 was a very common engine in Malcolm Braine-built boats during the '70's - a number of them were featured when new in Waterways World articles. Edited March 24, 2017 by John Brightley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D. W. Walker Posted March 25, 2017 Report Share Posted March 25, 2017 Apparently, the design brief for this Mercedes diesel, when installed in a road vehicle, is it should last 1 million km! So its no surprise it's still going in a 46 year old narrowboat, despite its seemingly high revs, and why taxis everywhere apart from the UK are Mercs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek R. Posted March 25, 2017 Report Share Posted March 25, 2017 Having just heard some on You Tube, I can see why they got boxed in - and hopefully heavily lagged! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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