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Babyjune

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Hello am very much a newbie and would appreciate any information and thoughts. I would like to have a little get together for friends a family on my 45 ft Liverpool built narrow boat but not sure how many people can be safely accommodated aboard.

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Hello am very much a newbie and would appreciate any information and thoughts. I would like to have a little get together for friends a family on my 45 ft Liverpool built narrow boat but not sure how many people can be safely accommodated aboard.

If it was me,i would take the boat to the nearest pub and have the get together there.you could invite as many as you like,and they could use the pub toilet instead of filling up yours.Hope you have a nice time. :cheers:

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If it was me,i would take the boat to the nearest pub and have the get together there.you could invite as many as you like,and they could use the pub toilet instead of filling up yours.Hope you have a nice time. :cheers:

 

Sounds like a good plan just don't want to invite everyone back for a look and end up sinking the boat lol

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BBQ's are great for that sort of thing, get a cheap gazebo from b&q just in case it rains and robert's your mums brother :cheers:

 

I think that's a good idea too, that way the OP can limit how many people are on the boat at any one time but still involve every body - it should go without saying of course not to block the tow-path though.

 

 

ed to make sense..

Edited by The Dog House
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You could probably get more in safely than you could comfortably!

Strictly speaking, if you want the letter of the law, you shouldn't have more than 12 (and up to 3 crew) without an MCA certificate and a qualified skipper, even if the boat isn't going anywhere.

 

That might be a useful thing to quote if it looks like you're about to be overwhelmed by a boarding party....

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You could probably get more in safely than you could comfortably!

Strictly speaking, if you want the letter of the law, you shouldn't have more than 12 (and up to 3 crew) without an MCA certificate and a qualified skipper, even if the boat isn't going anywhere.

 

I thought that only applied when under way, and that there was no limit when you are moored. Have I got that wrong?

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I thought that only applied when under way, and that there was no limit when you are moored. Have I got that wrong?

I am unaware of anything in the regulations which diffentiates between moving and moored craft. The MCA rules do tend to concentrate upon commercial passenger boats, rather than boats not being used for financial gain, however the 12 passengers plus crew (I thought it was 2 but it could be 3) applies to all boats, irrespective of their usage. With any more than 12 passengers, at least one crew member must possess a relevant and current Boat Master's Licence.

 

Equally important is that any craft with more than 12 passengers on board must also meet a much higher safety standard than required by the BSC, including the provision of life belts, additioanl Fire fighting equipment, First Aid equipment, etc. plus the training to use them.

Edited by David Schweizer
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The usually problem with a lot of guests onboard your boat is their urge to swarm about on your roof, this behavior can make a boat ''unstable!!''.

 

either that - or how big your PO tank is or how many cassettes you have.. :o

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Can anyone clarify this. If I want 15 people on the boat can I call three of them crew and nobody needs a MCA licence or is it that the minute there are more than 12 people on the boat at least one must have the licence and if there are any more than three crew the boat is treated as a commercial vessel?

 

What is the situation with regard to Day Hire Boats. If they have a skipper employed by the hire company surely they are then a commercial craft and should be treated as any other MCA registered craft. Or are we in unchartered territory with this one?

 

I have the appropriate MCA licence and have always understood that the minute the number of people on board exceeds 12 there must be a licenced skipper and, thus, the boat must comply wth all other MCA regulations in the same way as a larger canal craft.

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When I lived in Tokyo I once went to a party in a room that measured about 10ft x 7ft. There were about 10 or 12 people and we all danced and had a good time. The room was wrecked though.

Gotta hand it to the japanese. They can minaturise anything

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Can anyone clarify this. If I want 15 people on the boat can I call three of them crew and nobody needs a MCA licence or is it that the minute there are more than 12 people on the boat at least one must have the licence and if there are any more than three crew the boat is treated as a commercial vessel?

 

What is the situation with regard to Day Hire Boats. If they have a skipper employed by the hire company surely they are then a commercial craft and should be treated as any other MCA registered craft. Or are we in unchartered territory with this one?

 

I have the appropriate MCA licence and have always understood that the minute the number of people on board exceeds 12 there must be a licenced skipper and, thus, the boat must comply wth all other MCA regulations in the same way as a larger canal craft.

My understanding from my 'training' on Tarporley is that you can have up to three crew, none of whom have to be qualified, in addition to twelve passengers. If you have more than twelve passengers, ahem, one or two of them could indeed become crew, seeing as no qualification is required. So yes, a maximum of fifteen in total without either qualified skipper or MCA inspection. And yes, again according to what I was told, it makes no difference whether the boat is tied up or under way.

 

Do the regs say 'people' or 'passengers'?

Edited by Chertsey
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Can anyone clarify this. If I want 15 people on the boat can I call three of them crew and nobody needs a MCA licence or is it that the minute there are more than 12 people on the boat at least one must have the licence and if there are any more than three crew the boat is treated as a commercial vessel?

 

What is the situation with regard to Day Hire Boats. If they have a skipper employed by the hire company surely they are then a commercial craft and should be treated as any other MCA registered craft. Or are we in unchartered territory with this one?

 

I have the appropriate MCA licence and have always understood that the minute the number of people on board exceeds 12 there must be a licenced skipper and, thus, the boat must comply wth all other MCA regulations in the same way as a larger canal craft.

Just don't tell anyone or have an accident

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I seem to remember we had about 19, ("-ish" ??), on "Owl" at a banter a few yeras back.

 

As a Josher only goes down by about 1" per ton, there is of course little problem in loading in many times that number, but I certainly don't know about the legalities of it!

 

I think we probably had about 13 on when Sickle was acting as taxi to the pub at the Braunston show. None were knowingly lost from the patio area!

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My understanding from my 'training' on Tarporley is that you can have up to three crew, none of whom have to be qualified, in addition to twelve passengers. If you have more than twelve passengers, ahem, one or two of them could indeed become crew, seeing as no qualification is required. So yes, a maximum of fifteen in total without either qualified skipper or MCA inspection. And yes, again according to what I was told, it makes no difference whether the boat is tied up or under way.

 

Do the regs say 'people' or 'passengers'?

The 'regulations' (Inland Waters Small Passenger Boat Code) may be voluntary, but are a condition of licensing for commercial boats on BW/CART waters. They apply specifically to passenger boats which are operating commercially with skipper and crew, which carry 12 or fewer passengers and section 3.1.1 confirms that any person aboard is considered as a passenger except for:

 

1.         a person employed or engaged in any capacity of the vessel’s business;

 

2.         a person on board the vessel, either in pursuance of the obligation laid upon the master to carry shipwrecked, distressed or other persons, or by reason of any circumstance that neither the master nor the owner nor the charterer (if any) could have prevented or forestalled;

 

3.         a child under one year of age”  

 

There is no mention of maximum numbers of persons aboard who fall into these three categories, so a three crew limit must be a 'house rule' or requirement of the National Community Boats Association. A qualified skipper is required holding a MCA Boatmaster Tier 2 Licence or one of the following - NCBA Community Boat Management, RYA Powerboat 2 or RYA Inland Helmsman Certificates, all with minimum 12 months logged experience. Anyone who carries more than 12 fare paying passengers without a MCA Certificated operation would risk prosecution.

 

Passenger boat operators on CART waters also require permission to operate from their local waterway manager as well as being licensed by the Boating Trade Team.

 

The Small Passenger Boat Code does not apply to self drive or day hire boats which would be governed by the BMF codes of practice. They certainly don't apply to privately owned boats with a group of friends on board - the only thing I can think which would limit the number onboard is insurance where the maximum persons onboard was in excess of the builder's maximum declared loading plate. Who would be checking anyway?

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Assuming you are on a canal, the answer is you can get loads of people 'on' because you can have them walking alongside and helping at locks etc. That way you can have dogs too which adds to the fun. What you want is somewhere to moor up for a BBQ about 3 miles from base. Gazebo and chairs and bar & BBQ travel on the boat, with kitchen and precook etc - with any that cant walk - all the rest on foot.

It works a treat. The walk back gives a chance to work off the excess burgers.

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I am sure that Mike's (post 22) is the definitive answer and certainly supersedes anything I have said.

 

I do recall getting into a discussion on here a while back though in which I was convinced (against what I had previously believed) that a 12 passenger limit did also apply to non fare paying passengers. Not that I wasn't happy to ignore it when filling Chertsey with human ballast at Braunston in previous years, though.

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BBQ's are great for that sort of thing, get a cheap gazebo from b&q just in case it rains and robert's your mums brother :cheers:

 

Like they said !!! This is what we do with our 58ft boat, we have barbecue's almost daily during summer and find the gazebo gizmo is just fantastic for entertaining.

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