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Sam

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Hi All

I'm Paula and have been living aboard my WB for about 6 weeks now. 

I'm slowly learning as I go and getting used to the basics that you don't even consider when you're on dry land. I've had random electrical problems, shared my bed with a dozen spiders (that I know of), have a daily chat with the local swans over my morning cuppa and occasionally do miss a bath to have a soak in ...: but I wouldn't change it :-)

Apologies in advance for all the dumb questions I'm bound to ask and thanks to those patient souls who've helped me already :-) 

 

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On 4/10/2017 at 07:56, Tony Brooks said:

 

What is "a spaded break" - not a well known electrical term so one can only guess what you mean. Now I am far form sure that you know what a Smartbank is or does.

Suitable for what? If you mean charging two batteries from one alternator then yes provided the alternator output is wired to the DOMESTIC battery. It is no different to a split charge relay except it will not join the banks until the alternator is charging. It will not have the "alarm" and charge the engine battery first that a Smartbank has but I do not see the Smartbank extra features as important. If you have twin alternators a VSR, split charge relay or Smartbank is not needed.

When you fit solar a bi-directional VSR will charge both banks although for the vast majority of  boaters the engine battery is always al but fully charged so needs little if any solar charging.

Thanks Tony

Sorry for my improvised terminology, what I mean iss that the positives both (engine and leisure) both have a wire with a spade connector 

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HI again

 

Couple of quick question;

1 does my wood burner have to be defra approved as I've read that non-defra are easier to keep in overnight?

2 Does a inverter have to be wired directly to the batteries or through the fuse box?

Thanks in anticipation

Darren

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On 4/9/2017 at 18:10, WotEver said:

Is that cable at least 25mm2?

Thanks the positive wires from battery to battery is about 2-3mm diameter and does look a bit thin, what size should the wires going into the relay be?

 

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17 minutes ago, Darrbev said:

> does my wood burner have to be defra approved as I've read that non-defra are easier to keep in overnight?<

Only if you are moored in a smoke control area. Otherwise (ie out in the countryside) no problem at all. Others will be along to comment about burning wood on a solid fuel stove.

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11 minutes ago, Darrbev said:

Thanks the positive wires from battery to battery is about 2-3mm diameter and does look a bit thin, what size should the wires going into the relay be?

All battery cabling, wherever it goes, should be at the very minimum 25mm2 to pass the BSS. That's generally around 10mm diameter including the insulation. 

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36 minutes ago, Darrbev said:

Thanks Tony

Sorry for my improvised terminology, what I mean iss that the positives both (engine and leisure) both have a wire with a spade connector 

I would not use a spade connection on any charging circuit because the currents involved can be high. A 9mm spade might just about do but I would use heavy duty eye terminals.

 

28 minutes ago, Darrbev said:

Thanks the positive wires from battery to battery is about 2-3mm diameter and does look a bit thin, what size should the wires going into the relay be?

 

The BSS specifies 25 sq mm Conductor Cross sectional Area (CCSA) battery cable. This is around 10mm (1/2") in diameter. Charging cables can be thinner but how thin depends upon the run length and the maximum alternator output.

2 to 3 mm OD cable suggests it is probably nominally 25, 30, 8.7, or 17.5 amp cable but that is misleading because its the run length and current that defines the cbale CCSA required. It sounds far to thin for anything around the batteries.

31 minutes ago, Darrbev said:

HI again

 

Couple of quick question;

1 does my wood burner have to be defra approved as I've read that non-defra are easier to keep in overnight?

2 Does a inverter have to be wired directly to the batteries or through the fuse box?

Thanks in anticipation

Darren

The inverter shoudl have a fuse (a great big one) in its 12V supply lead close to the batteries as should the supply cable to the domestic distribution board.

I think DEFRA approval is only required if you intend to burn wood or non-smokeless fuel in a smoke control area. These stoves pass the smoke back through the fire so the soot is burned. I think it is OK to use a non DEFA stove as long as you also burn smokeless fuel.

 

PS  I am concerned that you may not understand how to get cable sizes correct.

Edited by Tony Brooks
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39 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

I would not use a spade connection on any charging circuit because the currents involved can be high. A 9mm spade might just about do but I would use heavy duty eye terminals.

 

The BSS specifies 25 sq mm Conductor Cross sectional Area (CCSA) battery cable. This is around 10mm (1/2") in diameter. Charging cables can be thinner but how thin depends upon the run length and the maximum alternator output.

2 to 3 mm OD cable suggests it is probably nominally 25, 30, 8.7, or 17.5 amp cable but that is misleading because its the run length and current that defines the cbale CCSA required. It sounds far to thin for anything around the batteries.

The inverter shoudl have a fuse (a great big one) in its 12V supply lead close to the batteries as should the supply cable to the domestic distribution board.

I think DEFRA approval is only required if you intend to burn wood or non-smokeless fuel in a smoke control area. These stoves pass the smoke back through the fire so the soot is burned. I think it is OK to use a non DEFA stove as long as you also burn smokeless fuel.

 

PS  I am concerned that you may not understand how to get cable sizes correct.

Thanks Tony

I do understand diameter vs cross sectional area but yes, I don't know the rules yet and won't fit anything without good advice. 10mm does seem a little thick to go into the relay though.

Thanks

Darren

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2 minutes ago, Darrbev said:

Thanks Tony

I do understand diameter vs cross sectional area but yes, I don't know the rules yet and won't fit anything without good advice. 10mm does seem a little thick to go into the relay though.

Thanks

Darren

The cable for the relay is not a battery cable and can be thinner but it may have to carry the full alternator output plus a bit more. Once you know how many amps that is and the cable run length you/we can work out an acceptable CCSA.

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On 4/12/2017 at 19:46, Tony Brooks said:

The cable for the relay is not a battery cable and can be thinner but it may have to carry the full alternator output plus a bit more. Once you know how many amps that is and the cable run length you/we can work out an acceptable CCSA.

Thanks tony

memeories are now coming back on that from my past

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hi folks,

I go by the name of 'The Grumpy Triker' and due to personal circumstances am now fulfilling my Plan C and joining the canal network as a liveaboard.

not bought yet...watch this space as aiming to resolve my homeless status in next few weeks, but looking forward to joining a great community, and hopefully to doing up my boat.

love the river and the people so was my only end point...not sitting staring at a 10x10 walled room and a TV :-)

will update and looking forward to seeing some of you around the networks.....I will be wearing 'L Plates' 

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Hi I have just returned from our first boating holiday and am determined to realise my dream of living on one. I'm a total novice with loads to learn but I'm in love!! I have no idea where to start? 

But I will soak up all advice given. My first question is about location of moorings, does anyone know of somewhere as far south easterly as possible? Any suggestions? 

Next question is about the boat show in Crick so we can really get to see what is out there, can anyone recommend a nearby camp site? 

I appreciate any help given. Thanks 

Tracey 

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10 hours ago, Tracey Bonds said:

Hi I have just returned from our first boating holiday and am determined to realise my dream of living on one. I'm a total novice with loads to learn but I'm in love!! I have no idea where to start? 

But I will soak up all advice given. My first question is about location of moorings, does anyone know of somewhere as far south easterly as possible? Any suggestions? 

Next question is about the boat show in Crick so we can really get to see what is out there, can anyone recommend a nearby camp site? 

I appreciate any help given. Thanks 

Tracey 

Welcome to the forum. 

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On ‎12‎/‎04‎/‎2017 at 19:00, Tony Brooks said:

I think DEFRA approval is only required if you intend to burn wood or non-smokeless fuel in a smoke control area. These stoves pass the smoke back through the fire so the soot is burned. I think it is OK to use a non DEFA stove as long as you also burn smokeless fuel.

The Clean Air Act 1993 does apply to boats on CRT waters but only under the provisions made in Part VI Section 44 as boats on CRT waters fall within the definition of “Vessels” given in the Clean Air Act 1993 Part VII Section 64.  

The content of Smoke Control Orders have no effect on vessels covered by Part VI section 44.  

What legal status do boats have under the Clean Air Act 1993, if any?

 5.2.1 The Clean Air Act Part VI Special Cases Section 44 makes a provision that applies to vessels. So does this apply to our case?
 5.2.1.1 In Part VII General Section 64 the Act states : "vessel" has the same meaning as “ship” in the Merchant Shipping Act 1995
 5.2.1.2 So what does the Merchant Shipping Act 1995 define as a ship?
 5.2.1.3 Merchant Shipping Act 1995 Section313 Definitions states: " ship " includes every description of vessel used in navigation.
 5.2.1.4 So it would be safe to say, under the Clean Air Act 1993 any description of vessel that is used for navigation falls under this definition. So this would include narrowboats, barges, or any other description of vessel that has an engine or other means allowing it to move, or navigate from one place to another.

Thus the provisions made by Part VI Special Cases section 44 “Vessels” applies.
 

Basically boats are exempt from the act.

 

Edited by Alan de Enfield
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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi everyone

 

my names Gary , complete newbie to boating and just bought a dawncraft dandy , (little lolly) renamed little ollie, currently moored on the bridgewater canal. The mooring was more attractive than the boat but its a start nonetheless! bit overwhelmed at the moment as its a project boat and keep starting jobs , not finishing them and moving on to other jobs ha ha, i have tons of questions so please do point me in the direction of where to ask them as ive got sooooooooo much to do! 

 

below is what needs doing and what ive started

 

complete sanding and painting of the boat ( completely sanded , just waiting for a cluster of dry days to start priming and painting

windows leaking from most points needs sealing or rebedding( started to clean them and prep for the hope of a quick seal and fix!)

Engine needs a few bits ( recoil spring, choke repair and service booked in)

electrics and gas(completely stripped of old electrics to blank canvas, someone booked in as not confident with both of these)

refit ( completely stripped out everything, blank canvas ready to refit once above is sorted)

need to source pullpit and rear rails for saftey (will have young kids on board)

 

hope ive not rabbited on to much and hope to get some quick pointers from all you experienced guys out there!

 

thanks

 

 

 

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Welcome to the forum, Gary :)

The windows will have to come out and be re-bedded with new window tape for a proper job. You might also need to replace some of the rubber seals - only inspection can tell you that. Whatever you do don't be tempted to use silicone as a temp fix - there are plenty of other sealers out there that won't destroy your paintwork and then fail in 18 months anyway. Be very careful if you do remove the frames as it's exceedingly easy to bend or break them. 

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34 minutes ago, WotEver said:

Welcome to the forum, Gary :)

The windows will have to come out and be re-bedded with new window tape for a proper job. You might also need to replace some of the rubber seals - only inspection can tell you that. Whatever you do don't be tempted to use silicone as a temp fix - there are plenty of other sealers out there that won't destroy your paintwork and then fail in 18 months anyway. Be very careful if you do remove the frames as it's exceedingly easy to bend or break them. 

thanks for the tips, to be honest upon inspection i actually cannot see any visible seals! one of the windows on each side is a slider and theres definiltey no rubber seal at the end of that as i can see a few mm gap to the outside world! so theres that, maybe they are bedded up inside the alu frame which i cannot get off without drilling the pop rivets out and i dont want to do that yet until ive got all the proper tools to re-fit back.

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2 hours ago, Gazzanut1980 said:

Hi everyone

 

my names Gary , complete newbie to boating and just bought a dawncraft dandy , (little lolly) renamed little ollie, currently moored on the bridgewater canal. The mooring was more attractive than the boat but its a start nonetheless! bit overwhelmed at the moment as its a project boat and keep starting jobs , not finishing them and moving on to other jobs ha ha, i have tons of questions so please do point me in the direction of where to ask them as ive got sooooooooo much to do! 

 

below is what needs doing and what ive started

 

complete sanding and painting of the boat ( completely sanded , just waiting for a cluster of dry days to start priming and painting

windows leaking from most points needs sealing or rebedding( started to clean them and prep for the hope of a quick seal and fix!)

Engine needs a few bits ( recoil spring, choke repair and service booked in)

electrics and gas(completely stripped of old electrics to blank canvas, someone booked in as not confident with both of these)

refit ( completely stripped out everything, blank canvas ready to refit once above is sorted)

need to source pullpit and rear rails for saftey (will have young kids on board)

 

hope ive not rabbited on to much and hope to get some quick pointers from all you experienced guys out there!

 

thanks

 

 

 

Welcome Gary. 

 

You may find this thread useful(be warned it's quite a long thread) :-

 

 

 

Edited by rusty69
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On 16/10/2016 at 13:12, Bromleyxphil said:

Hi Folks,

 

My name is Phil and I'm a retired teacher who has just managed to persuade his wife that we should have a narrowboat.

 

I'm in the very early stages of planning buy and then to fit out a 57 foot sailaway. I have always been a builder and frustrated engineer and having built houses, extensions, Motorhomes "this is the latest one http://www.ourworldtraveller.com"the project itself doesn't frighten me. I am about to embark on the research and intend getting onto as many boats and talking to as many boaters as possible.

 

I'm hoping to be able to pick some of your brains but my biggest fear at the moment is trawling my wife around boatyards and putting her off with boats she doesn't like and folk who don't enthuse. Where are the best places/shows to go to, and who are the best people to talk to.

 

Cards on the table we have been on a hire boat in the past and we both loved the experience but the wife hated the boat, in her words "a dump" in other words "a hire boat". I know we love the mobile life and I know I can build a boat to the standard she would want. I just need to get there!

 

Phil

Hi guys, sorry to quote myself but it's just to let you know where I am up to.  I have been away in China so not much has changed since my last posts.  I have however booked the campsite and the tickets and am on my way "wife as well" to Crick next weekend. I was wondering if you folk with more experience of this event had any advice of how to get the most out of the show.

thanks

Phil

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