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TVs - 12 or 240v?


PeterDHS

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Looking ahead to the long dark nights and thinking of getting an on-board TV ! ... but it seems that 12v LED TVs cost a lot more than 240v flat screens. We would welcome views of the pros and cons of 240/12v screens to help us decide.

 

Hello my two penneths worth.

 

We have a 12v Kenmark with built in freeview and DVD player. We only have 12v when were on the move as we have no inverter. We have 240v when on shore power. I understand that 12v is more efficient as you are not getting your power via the inverter. Do not buy a specialist 12v tv but go into the normal electrical outlets and ask for there 12v tv's these usually have an external transformer so you can spot them. There is a company called Amporer that do special transfromer so we can run ours from a cigarette lighter. Im sure others will come and comment in due course.

 

Heres our TV http://www.comet.co.uk/shopcomet/product/5...b/specification

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Looking ahead to the long dark nights and thinking of getting an on-board TV ! ... but it seems that 12v LED TVs cost a lot more than 240v flat screens. We would welcome views of the pros and cons of 240/12v screens to help us decide.

 

Best to run on 12v when not on shore line, as, otherwise, you are wasting the power taken by the inverter itself. There are some good dual voltage TVs at a reasonable price (no transformer needed) if you avoid the chandlery and caravan markets. I always have trouble posting links, but here goes!

Mr LCD

 

We bought ours there last year, works fine.

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Do not buy a specialist 12v tv but go into the normal electrical outlets and ask for there 12v tv's these usually have an external transformer so you can spot them.

 

I did this when the 12v ones seemed so expensive. I never found that any sales help knew which were 12v so I just went around Comet and Dixons peering at the backs of teles... I did not know about Amperor (mentioned in Sarah and Ian's post), who make regulated power supplies, so I consulted an electrical engineer friend. My theory was that my tele wanted 12v and the transformer it was sold with, along with mains plug etc. only made 240 acceptable to it. Surely I could run it without the transformer and it would be happy, if only I had a plug with the right connections? It was a 12v tele afterall...

 

My engineer friend said Yes and No and made me a power supply to plug into 12v cigarette lighter. BUT I could only use it when the engine was NOT on, because the supply was unregulated. If I wanted the tele with the engine running I had to plug it into the little inverter and the usual 240v supply that came with the tele.

 

That system worked fine until someone broke into my boat and stole all my stuff...

 

MartinC's link to Mr LCD looks pretty good -- but nb if you buy one of their dual teles to run on 12v they want you to buy the regulated power supply for an extra £20. If you don't, there is a good chance the tele won't work or will break fast and then the guarantee won't be honoured. If you go Ian and Sarah's route the Amperor regulated 12v power supply costs almost £40.

 

The tele Laurieb is linking to is 24". I wouldn't want to run this on a boat relying on batteries rather than shoreline. I'm only a learner on electrics but when I almost bought a 19" tele to replace the stolen one another engineer friend did a calculation for me and claimed it would be like running two headlights on your car with the engine off -- and I think we all know how much battery that can drain in only a couple of hours. I bought a 15.4 inch one instead, plenty big enough and my friend calculated would only use 1 headlamp, so I could run it twice as long.

 

WeDoDigital have reasonable prices, pretty good customer service, and the regulated 12v power supply is included. Most importantly they will honour your guarantee. Mine went wrong... Doesn't mean the tele was bad: I have terrible television karma.

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I did this when the 12v ones seemed so expensive. I never found that any sales help knew which were 12v so I just went around Comet and Dixons peering at the backs of teles... I did not know about Amperor (mentioned in Sarah and Ian's post), who make regulated power supplies, so I consulted an electrical engineer friend. My theory was that my tele wanted 12v and the transformer it was sold with, along with mains plug etc. only made 240 acceptable to it. Surely I could run it without the transformer and it would be happy, if only I had a plug with the right connections? It was a 12v tele afterall...

 

My engineer friend said Yes and No and made me a power supply to plug into 12v cigarette lighter. BUT I could only use it when the engine was NOT on, because the supply was unregulated. If I wanted the tele with the engine running I had to plug it into the little inverter and the usual 240v supply that came with the tele.

 

That system worked fine until someone broke into my boat and stole all my stuff...

 

MartinC's link to Mr LCD looks pretty good -- but nb if you buy one of their dual teles to run on 12v they want you to buy the regulated power supply for an extra £20. If you don't, there is a good chance the tele won't work or will break fast and then the guarantee won't be honoured. If you go Ian and Sarah's route the Amperor regulated 12v power supply costs almost £40.

 

The tele Laurieb is linking to is 24". I wouldn't want to run this on a boat relying on batteries rather than shoreline. I'm only a learner on electrics but when I almost bought a 19" tele to replace the stolen one another engineer friend did a calculation for me and claimed it would be like running two headlights on your car with the engine off -- and I think we all know how much battery that can drain in only a couple of hours. I bought a 15.4 inch one instead, plenty big enough and my friend calculated would only use 1 headlamp, so I could run it twice as long.

 

WeDoDigital have reasonable prices, pretty good customer service, and the regulated 12v power supply is included. Most importantly they will honour your guarantee. Mine went wrong... Doesn't mean the tele was bad: I have terrible television karma.

 

 

Link isn't working

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I almost bought a 19" tele to replace the stolen one another engineer friend did a calculation for me and claimed it would be like running two headlights on your car with the engine off

I've got a 17" LCD with DVD player. Cost me £130 from comet, and has excellent picture quality and very good tuner (The latter do vary a lot).

 

Running it through my 1800W inverter, with nothing else on it is drawing just over 3 amps from the batteries. My previous 15" LCD, which was a 12V, used to draw nearer 4 amps.

 

Just thought it was interesting to give some figures, as it is a long way from two headlights. Shows how much different makes cvan vary as well (the 17" is a 'Cello', the 15" was a Toshiba which also had a crap tuner).

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Surprisingly most 240v TVs work out as efficient as 12v ones even when you take into account the inverter losses (remember that 12v cable runs are inefficient as are 12v-12v stabilised power supplies). Given that you have a much better range of choice (so you can choose an efficient one) and they are much cheaper I'd say go for a 240v one every time if you have an inverter. And I'm saying that as a qualified (ie Chartered) electrical engineer who used to be a TV repairman.

  • Greenie 1
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Surprisingly most 240v TVs work out as efficient as 12v ones even when you take into account the inverter losses (remember that 12v cable runs are inefficient as are 12v-12v stabilised power supplies). Given that you have a much better range of choice (so you can choose an efficient one) and they are much cheaper I'd say go for a 240v one every time if you have an inverter. And I'm saying that as a qualified (ie Chartered) electrical engineer who used to be a TV repairman.

 

Thanks for this and indeed all the other advice.

I guess the 'specialist' marine and caravan TVs claim they are designed for 12v and have better auto-search on weak signals in the middle of nowhere. However, I think the above advice is sound in that modern tellies are efficient and techy enough to overcome most obstacles. We will certainly be looking at small standard flat screens based on this, if it is 240/12v so much the better (we have a 1600w inverter).

Our research found that if you have a 12v telly you need a stabilizer which is cheap- try http://www.12vtv.co.uk - the product is in accessories AD3 Cigar socket to Clipsal plug (£8). Hope this helps others.

Thanks again, Peter.

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I guess the 'specialist' marine and caravan TVs claim they are designed for 12v and have better auto-search on weak signals in the middle of nowhere.

If they were claiming that, I'd be highly cynical.

 

What DOR says is undoubtedly correct - there are large variances in the sensitivity of modern TV tuners, and their ability to produce a reasonable picture from a weak signal.

 

The problem is that you may not find out you have one that is poor in this respect, unless you can get very specific advice from people who have tried different models.

 

I doubt 12 volts offers advantages over 240 volts when it comes to getting a picture, or to it's quality.

 

That said, I personally go the 12 volt route, because I like to keep things simple, and avoid equipment that needs inverters, if it's easy to do it without.

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Sorry I didn't link properly. I will try again.... We Do Digital

 

I am pretty sure it is absolute nonsense that 12v TVs get better signal than 240v... The power is totally different from ability to pick up signal, which is largely related to your antenna anyway.

 

 

edited to fix link...(again)

Edited by Duchess Omnium
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I've got a 17" LCD with DVD player. Cost me £130 from comet, and has excellent picture quality and very good tuner (The latter do vary a lot).

 

Running it through my 1800W inverter, with nothing else on it is drawing just over 3 amps from the batteries. My previous 15" LCD, which was a 12V, used to draw nearer 4 amps.

 

Just thought it was interesting to give some figures, as it is a long way from two headlights. Shows how much different makes cvan vary as well (the 17" is a 'Cello', the 15" was a Toshiba which also had a crap tuner).

:lol:

Agreed

 

My boat runs 240 volt 24/7 365 I have a mastervolt 2k inverter continuously on running 240 domestic fridge and 22inch mains tv/dvd over the years I have had all the different kit and undoubtedly in reality in constant use thro an inverter mains kit uses less battery power this is fact as I am continuous liveaboard. Also hugh battery banks are not needed we have 3 110 amp hour bateries which need topping up for a couple of hours a day and run the boat no probs.

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I have a 19" flatscreen mains TV for when I'm on shore power and a small 10" 12v digital TV (Maplins) for when I'm on the move. The small TV is really good - it draws only 1 amp on 12v and it's stored in a cupboard when I'm back at my mooring.

Edited by blackrose
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I have this, wired straight in like cigerette lighter, so it works 24/7, no need to worry about voltages and can use it anytime, it uses about 3amps for telly and extra 0.5 amps when dvd player is on, awesome picture quality, decent size screen, maybe costs a bit but you wont look back, and uses very little power, saves me having to have inverter on which uses nearly another 2amps, but it does work on both if needed, had it 10 months used it everyday..

 

http://www.leisurepower.co.uk/acatalog/w193dr-b.html

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I have this, wired straight in like cigerette lighter, so it works 24/7, no need to worry about voltages and can use it anytime, it uses about 3amps for telly and extra 0.5 amps when dvd player is on, awesome picture quality, decent size screen, maybe costs a bit but you wont look back, and uses very little power, saves me having to have inverter on which uses nearly another 2amps, but it does work on both if needed, had it 10 months used it everyday..

 

http://www.leisurepower.co.uk/acatalog/w193dr-b.html

Just bought a 240 volt TV/DVD from Tesco for £120 and tried it on the boat, playing a DVD it uses 1amp at 24 volts including inverter as measured by my Stirling unit so I don't know the accuracy

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I was thinking of this dual voltage one from Tesco with freeview and dvd

link

 

 

Hi

 

We tried a couple of these from the supermarkets (different name same TV) and found the internal digi tuner was crap.

We always had better results by running it through our cheap remote digi box.

We bought an LG 22" this year (£150 @ EBay) and the internal Digi tuner is perfect. Although no built in CD or dual votage

Runs at 6.0A + 1.5 for the invertor.

 

Alex

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I have a 19" flatscreen mains TV for when I'm on shore power and a small 10" 12v digital TV for when I'm on the move. The small TV is really good - it draws only 1 amp on 12v and it's stored in a cupboard when I'm back at my mooring.

 

 

Sounds sensible. Whatever you do don't make the mistake of thinking that your boat is a floating flat and buy a 42 inch flat screen TV. Yep, we've seen one on a so called wide beam continuous cruiser who was actually a continuous moorer. They ran an engine or a genny all day everyday and would have run it all night I suspect given half a chance. Those big screens must draw a lot of amps. Personally I don't bother with live TV. whatever I want to watch ends up on IPlayer or $oD etc so a laptop is multi purpose.

 

Right, I'll now go and et my coat and tin hat :lol:

D.

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Last year having bought a 19inch feeview, dvd, tv. with no external transformer, I then bought a 15inch freeview tv with external transformer at my local auction for £45, I had kept the the jack plug from my old black and white tv, plugged this into the tv and ran directly through a 12 volt socket, just had two weeks away and it worked absolutely fine, although I never had the tv. on when the engine was running the tv is a Maxim and retailed at £150. I had watched a 15inch tv. for 7 years and the small tv. is great for hols and when on my mooring I do have hook up, and use the 19inch tv. I only have a small inverter, and use a 12 volt charger for my laptop from Maplins so no noisey fan from an inverter.

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Inverters are really quite efficient, many properly better than the stepdown/12Vregulating units and particularly if your crusing, it doesn't *really* matter anyway. Hence i would go for whatever provides the telly that you want at the best price.

 

Ive got a car charger for my Nokia as im on the boat so much and lots have nokias, but for any other phone, we have a 300w MSW inverter thats never given trouble. This has also run camera/laptop chargers, led fairy lights, 2.1 pc speakers, cordless drill charging, etc. Very useful.

 

 

Daniel

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I have this, wired straight in like cigerette lighter, so it works 24/7, no need to worry about voltages and can use it anytime, it uses about 3amps for telly and extra 0.5 amps when dvd player is on, awesome picture quality, decent size screen, maybe costs a bit but you wont look back, and uses very little power, saves me having to have inverter on which uses nearly another 2amps, but it does work on both if needed, had it 10 months used it everyday..

 

http://www.leisurepower.co.uk/acatalog/w193dr-b.html

 

 

Yes - can confirm... It's a brilliant set, and takes about 36 watts, or 40 watts with the DVD also running...

 

Nick

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  • 9 months later...

For TV on board I've bought a Gazelle omni style antenna with a 12volt amplifier. I'll be connecting this to a 230v LCD TV. I have a 3KW inverter on the boat that will power the TV and 230 domestic fridge.

I haven't coupled all this up yet, but don't foresee any problems. The only thing that may happen is a bit of interference from the modified sine wave inverter. As I understand this, I might be able to cure any interference by using chokes on the 12v supply to the inverter? We will see.

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For TV on board I've bought a Gazelle omni style antenna with a 12volt amplifier. I'll be connecting this to a 230v LCD TV. I have a 3KW inverter on the boat that will power the TV and 230 domestic fridge.

I haven't coupled all this up yet, but don't foresee any problems. The only thing that may happen is a bit of interference from the modified sine wave inverter. As I understand this, I might be able to cure any interference by using chokes on the 12v supply to the inverter? We will see.

 

I can see the only problem you will have will be getting a picture I'm afraid...

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I've no experience of the Gazelle but we get a good Freeview signal on our Omnimax aerial 75% of the time on our travels around the system. The problem is that it's not as if each location has a signal 75% of the time, it's that 3 out of 4 locations have a signal all the time and the other 1 out of 4 locations never gets any signal at all.

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