How do I find a good boat builder?

[NiceNarrowboat]

If your boatbuilder requires stage payments...

 

pay by credit card - that way if they don't deliver, it's the bank that's going after them.

 

You still get your money back if the goods aren't fit for purpose.

 

Here endeth the lesson learnt - and taught.

[Woollymishka]

As in other posts - we talked with many people - looked at boats - could we visit regularly (we live in the south and did not want a journey of 5 - 6 hours just to make a relatively quick vist.)

Paid £500 to book a slot - then paid AFTER the work had been done (no advance payments) and paid on a montly or two monthly cycle (depending what had been done)

Could not fault our builder - sound advice, did not do anything without talking to us first.

If you want more info please PM us.

Good luck with it all!

[Athy]

You have not mentioned the name of the builder - from your description of his way of doing business, I'm sure that some members will wish to beat a path to his door.

[system 4-50]

My boat is from Colecraft at Long Itchington.

Delivered on time.

Good looking (just like me).

Exactly what I asked for.

Sensible choices made for me where I indicated that I didn't know what was best.

Made very welcome by all the staft, right down to the tea boy, and free to visit any part of the works before, during, and well after sale and delivery.

Small deposit with balance on completion.

The company appears to have at least 5 boats in production at any time.

They have made over 1000 boats.

They were very reasonable over late requests for change.

As well as making complete boats (and sailaways) they manufacture hulls for other builders.

They are widely respected by boaters and criticism of them is hard to find.

Been in business many years.

Website? Not their strong point.

 

Value for money? I certainly think so.

 

Would I go there again? Certainly. When I tire of narrow (hopefully many years from now) and want to go widebeam then I shall be knocking on their door again. I like the sense of completeness that comes from buying a boat from new.

I'd recommend anyone thinking of buying a new boat to visit them, even if they do not expect to buy from them, just to establish a yardstick for others to measure up to.

 

Usual disclaimers, I have no financial interest in Colecraft's activities.

Edited January 22, 2011 by system 4-50

[Pav]

If your boatbuilder requires stage payments...

 

pay by credit card - that way if they don't deliver, it's the bank that's going after them.

 

You still get your money back if the goods aren't fit for purpose.

 

Here endeth the lesson learnt - and taught.

 

 

Hi,

 

Afraid this isn't always the case...... We paid quite a few thousand pounds of the stage payments for our new build narrowboat on a credit card.

 

When the boat builder went bust early in the build, we put a claim in to our credit card company under Section 75 of the Consumer Credit Act.

 

They disputed our claim because the total cost of the narrowboat, as per the contract, was over the £30,000 maximum covered under section 75.

 

I appealed, stating that as the payments were stage payments,they were only covering actual supplied items/work at the time payment was made.....non of which exceeded the £30,000 maximum limit.

 

My appeal was rejected so I contacted the FSA - (Financial Services Authority).

 

The FSA ombudsman agreed with the credit card company.

I never got a penny back because my 'purchase' did not fall between the £100 to £30,000 that Section 75 covers!

 

I was gutted!

 

Regards,

Pav.

[Doorman]

 

 

My appeal was rejected so I contacted the FSA - (Financial Services Authority).

 

The FSA ombudsman agreed with the credit card company.

I never got a penny back because my 'purchase' did not fall between the £100 to £30,000 that Section 75 covers!

 

I was gutted!

 

Regards,

Pav.

 

I can only sympathise with your situation, but the fact that the credit card company refused to pay-out does not surprise me in the least. They (the banks) are lower than a snakes belly!

 

Mike

[WotEver]

I appealed, stating that as the payments were stage payments,they were only covering actual supplied items/work at the time payment was made.....non of which exceeded the £30,000 maximum limit.

Not that it helps much, but I agree with you. The cash price for the goods and/or services paid for by the card must be below £30k.

 

They were.

 

Is there a higher body you can appeal to? Your local MP? A major newspaper?

 

It sucks hugely that they'd wriggle out of their obligations in this manner.

 

Tony

[Pav]

Not that it helps much, but I agree with you. The cash price for the goods and/or services paid for by the card must be below £30k.

 

They were.

 

Is there a higher body you can appeal to? Your local MP? A major newspaper?

 

It sucks hugely that they'd wriggle out of their obligations in this manner.

 

Tony

 

 

Hi Tony,

 

Apparently once the FSA have ruled on a claim then that, it would appear, is that! I did contact one of the TV consumer programmes but never heard anything back from them. In the end my wife and I were just sick of the whole affair, firstly with the boat builder going bust on us just days after cashing in our cheque for over twenty grand, and then with the credit card company not compensating us under Section 75. Basically we decided, that for the good of our health, we would try to put it all behind us and down to a very bad experience. I have to say it's easier said than done and I still feel very aggrieved. Such is life as they say!

 

Regards,

Pav.

[Ex- Member]

Finding a good boat builder is a nightmare if you don't know what you want or know what you should expect. Like any big purchase, do your homework, find out what good welding and metalwork should look like and what proper prep for welding should look like as well as steel quality. learn what all the short cuts are,(and there are many) then make sure they're not being used on your build or have been used on boats already built. Only take a recommendation from someone you know or trust and only then if that recommendation from someone who actually knows something about boats and welding. Many people are cruising around in shoddy substandard boats in the belief they are cruising in a BMW or Merc quality boat. I certainly don't know it all but was fortunate enough to have a brother who's a highly qualified engeneer who did so I got a lot of knowlegde from him and avoided buying something substandard. Of all the boat builders we have visited prior to purchasing a boat and all the yards we have visited since I would say less than 5 out of 10 were of a good standard or better and less than 3 out of ten recommendable based on good quality and fair price.

 

This is not taking into account some of the exceptional builders out there who are building almost Rolls Royce standard boats, but of course with a Rolls Royce price tag. And good on them I say.

[johnmck]

Finding a good boat builder is a nightmare if you don't know what you want or know what you should expect. Like any big purchase, do your homework, find out what good welding and metalwork should look like and what proper prep for welding should look like as well as steel quality. learn what all the short cuts are,(and there are many) then make sure they're not being used on your build or have been used on boats already built. Only take a recommendation from someone you know or trust and only then if that recommendation from someone who actually knows something about boats and welding. Many people are cruising around in shoddy substandard boats in the belief they are cruising in a BMW or Merc quality boat. I certainly don't know it all but was fortunate enough to have a brother who's a highly qualified engeneer who did so I got a lot of knowlegde from him and avoided buying something substandard. Of all the boat builders we have visited prior to purchasing a boat and all the yards we have visited since I would say less than 5 out of 10 were of a good standard or better and less than 3 out of ten recommendable based on good quality and fair price.

 

This is not taking into account some of the exceptional builders out there who are building almost Rolls Royce standard boats, but of course with a Rolls Royce price tag. And good on them I say.

 

 

Hi

 

We like to think that we did our homework in researching various builders, viewing their work, and speaking to past customers. In view of this, we chose Beacon Boats, http://beaconboats.weebly.com/index.html .

The shell is from XR&D. Our boat is now nearing completion. The process has been painless. It says an awful lot when past customers pop in for a cuppa and keep in contact.

 

John Mck.

http://nb-triskaideka.blogspot.com/

[Ex- Member]

Hi

 

We like to think that we did our homework in researching various builders, viewing their work, and speaking to past customers. In view of this, we chose Beacon Boats, http://beaconboats.weebly.com/index.html .

The shell is from XR&D. Our boat is now nearing completion. The process has been painless. It says an awful lot when past customers pop in for a cuppa and keep in contact.

 

John Mck.

http://nb-triskaideka.blogspot.com/

 

Coincidently our 60x10.6 shell was built by the original R&D fabrications in 2004 the particular builder was Abdul Polar who no longer works there I believe. It's good to here though that XR&D are carrying on the good work, and if they keep to the quality of Ray and Shelia's boats then you're guranteed a good solid craft, who knows they may have even improved. What I liked about R&D was each individual builder had their own littly quirky touches, and you could liaise with the builder and try new things and tweak things, just brilliant, our best idea was diesel bow tanks which feed the bubble stove and give a nice neat finish to the cratch sides and seat lockers.

[Doorman]

Finding a good boat builder is a nightmare if you don't know what you want or know what you should expect.

 

Great post!

 

There are many boaters that we have met, who would have done well to have taken your advice prior to investing in their new boat.

 

Our only regret, is that we didn't research beyond the popular avenues such as Crick Boat Show, as we've since discovered many excellent boat builders who are not widely advertised.

 

Word of mouth appears to be their advertising medium.

 

Mike

Edited May 28, 2011 by Doorman

[Bobbybass]

How about...Ben Harp ????

 

Click here :

 

http://www.narrowboat-waiouru.co.uk/2011/07/despicable-ben-harp-narrowboat-builders.html

Edited July 28, 2011 by Bobbybass

[boatbuyer]

Hi

 

Has anyone had a boat built by Narrowcraft of late? I would be interested to learn more about them and any recent experiences.

 

Thank you.

[W-G Crew]

Well this what we did!

 

My wife and I considered buying a boat for 10 years or so, hiring many and visiting boatyards and shows. Four years ago we made the decision and put a deposit on a boat in January 2009. Our visits to look at boats (an excellent pastime for myself) eventually solidified into three frontrunners :-

 

Braidibar,

Graham Edgson of Norton Canes

Jim Sparkes of Alexander Boats with a Kingsground fit out.

 

On the way we had looked at Barnowl, Stoke Boats, Wharfhouse Narrowboats, RLL, Barry Hawkins, Liverpool Boats and a few others.

 

We believed that the essence of a good boat is the shell for without a good shell even the best fit-out will leave you with a poor boat.

 

Our needs are like most couples and fitted nicely into a standard 60 foot boat, we did want quality and reliability. We don't need our builder to fit an Aga or some other fashionable unique selling point which we could discuss with other boaters at length. We wanted a fully equipped well founded boat. We have noted to our despair that many of the best in show boats do have fixtures that stand out but not necessarily useful.

 

To begin with we looked at shells by many of the builders, examined the build quality, welding, symmetry and ripples in the sides as well as the experience, care and most of all pride in the workmanship. I can weld but not to any professional standard however it does not take too much skill to spot a good weld. The best advice is to view shells alongside each other from different builders. Not an easy task most experienced boaters would suggest. Over time however we saw an Alexander shell alongside an RLL, a Reeves, a Lambon a Bluewater and a nondescript Polish boat. Without a shadow of doubt anyone looking at the boats in this way would choose the Alexander every time.

 

Whilst we also looked at other shells including the very good Tim Tyler and excellent Norton Canes we decided upon an Alexander Shell and at the time Jim was working alongside Kingsground so we decided that as the KG fit out was excellent we would go for them. The only downside was the cost, most folks we spoke to said KG made good boats but expensive. We didn't want a boatman's cabin or a Gardner engine or a fancy pot bellied stove and the layout was fairly traditional so we didn't give KG so many problems and as such we think we paid a fair price. Sandhills and Fernwood are good boat fitters and Jim provides shells for both. The set up at KG did however persuade us although Fernwood probably (and I really mean probably) have the slight edge to KG in the fitted furniture and fixings but lift the covers and the engineering is not as well organised.

 

It was really difficult to separate the last three on the shortlist the price was fairly similar. Graham at the time did not have the complete team in place and we thought that it might become too complicated. Braidibar are really great boats and they deliver on time (massive plus point which nearly made them our choice) but they use Tim Tyler shells and we had set our heart on an Alexander, They are even two hours closer to us than KG in Oxford. They also build in the water.

 

So choice over we set up a payment schedule after which payment the boat at whatever stage is ours (how we would have recovered it is a moot point). Sixteen weeks was the build time from KG but it was more like 30. We stayed in many of the hotels in and around Oxford (cheap rates only) whilst the build was underway. Its crucial to visit regularly to both seek and give advice. A good boat builder will listen and take notice of your thoughts but if you're intent on putting all the heavy items along one side or to the bows or stern they may suggest that you revise your thoughts. it would be a bad owner who didn't think to ask why. So to get the best out of the boat building experience it is up to the prospective owner to research as much as he or she can in order to challenge the builder and keep him or her on their toes. Doing this remotely is not a good idea, neither is living in the workshop. Remember at all times although its a narrowboat most are bespoke so its not off the shelf therefore expect some difficulties. All in all remember to enjoy it, its a tremendous experience.

 

Lessons learned:-

 

We were lucky to complete our build in troubled times even KG felt the pinch

Do your research, then do it again

We missed some good builders notably Colecraft (see point two)

Visit often and make sure they understand what you want draw pictures if necessary

Set up a payment schedule the BMF has one but escrow sounds a good idea

Don't use companies like Ben Harp we did contact them but glad it went no further

 

Malcolm & Anne

nb Wicked-Game

Edited November 25, 2011 by W-G Crew

[Albert Smith]

Time waster no! Just thorough in your investigation of a potential boat builder, nothing wrong with that.

 

Not had dealings with this particular fellow but several months back I found a boat in Liverpool, it was just what I was looking for. Liverpool is a 500 mile round trip from my home so I had to be pretty sure it was worth the trip. I contacted the owner several times and although not particularly keen or helpful, I did extract the information I needed.

 

I sorted out a bank draft (for my offer price) and booked the hotel in Liverpool. In the initial ad he stated "no ex merchant navy or uncle Albert lookalikes", I took this to be light hearted banter and didn't give it another thought. On the evening I was due to leave I contacted the seller by phone to confirm I was leaving, and to confirm the time of meeting etc the next morning. I jokingly mentioned that I was ex-Merchant Navy and did have a beard so I would be easy to spot.

 

The fellow's attitude totally changed, every other word was the 'f' word. The gist of the response was that I was a total time waster and he was fed up with 'my type'. Needless to say I never went to Liverpool and that was £98k he lost (well, actually I was offering £95k). I do not understand sellers that assume every potential buyer is a 'time waster', this seems particularly prevalent amongst British sellers, why? I don't know?

 

Since then I have made various inquiry's to UK sellers both for a newbuild, and a couple of secondhand boats. I've been promised a callback (on a newbuild) which never came, and the private sellers were 'too busy'. Yesterday I contacted a dutch builder, he offered to pay my ferry fare and accomodation for 2 nights for myself and Mrs Smith.

 

Albert.

Edited January 4, 2012 by Albert Smith

[Doorman]

Not had dealings with this particular fellow but several months back I found a boat in Liverpool, it was just what I was looking for. Liverpool is a 500 mile round trip from my home so I had to be pretty sure it was worth the trip. I contacted the owner several times and although not particularly keen or helpful, I did extract the information I needed.

 

I sorted out a bank draft (for my offer price) and booked the hotel in Liverpool. In the initial ad he stated "no ex merchant navy or uncle Albert lookalikes", I took this to be light hearted banter and didn't give it another thought. On the evening I was due to leave I contacted the seller by phone to confirm I was leaving, and to confirm the time of meeting etc the next morning. I jokingly mentioned that I was ex-Merchant Navy and did have a beard so I would be easy to spot.

 

The fellow's attitude totally changed, every other word was the 'f' word. The gist of the response was that I was a total time waster and he was fed up with 'my type'. Needless to say I never went to Liverpool and that was £98k he lost (well, actually I was offering £95k). I do not understand sellers that assume every potential buyer is a 'time waster', this seems particularly prevalent amongst British sellers, why? I don't know?

 

Since then I have made various inquiry's to UK sellers both for a newbuild, and a couple of secondhand boats. I've been promised a callback (on a newbuild) which never came, and the private sellers were 'too busy'. Yesterday I contacted a dutch builder, he offered to pay my ferry fare and accomodation for 2 nights for myself and Mrs Smith.

 

Albert.

 

Hi Albert,

 

I'm at a loss at how to excuse my fellow Liverpudlian for his extremely rude attitude and scornful approach to what was 'a willing buyer' in yourself.

 

I used to have business premises in Garston, a riverside area of Liverpool and quite an education it was in being there too. Although there are well documented accounts of Scousers and their reputation, there are also genuinely good people in Liverpool, but the type of character that you encountered only serve to sully the city and its inhabitants.

 

I am still intrigued by the change in my own attitude to life and people in general, since moving to the countryside and all that it encompasses. I wonder if you ever took two twins, separated them at birth, then brought one up in a bustling city and the other in a small village, how different they would be in comparison?

 

Good luck with your quest to buy a new boat. The Dutch builder deserves your business as he's prepared to go the extra mile (as you and Mrs Smith are too!).

 

Mike

(ex-merchant seaman's son)

Edited January 5, 2012 by Doorman

[loubyscooby]

I probably fall into the category of "not knowing enough" however I did do my research after helping my ex partner re-fit his boat.Having sold my house I wanted to live on a boat as I had fallen in love with the way of life. I looked around and spoke to boat builders and owners and then researched the web. I will admit to not knowing anything about engines/wiring/plumbing but I knew this was what I wanted and luckily I found a builder who helped me understand certain things (others I found didn't take me too seriously) and who can up with solutions to the issues I had. As a result my lovely home will be going into the water on the 27th.

 

I have seen her being built, turned up unannounced, changed my mind on somethings, requested that certain things be fitted so that when I can afford them later they can easily be put in. My builder has happily accomodated my requests plus added things that I thought would be out of my price bracket. I also only put £1000 deposit down and will pay the rest on completion.

 

Never have I felt that any question I asked would be stupid, when I was unsure they gave me alternative solutions. I have found all the staff to be helpful from answering emails really quickly, changing the spec of things (when I changed my mind) and by explaining things when I went to see the build. They were also very helpful with questions I had that had nothing to do with the build ie Marinas/ insurance / satellite tv and mobile communications etc

 

I would recommend Alan and his team from Collingwood Boats who have been a dream to work with and I can't wait till she's in the water

[Doorman]

I would recommend Alan and his team from Collingwood Boats who have been a dream to work with and I can't wait till she's in the water

 

Fair praise indeed.

 

Makes a refreshing change from the many negatives we hear about some boat builders.

 

Mike

[warrior princess]

This thread is for all of you boaters out there who have commissioned a new boat to be built to pass on your advice to those who are considering doing the same.

 

It is not for naming and shaming boat builders any posts of this nature will be edited or removed- if you want to do that, we'd prefer you held the risk and started your own blog or site, which we know some boaters have done and we wish them well.

 

It is more of a general advice thread - what did you do right? What did you do wrong? How can you protect yourself from cowboys.

 

Over to you....

[warrior princess]

Get yourself a good surveyor from the start-Do the research, don't be entrapped by the building of a relationship-this is your money and something you will have to live with! Look at the Bloggs of wounded people by 'Boat Builders from Hell' we so need a programme that thus identify's the Cowboys who take your money and deliver extremely poor workmanship to what are fundamental operational requirements for your boat-i.e engine wiring, confifuration-electrics-shell etc! They dampen your dream knowing full well! Blisworth (Bridge) was definately our demise and certainly we were novice to the culture of poor Boat Builders!

 

Every new boat should have a surveyor- during construction and thereafter, preferably before you pay that last installment!!!

 

There are some really good builders- Roger Fuller, Braidbar,Nantwich, Ferndown etc to name but a few! Fail to prepare and prepare to fail..................The cost of our boat has escalated and we're still putting right poor workmanship!

 

Don't be afraid to be a nuisance-We so wish we had been.

 

Research many fit-outs and new products- make sure that the warranty for every thing you purchase for your boat is not time expired by delaying tactics! Insist that the commissioning of items is when you're about to take delivery and NOT when the builder has originally purchased it 1-2 years in advance! If you buy a shell remember Annex3B- the shell belongs to you if you pay for it in advance or on delivery you must demand Annex3B and ensure your Boat Builder examines the shell on delivery e.g doors are fit for purpose (no excessive gaps etc) it's the right length-would you know how to measure a boat? I would'nt ! These are just examples of things we should have done and realise everyone else probably falls into the same trap!!!

 

On a positive note:- It's an exciting thing to do and I wish all the best!

[Ally]

I think you may mean an Annexe 111a, not B....just for those new to these things....that is the certificate of conformity for the hull.

[changabang]

Hi i'm new to this forum. Anyone know anything about Stenson Boat Builders Midland Canal Centre (MCC)? They've built over 600 boats yet I see no mention of them or their work.

 

Thanks

Chris

[Paganboat]

This thread is for all of you boaters out there who have commissioned a new boat to be built to pass on your advice to those who are considering doing the same.

 

It is not for naming and shaming boat builders any posts of this nature will be edited or removed- if you want to do that, we'd prefer you held the risk and started your own blog or site, which we know some boaters have done and we wish them well.

 

It is more of a general advice thread - what did you do right? What did you do wrong? How can you protect yourself from cowboys.

 

Over to you....

 

we are looking to buy a new narrowboat, but are worried about giving money to a boat builder with the current climate, if they go bust do we lose everything? how long does it take to build a boat? we may just go for a high spec used one

[Arducius]

Can anyone recommend any boat builders in the South? I am looking to get a shell built and do the fit out myself, but trawling the internet is not proving very fruitful!

 

I am based in Reading so ideally looking for someone local but Oxford, Newbury and surrounding areas are an option (close enough so I can get there easily to visit).

 

I have had some success in my search, but before I go arranging visits and getting carried away, is there anyone I really should try to see?

 

My list of candidates (so far):

• Bossoms (Oxford)
  
• W Howards Traditional Boat builders (Streatly)
  
• Neil Garside (Streatley)
  
• Better Boating (Caversham)
  
• Newbury boat Co. (Newbury)
  
• Wootens (Cookham Deane)
  

 

I haven't contacted any of these yet so some may well have ceased trading!

 

I have also spoken to Will Trickett Boats (nr. Devizes) but feel I should talk to more than one builder before handing over my hard-earned. Any suggestions/advice greatefully received.

 

(apologies if this should have gone into another thread, new to the forum.)

Edited May 9, 2012 by Arducius