New marinas

[Steve Waterman]

Theres quite a lot on this thread to read, but I'm really glad its here, all good stuff.

I've not read all of it yet, but seeing its relevant for research and to whats going on with the plas kynaston canal project I thought I'd better go through it

 

Thread link;

plas kynaston canal restoration project

 

Thanks to everybody who has posted so far

I'm off for a good read of all the posts submitted!!

[WotEver]

... our "keep the batteries sort of charged" trip is a Sunday afternoon to Kingswood and back.

Identical to ours - Atherstone locks and back - around three and a half hours, lock-free.

 

Tony

[msgreen44]

Audlem marina Official Opening on the 24th July, 2 pm - Unfortunately I'm unable to attend.

 

http://www.overwatermarina.co.uk/

 

 

MartG.

[sunshine sport]

I was recently on the Shropie and called in at Tattenhall Marina for some diesel and did not realise it was their open day. The views were absolutely outstanding. While I was there I also visited the Ice Cream Farm which is next t to the marina and they have over 150 different flavours of Ice Cream. I could have spent the whole day in there. I also visited a number of the other marinas in the area that were also very nice. I think that marinas are very useful for boaters because most of them have washing/drying facilities etc that you would not normally find on the cut. I normally spend a day at a marina to restock on food and get any washing done, boat repairs. I Must admit I am not that enthusiastic on the washing bit.

 

Here is a link for Tattenhall Marina worth a visit if you are passing.

 

Tattenhall Marina

[Gibbo]

Moorings in the UK are expensive. They always will be.

 

Build loads more marinas, the price can only fall so far. It isn't just a simple case of supply and demand. That argument only works in certain circumstances. There is a limit below which moorings become economically unviable. I think they are already close to this limit.

 

The problem is too many people on too small a land mass, therefore land is too expensive (supply and demand). Nothing is going to change this. Apart from releasing more land for development (against the "protect the countryside" people) or throw the immigrants out (against normal human feelings). It therefore cannot change unless attitudes change. Simples.

[carlt]

Apart from releasing more land for development (against the "protect the countryside" people) or throw the immigrants out (against normal human feelings). It therefore cannot change unless attitudes change. Simples.

Why stop there?

 

We can sterilise the poor, before they get a chance to breed, euthanise anyone who reaches retirement age, concrete over the canals (against the "save our waterways" people) and import all the food, so we can build on the food factories, as well as the countryside.

Edited July 16, 2010 by carlt

[Gibbo]

Why stop there?

 

We can sterilise the poor, before they get a chance to breed, euthanise anyone who reaches retirement age, concrete over the canals (against the "save our waterways" people) and import all the food, so we can build on the food factories, as well as the countryside.

 

What about all those bloody animals?

Edited July 16, 2010 by Gibbo

[Doorman]

This topic comes up quite regurarly but for the life of me I cannot understand why any boaters are opposed to the creation of new marinas, more mooring places will inevitably mean lower costs, it is a simple supply and demand issue..Mooring costs are greater in the south of the country, not because they are plentifull but because they are scarce, marina prices have been forced up over the years because the owners find that they can always fill empty berths and there is even some competition for them, therefore the prices go up..

 

It will always be in the interests of boaters that there should be a surplus of moorings with owners attempting to fill spare places rather than the other way round, and don't think the existance of on line moorings changes the basic facts, market forces are market forces.

 

 

Spot on, the 'moor' the merrier. If applications for new marinas in the south were acceptable, then inevitably demand would level out and prices would fall.

But then again, maybe not, as people in the south seem quite happy to pay well above average house prices for very average houses

[Josher]

North Shropshire marina plan turned down

 

Wednesday 28th July 2010, 2:09PM BST. Star

 

North Shropshire marina plan turned down

 

Controversial plans for a multi-million pound marina on the canal in north Shropshire have been turned down by council chiefs following a petition from more than 200 objectors.

 

Proposals put forward by Moore Marine Ltd to build the marina for 200 canal boats on the Shropshire Union Canal at Park Heath Farm, Soudley, near Market Drayton, caused concerns over the impact on neighbouring properties and wildlife.

 

The scheme was also met with nearly 100 letters of objections from residents and parish councilors.

 

Concerns were raised over its location, the lack of facilities nearby, visual impact and insufficient road network to cope with the extra traffic.

 

Members of Shropshire Council’s north planning committee yesterday unanimously turned down outline plans for the scheme which were recommended for refusal by planning officers.

[Dalesman]

I was recently on the Shropie and called in at Tattenhall Marina for some diesel and did not realise it was their open day. The views were absolutely outstanding. While I was there I also visited the Ice Cream Farm which is next t to the marina and they have over 150 different flavours of Ice Cream. I could have spent the whole day in there. I also visited a number of the other marinas in the area that were also very nice. I think that marinas are very useful for boaters because most of them have washing/drying facilities etc that you would not normally find on the cut. I normally spend a day at a marina to restock on food and get any washing done, boat repairs. I Must admit I am not that enthusiastic on the washing bit.

 

Here is a link for Tattenhall Marina worth a visit if you are passing.

 

Tattenhall Marina

Looking at their web cam there looks to be plenty of empty moorings at the moment at this marina.

[MrCJ]

Looking at their web cam there looks to be plenty of empty moorings at the moment at this marina.

 

i was thinking this so plenty of room for some new boats

[matty40s]

Looking at their web cam there looks to be plenty of empty moorings at the moment at this marina.

 

 

Well, if the peak season, first full week of the school holidays and the fairly good weather doesn't get more than a handful of boats out of a marina then you are probably looking at a brokerage.....

[Doorman]

I was recently on the Shropie and called in at Tattenhall Marina for some diesel and did not realise it was their open day. The views were absolutely outstanding. While I was there I also visited the Ice Cream Farm which is next t to the marina and they have over 150 different flavours of Ice Cream. I could have spent the whole day in there. I also visited a number of the other marinas in the area that were also very nice. I think that marinas are very useful for boaters because most of them have washing/drying facilities etc that you would not normally find on the cut. I normally spend a day at a marina to restock on food and get any washing done, boat repairs. I Must admit I am not that enthusiastic on the washing bit.

 

Here is a link for Tattenhall Marina worth a visit if you are passing.

 

Tattenhall Marina

 

 

Great pictures. We aim to visit there in the next few weeks, does anyone know what their price is for a 60' narrow boat?

[Water Woman]

There was talk of a Marina at Billinge near Northwich. Does anyone know if this is going ahead? I know it was turned down once a few years ago.

[Josher]

A couple of interesting paragraphs (near the end) about demand:

 

New marina opens in Cheshire NWDA

 

A new marina with moorings for over 200 boats has opened in rural Cheshire with £400,000 from the Rural Development Programme for England (RDPE) funded by Defra and the E.U.

 

Overwater Marina, near Audlem on the Shropshire Union Canal, opened on Saturday, July 24th providing 206 long term and 21 visitor moorings for narrow boats.

 

In January 2009 Janet and Angus Maugham were granted planning permission to build the marina and facilities on Coole Lane including a boat workshop, tea room and a small shop. The couple wanted to diversify from their dairy farm business and approached the NWDA, which manages part of the Northwest RDPE, for support to create an inland marina.

 

Janet said: “The marina needed a serious financial and personal investment from my family over the last few years but it has been a labour of love. There is a significant shortfall in the number of marina moorings available on the canal network compared to the demand and Overwater will help to meet this need.

We are already getting lots of bookings from boaters and we are thrilled that the marina is finally open. I would like to thank the NWDA for helping us achieve our ambition.”

 

David Hunter, Head of Rural Development at the NWDA, said:

“The RDPE seeks to create a strong sustainable rural economy and farm diversification is a key part of achieving this. The Overwater Marina is an excellent example of a rural business coming up with an innovative scheme which will contribute to the economic sustainability of Audlem and will provide new rural jobs.”

 

It is anticipated the £2.7million development will encourage canal tourism within Cheshire and the region as a whole. There are now a record 32,000 boats on British canals and rivers. Demand for boating has increased by an average of 2.6% every year over the last 15 years and is expected to continue to grow over the next 10 years.

 

Many inland marinas in the UK have a waiting list and new boat owners often have no alternative other than to take moorings on the banks of the waterways themselves. To ensure the local waterways remain open, off line marinas such as Overwater Marina, are being encouraged by British Waterways.

 

Throughout the planning and pre-construction process the family has sourced materials, goods and services locally wherever possible. This includes advertising signage for the marina, the website www.overwatermarina.co.uk which was developed by a web design company from Audlem and the initial site investigation works which were undertaken by a local excavation business.

 

Ends

[dor]

Cheshire Marina occupancy: Figures derived from comments from boaters so not to be taken too seriously, but...

 

Tattenhall: 300 berths, between 70 & 100 occupied

Swanley Fairly full but with vacancies

Church Minshull 147 berths. Full with 20+ on waiting list.

Audlem 200+ berths. Around 100 taken up so far.

BW on-line moorings Several vacancies with auctioned sited not taken up or only one bid at reserve.

Looks as though there is already more than enough moorings in the area.

[Mikeonb4c]

Cheshire Marina occupancy: Figures derived from comments from boaters so not to be taken too seriously, but...

 

Tattenhall: 300 berths, between 70 & 100 occupied

Swanley Fairly full but with vacancies

Church Minshull 147 berths. Full with 20+ on waiting list.

Audlem 200+ berths. Around 100 taken up so far.

BW on-line moorings Several vacancies with auctioned sited not taken up or only one bid at reserve.

Looks as though there is already more than enough moorings in the area.

 

As I research and try and understand living aboard, and the various cost options, I'm trying to get my head around marinas. If you have a 'residential mooring' does this mean that (1) you can stay there 12 months and (2) it has electric and water hookup, and what about sewage pump out and (3) that you have to pay council tax on top of the residential mooring fee? On the other hand, if you want to keep costs down, can you go for a non-residential mooring and live aboard for however long that mooring is open, opting to cruise on the cut through the period it is closed, thus avoiding council tax, although I guess you have to run your engine to recharge batteries, plus find a way of taking on water and having sewage pumped out?

 

Must get searching on here for definitive answers, but if anyone wants to answer them in one go on this thread, I won't stop them ha ha!

[dor]

Most marinas don't have any residential moorings. This is a planning permission issue - they are not allowed. However some marinas have boaters who spend a lot of time on their boats. It usually means you can't have mail addressed to you at the marina, but does mean you don't pay council tax. Some may have a specified number of nights per month or year that you are allowed to stay on the boat, others just say no residential moorings without any specified conditions.

 

Be warned that councils know about this, and may take steps to stop turning a blind eye.

 

Services such as water, electric hookup and pumpout/elsan facilities will depend on the marina.

[Mikeonb4c]

Most marinas don't have any residential moorings. This is a planning permission issue - they are not allowed. However some marinas have boaters who spend a lot of time on their boats. It usually means you can't have mail addressed to you at the marina, but does mean you don't pay council tax. Some may have a specified number of nights per month or year that you are allowed to stay on the boat, others just say no residential moorings without any specified conditions.

 

Be warned that councils know about this, and may take steps to stop turning a blind eye.

 

Services such as water, electric hookup and pumpout/elsan facilities will depend on the marina.

 

Very helpful (and quick!) answer and thanks+++. Hmmm interesting - so it goes on then.

 

A friend at work (whose sister is doing this) said that if you live in a static caravan park that is only open 10 months a year, you don't pay council tax. You then of course have to find somewhere to doss for the other two months. It makes me think that 10 months on a mooring and two months cruising might provide an idyllic solution.

 

You are right about Big Brother though. As they become more desperate for funds, they will hunt any revenue source ever harder. Its important to have no illusions about that I think (depressingly, but best not live in denial!)

Edited August 2, 2010 by Mikeonb4c

[sueb]

Very helpful (and quick!) answer and thanks+++. Hmmm interesting - so it goes on then.

 

A friend at work (whose sister is doing this) said that if you live in a static caravan park that is only open 10 months a year, you don't pay council tax. You then of course have to find somewhere to doss for the other two months. It makes me think that 10 months on a mooring and two months cruising might provide an idyllic solution.

 

You are right about Big Brother though. As they become more desperate for funds, they will hunt any revenue source ever harder. Its important to have no illusions about that I think (depressingly, but best not live in denial!)

Living on a boat can't be compared with a static caravan. You have NO rights living on a boat and it can go pear shaped at any moment. The rules are completely different and the 10month rule for caravans doesn't apply. Each Marina has it's own rules depending on their planning permission. Many turn off the water in the winter!

Sue

[mayalld]

As I research and try and understand living aboard, and the various cost options, I'm trying to get my head around marinas. If you have a 'residential mooring' does this mean that (1) you can stay there 12 months and (2) it has electric and water hookup, and what about sewage pump out and (3) that you have to pay council tax on top of the residential mooring fee? On the other hand, if you want to keep costs down, can you go for a non-residential mooring and live aboard for however long that mooring is open, opting to cruise on the cut through the period it is closed, thus avoiding council tax, although I guess you have to run your engine to recharge batteries, plus find a way of taking on water and having sewage pumped out?

 

You seem to be trying to plant the static caravan site model onto marinas.

 

Basically, it doesn't work like that.

 

Whilst there are certainly static caravan sites that you can stay at for 10 months of the year, then bugger off to Majorca for a couple of months, with marinas, it tends to be that if you spend more than about a fortnight on board, it is regarded as residential use.

[Doorman]

A couple of interesting paragraphs (near the end) about demand:

 

New marina opens in Cheshire NWDA

 

A new marina with moorings for over 200 boats has opened in rural Cheshire with £400,000 from the Rural Development Programme for England (RDPE) funded by Defra and the E.U.

 

Overwater Marina, near Audlem on the Shropshire Union Canal, opened on Saturday, July 24th providing 206 long term and 21 visitor moorings for narrow boats.

 

In January 2009 Janet and Angus Maugham were granted planning permission to build the marina and facilities on Coole Lane including a boat workshop, tea room and a small shop. The couple wanted to diversify from their dairy farm business and approached the NWDA, which manages part of the Northwest RDPE, for support to create an inland marina.

 

Janet said: “The marina needed a serious financial and personal investment from my family over the last few years but it has been a labour of love. There is a significant shortfall in the number of marina moorings available on the canal network compared to the demand and Overwater will help to meet this need.

We are already getting lots of bookings from boaters and we are thrilled that the marina is finally open. I would like to thank the NWDA for helping us achieve our ambition.”

 

David Hunter, Head of Rural Development at the NWDA, said:

“The RDPE seeks to create a strong sustainable rural economy and farm diversification is a key part of achieving this. The Overwater Marina is an excellent example of a rural business coming up with an innovative scheme which will contribute to the economic sustainability of Audlem and will provide new rural jobs.”

 

It is anticipated the £2.7million development will encourage canal tourism within Cheshire and the region as a whole. There are now a record 32,000 boats on British canals and rivers. Demand for boating has increased by an average of 2.6% every year over the last 15 years and is expected to continue to grow over the next 10 years.

 

Many inland marinas in the UK have a waiting list and new boat owners often have no alternative other than to take moorings on the banks of the waterways themselves. To ensure the local waterways remain open, off line marinas such as Overwater Marina, are being encouraged by British Waterways.

 

Throughout the planning and pre-construction process the family has sourced materials, goods and services locally wherever possible. This includes advertising signage for the marina, the website www.overwatermarina.co.uk which was developed by a web design company from Audlem and the initial site investigation works which were undertaken by a local excavation business.

 

Ends

 

I believe the statement regarding demand to be quite true. The problem appears that although there is a genuine need for off-line marinas such as Overwater, there is a general reluctance to pay the relative fees.

 

Mike

[Mikeonb4c]

I believe the statement regarding demand to be quite true. The problem appears that although there is a genuine need for off-line marinas such as Overwater, there is a general reluctance to pay the relative fees.

 

Mike

 

 

Are the authorites (BW) getting ready to spring a trap and/or will this all led to the loss of something. For example, once there is a decent supply of marinas, the rules about mooring for nowt on the canal bank may get squeezed? Pay and display anyone?

Edited August 3, 2010 by Mikeonb4c

[Giggetty]

Cheshire Marina occupancy: Figures derived from comments from boaters so not to be taken too seriously, but...

 

Tattenhall: 300 berths, between 70 & 100 occupied

Swanley Fairly full but with vacancies

Church Minshull 147 berths. Full with 20+ on waiting list.

Audlem 200+ berths. Around 100 taken up so far.

BW on-line moorings Several vacancies with auctioned sited not taken up or only one bid at reserve.

Looks as though there is already more than enough moorings in the area.

 

Staff and Worcs-Ashwood Marina: two year waiting list. Planning application for new Swindon Marina rejected (local opposition and 'flooding dangers' http://www.sstaffs.gov.uk/pdf/Swindon%20Ne...rch%202010a.pdf). Not sure of vacancies at Hatherton and Stourport; both seemed pretty full when I passed by last week.

Edited August 3, 2010 by Giggetty

[mayalld]

Cheshire Marina occupancy: Figures derived from comments from boaters so not to be taken too seriously, but...

 

Tattenhall: 300 berths, between 70 & 100 occupied

Swanley Fairly full but with vacancies

Church Minshull 147 berths. Full with 20+ on waiting list.

Audlem 200+ berths. Around 100 taken up so far.

BW on-line moorings Several vacancies with auctioned sited not taken up or only one bid at reserve.

Looks as though there is already more than enough moorings in the area.

 

Yes, there probably are.

 

However, we need to bear in mind that there is huge inertia in the moorings market. People who have a mooring are not in the business of moving every 5 minutes. Additionally, very new marinas tend so look very stark for a couple of years, which discourages uptake

 

An increase in moorings in one area that is not matched by an increase in adjacent areas tends to result in a gradual rebalancing as people who want to moor in that area, but moored elsewhere because that was where they could get a mooring, drift in over a coupel of years.