Highest canal in the UK?

[MartinClark]

The only other locations I can think of where you have a canal drain instead of a feeder are on the GU: Cosgrove to Fenny and the pound through leamington, and some single ended branches that fall from main lines/summits such as the Caldon at Froghall and the Aylesbury Branch, I haven't included ones that have a way out for boats such as the Rufford Branch.

 

Another such example was the western end of the Chesterfield, where the canal drained into the River Rother.

 

The Walsall Canal, when first built (1799), was a "sump", coming down from the Birmingham Level via the Ryder Green Locks and draining into the River Tame. In 1841, the Walsall Junction Canal was built, allowing boats to climb back up at the northern end to join the Wyrley and Essington at Birchills. Then in 1844 the Tame Valley Canal opened, allowing boats to leave the sump level and drop downhill further by way of Perry Barr Locks to the Birmingham and Fazeley. However, I reckon that still makes the Walsall Canal a "sump".

Edited September 1, 2008 by MartinClark

[stort_mark]

The same office that came up with, "Putting the can back in canals"......

 

Could have been a lot worse....

 

"Putting the anal back in canals"

[twocvbloke]

Here is a closer view of one of the ladders!

 

 

I feel faint just looking at the photo of it...

[moggyjo]

I feel faint just looking at the photo of it...

 

No way would I even attempt to do that lock on my own, I wouldn't even want to walk anywhere near the edge of it. by the way, is it manned?

 

Back on topic how high is the Monmouth and Brecon canal?

Edited September 3, 2008 by moggyjo

[magpie patrick]

No way would I even attempt to do that lock on my own, I wouldn't even want to walk anywhere near the edge of it. by the way, is it manned?

 

Back on topic how high is the Monmouth and Brecon canal?

 

The summit is 425 feet above sea level, and the long pound approx 60 feet lower.

 

Someone else raised long pounds: the Mon and Brec long pound is 25 miles long, the Bridgwater/L and L is I think nearly fifty miles if you add the length to Runcorn, the main line into manchester, the leigh branch of both canals as far as Poolstock Locks, and Preston Brook Tunnel.

[fender]

The highest in the UK was undoubtedly the Nent Force Level's canal between Alston and Nenthead, at an altitude of 860 feet above sea level.

 

This stupendous underground waterway took 34 years to build and was Alston's main tourist attraction. Until the late 19th century, regular boat trips travelled two and a half miles to the Lovelady Shield shaft, where tourists could see dancing and entertainment on a large platform.

Edited September 3, 2008 by fender

[magpie patrick]

The highest in the UK was undoubtedly the Nent Force Level's canal between Alston and Nenthead, at an altitude of 860 feet above sea level.

 

This stupendous underground waterway took 34 years to build and was Alston's main tourist attraction. Until the late 19th century, regular boat trips travelled two and a half miles to the Lovelady Shield shaft, where tourists could see dancing and entertainment on a large platform.

 

WOW Not often I learn something totally new! Tell me more...

 

The only comment I would add though is I think there was an unspoken qualification in the original question, along the lines of "connected to the canal system" or similar, meaning it had to climb that high rather than just be that high. Still impressive though, was it originally built for tourists or as part of mining operations

[fender]

WOW Not often I learn something totally new! Tell me more...

 

The only comment I would add though is I think there was an unspoken qualification in the original question, along the lines of "connected to the canal system" or similar, meaning it had to climb that high rather than just be that high. Still impressive though, was it originally built for tourists or as part of mining operations

 

I had thought about that being 'connected to the canal system' - but the many canals of South Wales dont meet that stipulation. They were not even connected to each other.

 

Very few pictures of the Nent Force Level exist. If you've been in the Speedwell Cavern (a very popular underground mining canal thats open every day of the year) you'll have some idea of the Nent Force Level. The underground canal at Speedwell is only about 230 yards in length, with one passing place. Both were built for mining operations but ended up as tourist attractions.

[magpie patrick]

I had thought about that being 'connected to the canal system' - but the many canals of South Wales dont meet that stipulation. They were not even connected to each other.

 

I'd agree although the only reference to the south wales canals was moggyjo and then my answer: all the others mentioned here are connected. And the South Wales ones did climb from sea level to their dizzying termini.

 

Very few pictures of the Nent Force Level exist. If you've been in the Speedwell Cavern (a very popular underground mining canal thats open every day of the year) you'll have some idea of the Nent Force Level. The underground canal at Speedwell is only about 230 yards in length, with one passing place. Both were built for mining operations but ended up as tourist attractions.

 

Not withstanding above response, you've unearthed a real gem for me and a canal I had quite literally never heard of, which is (where is the blowing your own trumpet smiley) rare indeed, especially in the UK. A new topic to be researched. Please accept my normal payment for anyone who passes these gems onto me... and a real one will await if we ever find ourselves in the same pub. Sorry, you can't have a second for Speedwell as I've been on that one! Don't know how high it is though..

[norm 'n' Q]

Nent force

"During the area's peak of prosperity in 1776 John Smeaton began construction of an underground drain to assist with the transport of extracted materials as well as locate new mineral seams. The canal took 66 years to construct at a cost of £80,000, and became known as "Smeaton's Folly". In the 1830s mine manager and engineer said that it could be visited "in boats 30 feet in length, which are propelled in four feet of water by means of sticks projecting from the sides of the level; and thus may be enjoyed the singular novelty of sailing a few miles underground". It was intended to be 9 feet square but in the softer terrain was extended to 9'x16', dead level for 3.75 miles (6 km) to allow boat use, with a rise of 35 fathoms (64 m) at Lovelady Shield and then driven into the Nenthead ground. The amount of ore found was disappointing, though not insignificant.

 

Access to the Nent force level is currently extremely difficult although efforts have been made to develop a heritage centre to make this extraordinary piece of engineering accessible to the public"

 

 

Found this and thought it might be interesting to some.

 

Some pics here.

http://www.mineexplorer.org.uk/breweryshaf...5.htm#position3

Edited September 3, 2008 by norm 'n' Q

[carlt]

Some pics here.

http://www.mineexplorer.org.uk/breweryshaf...5.htm#position3

As a former cave diver, I am qualified to say that these people are totally barmy!

[MartinClark]

The highest in the UK was undoubtedly the Nent Force Level's canal between Alston and Nenthead, at an altitude of 860 feet above sea level.

 

Undoubtedly? Are you sure?

 

Oh, well. If we're going to include canals that were integral with mines, then I can tell you that Nent Force Level was not the highest!

 

The so-called "Dukes Level" was a canal that ran underground into the Buckett Engine Pit at an elevation of 1170 feet above sea level. It was 2.5 miles south-west of Buxton, a few yards from the present A54 road on the northern slope of Axe Edge Moor (SK 028 713).

 

The underground canal was constructed around 1770 and records show that it was in use transporting coal to the surface in 1790. There are 5 pages about it in the book "The Coal Mines of Buxton" by A F Roberts and J R Leach.

[MartinClark]

(About Ardnacrusha Lock...)

No way would I even attempt to do that lock on my own, I wouldn't even want to walk anywhere near the edge of it. by the way, is it manned?

I answered that in post #9 above:

"The lock is operated for you by an employee of the hydro-electric power station."

 

You need to phone up to arrange passage and someone will be there to operate it. You don't need to set foot off your boat, although I was allowed to get off and take photos!

 

You can read about our downhill passage here and our return passage here.

[stewey]

As a former cave diver, I am qualified to say that these people are totally barmy!

No offence, Carl but I think all cave divers are barmy!!

 

Stewey

[fender]

Undoubtedly? Are you sure?

 

Oh, well. If we're going to include canals that were integral with mines, then I can tell you that Nent Force Level was not the highest!

 

The so-called "Dukes Level" was a canal that ran underground into the Buckett Engine Pit at an elevation of 1170 feet above sea level. It was 2.5 miles south-west of Buxton, a few yards from the present A54 road on the northern slope of Axe Edge Moor (SK 028 713).

 

The underground canal was constructed around 1770 and records show that it was in use transporting coal to the surface in 1790. There are 5 pages about it in the book "The Coal Mines of Buxton" by A F Roberts and J R Leach.

 

The Dukes Level was reputed to have flooded and then it was simply used by boats to transport ore out. There is some doubt as to its validity as a true boat level/underground canal. There was another Dukes Level near Grassington and that was also claimed to have a boat level too.

 

The highest supposed underground canal was at 1300ft, located near Flash (the highest village in the country.) John Farey wrote in his 1817 on mining in the area that the Black Clough Colliery, located about half a mile north west of Flash, had "a tunnel for boats..." but apart from that, there hasnt been any proof of Farey's assertation.

 

I thought it was interesting to include the Nent Force level on account of its lengthy underground canal, thats all there was to it.

 

Of course the highest of all on the canal system is Standedge at 644 ft above sea level (well thats according to Tom Rolt! I see its 645ft according to Martin Clark. Well, who cares about a foot's difference?) However, that wasnt the highest planned. The Leominster's canal westernmost summit level (there were three of them) would have reached somewhere around 750ft above sea level in order to reach its proposed terminus at Kington. Now that would have been the highest on the connected waterways system if the Kington, Leominster and Stourport Canal Company had fully realised its ambitions.

 

PS I see people have been discussing Ardnacrusha Lock which is in Ireland! Why should I get the flak?

Edited September 3, 2008 by fender

[fender]

How about this? Just had a look around the internet for higher canals, I never knew this but the Morris Canal in the USA is billed as "New Jersey's Mountain-Climbing Waterway," with an elevation change in total of 1,674 feet! Blimey!

 

On the east side of its summit it has a climb of 914 feet!

 

http://www.canalday.org/history.html

 

(will there be anymore flak coming my way???)

[MartinClark]

(will there be anymore flak coming my way???)

 

When did you get flak?

[fender]

When did you get flak?

 

read the posts!

 

PS Its more like 705 ft at Kington having examined some OS road maps. I need to find my large map of the canal and the transanctions of the Woolsthorpe Club which did substantial research on the canal to throw light on the exact elevations of the canal.

[MartinClark]

When did you get flak?

read the posts!

 

I have just read them all again and still can't see where you have received any flak.

 

If you think I was giving you flak for arguing about Nent Force Level, then I apologise, for it was not my intention to attempt to shoot you down. I was just arguing for the sake of a bit of banter on an interesting topic!

 

As for Ardnacrusha, I gave a link to my list of Highest Summits and someone followed a link from there to my list of Deepest Locks. Although the page list deepest locks in England, it mentions as a sort of footnote deep locks in other countries, including Ardnacrusha. I think that is a phenomenon known as Thread Drift!

[magpie patrick]

How about this? Just had a look around the internet for higher canals, I never knew this but the Morris Canal in the USA is billed as "New Jersey's Mountain-Climbing Waterway," with an elevation change in total of 1,674 feet! Blimey!

 

On the east side of its summit it has a climb of 914 feet!

 

http://www.canalday.org/history.html

 

(will there be anymore flak coming my way???)

 

no Flak to Fender, he was merely being precise

 

however we said UK, which at one time (now I'll get flak) incuded eire, although not when Ardnacrusha was built. USA never in it though.

 

If you want to play that sort of game, the Puno Canal, linking lake titicaca to puno, takes the world crown, at 4000 metres, yes metres, not feet.

 

Unless of course. someone knows better?

[Hairy-Neil]

PS Its more like 705 ft at Kington having examined some OS road maps.

 

I've read the sumit level at Kington was 448 feet above the Severn at Stourport, whatever that is...

 

 

And from what I can make out on Streetmap.co.uk the river at Stourport is aproximately on the 50 metre contour, so something doesn't add up....

[fender]

Poor me I had to drag out all my boxes at this time of night, having just got home and read the forum stuff.

 

I was wrong with the height at Kington I looked at a road map and the contours were difficult to read. So the Leominster isnt higher than the Huddersfield. I always thought the Leominster had a lofty summit level. Actually the summit at Kington is 505 feet above sea level.

 

In another way, the Leominster as a single canal clearly would have beaten the Huddersfield (436ft) Leeds and Liverpool (487ft) and all the other UK canals in terms of the climb from its lowest datum point at Areley Kings to summit level Kington, at 496 feet.

 

I should think the Puno canal is a winner! Well done Magpie!

[Hairy-Neil]

Actually the summit at Kington is 505 feet above sea level.

 

In another way, the Leominster ....... in terms of the climb from its lowest datum point at Areley Kings to summit level Kington, at 496 feet.

 

If your figures are correct, surely it would put Stourport at only 9 feet above sea level.

[fender]

If your figures are correct, surely it would put Stourport at only 9 feet above sea level.

 

Not me, these are the official stats for that canal.

 

Its here and in several other places on the internet:

 

http://www.jim-shead.com/waterways/PNRC0421.htm#402

 

So here goes some more research - Running through the Woolthorpe Naturalist Field Club's Transanctions (1958) estimates of rises and falls, the total fall from Kington to Stourport is sligtly less, just 5ft actually, so that make it 491 ft, and Stourport at 14ft above sea level. Still not quite right but better.

[magpie patrick]

Fender, if I had the time I would join you in a project to produce a map of waterways with altitude either marked or colour coded. Like William Smith (the man who drew the first geological map) it would probably ruin me and leave me pennyless, jobless, homeless and perhaps Magpie Val-less but it would be fascinating