experiences with a Heritage range cooker on a nb?

[Mike George]

We're looking at the oil-fired Heritage Uno for a new sailaway narrowboat, and I wondered whether anybody can give any info based on your experience with it? The Vintage 500 is another possibility, but we think the Heritage looks better.

 

We would probably go for the lower power model and run a couple of small radiators plus a towel rail, and supplement the calorifier.

 

This is on a permanent liveaboard with no shoreline, Beta 43 with standard alternators, plus currently unspecified inverter and domestic batteries.

 

I'm particularly interested in:

1. is excess heat a problem when cooking in summer?

2. what's the fuel consumption?

3. what's the power consumption?

 

The warmup time and lack of grilling facility aren't a problem, but we wouldn't want to have to use a microwave as well.

 

TIA

[onthecut]

Nice looking piece of kit. We chose diesel for cooking, although with a Dickinson stove, which is generally a smaller and lot lighter unit than the Heritage -- and a lot less sophisticated, looking at the Heritage blurb.

 

Single main issue we find is indeed the excess heat and in the summer we use an electric hob and microwave, mostly. If at all possible, I'd try and find someone who has the installation you envisage and see if you can observe it first hand. If you can't, I would certainly go and see one working in a showroom environment and ask to have it put in tickover mode and then have a good feel around it for how much heat it does put out.

Second issue (with the Dickinson) is that it runs in pretty sooty mode if set very low and cleaning it is a dirty hands job. On the plus side, it is however a very simple device. Make sure you check with the one you envisage buying that all the fuel connections and parts for which access is required will be suitably placed when on board and will meet the test requirements. Don't forget you also need to work out how you will secure it ---- it's a big, heavy lump !

I would be tempted to suggest you expand your research to include stoves that require no electrical power. It's always an issue on the boats and one of the pluses that we saw in our stove was the fact it is just a simple gravity feed.

Another point I suggest you consider before you buy are the installation instructions --- particularly with regard to the flue requirements. Seemingly a number of these devices specify a flue length you are just not going to achieve on a narrowboat. While the stove will no doubt work, to a greater or lesser extent, with whatever flue you can manage, it might become an issue if any warranty work is required and the engineer can turn around and say 'incorrectly installed'.

The manufacturers should be able to tell you exactly what the fuel and power consumption ranges are.

 

 

Mike.

[Mike George]

Thanks for your reply Mike.

 

The salesman tells me the heat insualtion is very good and the summer heat shouldn't be a problem, but he would say that wouldn't he!

 

With regard to the flue length, I haven't checked but I expect they all specify an impractical length, like the solid fuel stove makers do, but Heritage are advertising the Uno as suitable for a narrowboat.

 

I asked about reference installations but they were a bit cagey and said they had narrowboat owners who were willing to show them off, but they kept moving around I think the best thing is to press them on this and see if I can at least get a telephone contact with a satisfied owner. The next best thing will be to visit Heritage, so it looks like a trip to Cornwall is on the cards.

[sueb]

Thanks for your reply Mike.

 

The salesman tells me the heat insualtion is very good and the summer heat shouldn't be a problem, but he would say that wouldn't he!

 

With regard to the flue length, I haven't checked but I expect they all specify an impractical length, like the solid fuel stove makers do, but Heritage are advertising the Uno as suitable for a narrowboat.

 

I asked about reference installations but they were a bit cagey and said they had narrowboat owners who were willing to show them off, but they kept moving around I think the best thing is to press them on this and see if I can at least get a telephone contact with a satisfied owner. The next best thing will be to visit Heritage, so it looks like a trip to Cornwall is on the cards.

 

Excess heat can be a problem on a narrowboat, in summer, without extra inside heating. Think metal box sitting in sun. We have a solid fuel rayburn but use a gas cooker in the summer.

Sue

[Dave S2]

STOP!!!!!!! think long and hard first. I want to explain my issues to you. then I am going to TRY to call their service department to get them to come and fix ours!!!! AGAIN!

[Athy]

Modern range cookers tend to be better insulated than old ones. At least, that is our experience. In our house, we had a 1970s Rayburn Royal which, whenever it was on, be it for water heating or cooking, radiated loads of heat. Now we have a 2011 model which doesn't - not so cosy in the kitchen, but far more efficient and, for n/b use, preferable. Apart from a moderate amount of warmth from the flue chimney, we notice the heat only when the lid is open for hob cooking.

[GSer]

I was looking at getting one of these ranges to put in Apache, I was very keen but in the end i put all the pros on one side (looks, single fuel boat, er??) against the cons on the other(weight, summer heat, single fuel boat, price, rumours about reliability, speed of warming up etc etc) and decided that looks arn't everything for me and went with a good quality household domestic gas cooker and separate cabin heating devices.

 

I visited one boat which had a double range with twin burners fitted, just last summer, it was a very warm boat you might get away with that for a holiday boat but it wasn't for me as a livaboard.

 

Good luck

 

Paul

[Dave S2]

Excess heat can be a problem on a narrowboat, in summer, without extra inside heating. Think metal box sitting in sun. We have a solid fuel rayburn but use a gas cooker in the summer.

Sue

 

 

Yes but it's the winter that I fear - since i have the damn thing in bits again to change the nozzle myself BECAUSE the service dept is in cornwall and now it needs servicing/fixing. No end of hassle. While I am sitting here with no oven and no central heating I think to myself why oh why didn't i get a bigger wood stove with a back boiler plumbed into the radiators. I also wish I had a full size gas cooker with decent oven, also the oven would heat up in a sensible time or when this breaks which it invariably does once a year We wouldn't be sat here like muppets AND also when we can't get 300 litres of diesel to fill up because the fuel barge won't turn up again I wish I had an LPG system because at least I dont have to take the boat to the shop to get a bottle... having a car helps loads too!

 

Don't rely on fuel barges. Fill up full in November, our main mistake was not to get 500 litres in November when it turned cold. it wasn't so bad this year because we had a wood burner installed and a portable gas hob.

 

 

I presume the temperature issue isn't so bad in a narrowboat.

 

Do you find the oven temperature maxes out before you get the boat warm and have to open oven door to let heat escape?

 

OR

 

Do you max out the oven temperature because importantly the hob is useless with the burner off? this happens after being on for a couple of hours.

 

If it would fit at the very least get a heritage Compact. Install the damn thing in the center of the boat too and don't miss out a single part of the electrical or plumbing instructions - the flu can easily be shorter than 4.5 metres our is maybe 1.5 to roof plus a 24" chimney I think.

 

Also make sure it is double skinned or goodbye paint work on roof and wherever that water flows to drain.

 

 

We haven't had a good experience but how ridiculous to not to have a separate oven and heating control which obviously requires a larger unit to fit in 2 burners but at least I wouldn't moan. I think these cost nearly £5000 too.

 

 

Good points - the engineers are very nice... so far met 3 of them. Sterling burners are kind but only deal with trade. I now have a new skill. Finally the hot water is amazing and the oven is alright and the heating works but there is just no heat retention in this boat I think.

 

I will write more when I think of it.

 

Thanks for your reply Mike.

 

The salesman tells me the heat insualtion is very good and the summer heat shouldn't be a problem, but he would say that wouldn't he!

 

With regard to the flue length, I haven't checked but I expect they all specify an impractical length, like the solid fuel stove makers do, but Heritage are advertising the Uno as suitable for a narrowboat.

 

I asked about reference installations but they were a bit cagey and said they had narrowboat owners who were willing to show them off, but they kept moving around I think the best thing is to press them on this and see if I can at least get a telephone contact with a satisfied owner. The next best thing will be to visit Heritage, so it looks like a trip to Cornwall is on the cards.

 

 

Ask them about a boat called Stealth. in a way it's not their fault it was the previous owners who had an obviously small budget but I'm sure they are happy to give us free servicing!

[Dave S2]

Nice looking piece of kit. We chose diesel for cooking, although with a Dickinson stove, which is generally a smaller and lot lighter unit than the Heritage -- and a lot less sophisticated, looking at the Heritage blurb.

 

Single main issue we find is indeed the excess heat and in the summer we use an electric hob and microwave, mostly. If at all possible, I'd try and find someone who has the installation you envisage and see if you can observe it first hand. If you can't, I would certainly go and see one working in a showroom environment and ask to have it put in tickover mode and then have a good feel around it for how much heat it does put out.

Second issue (with the Dickinson) is that it runs in pretty sooty mode if set very low and cleaning it is a dirty hands job. On the plus side, it is however a very simple device. Make sure you check with the one you envisage buying that all the fuel connections and parts for which access is required will be suitably placed when on board and will meet the test requirements. Don't forget you also need to work out how you will secure it ---- it's a big, heavy lump !

I would be tempted to suggest you expand your research to include stoves that require no electrical power. It's always an issue on the boats and one of the pluses that we saw in our stove was the fact it is just a simple gravity feed.

Another point I suggest you consider before you buy are the installation instructions --- particularly with regard to the flue requirements. Seemingly a number of these devices specify a flue length you are just not going to achieve on a narrowboat. While the stove will no doubt work, to a greater or lesser extent, with whatever flue you can manage, it might become an issue if any warranty work is required and the engineer can turn around and say 'incorrectly installed'.

The manufacturers should be able to tell you exactly what the fuel and power consumption ranges are.

 

 

Mike.

 

 

Heritage are happy to work on bad installs. I know. It's something they really should think about before letting people go and do their own install!

 

heritage is simple and cheaper because they couldn't be bothered to write the temperature ranges in an obvious scale on the oven dial

 

100 watts of electrical power for our UNO that's 8 and a bit amp hours at 12VDC. Not great at all for cruising especially including the 230V heating circulation pump at least get a 12VDC circulation pump. The noise is quite loud enough from ours.

 

gravity fed systems i believe need to be level...

 

Since it weighs 250 to 300kgs I can't get rid of it nor can I afford to! It looks very nice though so that's a plus!

[Kristian]

Wrong account

Edited March 7, 2012 by Kristian

[Tiggers]

The Heritage Compacts (double ovens and twin burners) are great. I have fitted them in a couple of boats. The problem with the Uno is because it has only 1 burner, when you are cooking, you have to have your hot water/heating on as well which isnt the case if you have the Compact. Also, the Compact is quite well insulated so when you're cooking on it, the unit doesnt get hot at all on the outside.

 

I think the Uno is little more than a glorified boiler if Im honest, especially with only having one hot plate. I lived on a boat with one for 18months and the lack of cooking space and the heat drove me made. I was getting through around £40 of diesel a week last winter (when it hit -17c) and that was with having it on constantly (at around 25c in the boat!).

 

On the power side, they dont require a huge amount constantly, but you need a fair amount of battery life when it initially kicks in.

 

On the plus side, the guys at Heritage are REALLY nice, and incredibly helpful.

Edited March 7, 2012 by Tiggers

[Rick-n-Jo]

If you are anywhere near Saul Junction (Glos & Sharpness Canal) and would like to see a Heritage Compact (2 hob but single burner version) installed in a nb, let me know.

 

We have very good local service/installation engineer co. here who are happy to work on boats - not all are, but I have learned to change the burner nozzle myself, it's not a particularly difficult job and spares can be had online for less than a tenner. The jet on the lower output burner such as you would fit on a boat is quite tiny, so can get partially blocked or coked up, also easily damaged by mishandling. I would recommend Danfoss nozzle, since fitted has given no further trouble.

 

These cookers really are well insulated, exess heat has never been a problem for us. (We did make sure to have a side hatch next to the cooker in case, but have hardly ever felt the need to have it open) From cold it will boil a kettle in 5-10 mins, oven temp in 20. The single burner is obviously a compromise between cooking and water heating/central heating, compared to the two burner models, but is easy to manage with a simple plumbing system, and is obviously cheaper for buying, servicing and I would guess fuel.

 

We live aboard and keep the boat warm but not roasting hot (put on woolies if its frosty, turn heating off at night) and have found our range to be pretty economical on fuel - and so easy compared to wood/coal/gas

 

You do of course need a 240V supply when its running and I would only consider installing in a boat with a well designed ac system i.e. good inverter and battery spec and adequate charging provision. It uses about 100w when firing but once up to temp only fires fo about 5-10% of time thanks to good insulation.

 

Basically, we likes it

 

Rick

[Strads]

HI, We have installed our own Uno 3 1/2 years ago - in a newish self build, we installed additional fuel tanks @ 100 gallons at the front as the Uno will run on home heating oil AND or red/white diesel or any% blend,,, ours has been fine.

 

I would estimate our average weekly fuel costs at @30.00 certainly not more than 35 when heating and cooking more. Our boat is well insulated and we are live aboards.

We have it on for @ 30 mins just before rise for hot water to shower with and time it to come on for when we arrive home.. gooking from cold is@ 12-15 mins to frying eggs.

 

Servicing is a relative peice of cake - one allen key release the burner unit - you can air/wet bleed easily and check, changing the nozzle is an easy 10 minute job. wiping the magic eye @ 1 minute. Heritage (Sam) reccommend annual servicing possibly more with diesel - ours hasnt needed it - I have looked and checked the above, wiped them clean with a paper towel.

 

We do plan to get an engineer in - any suitable approved oil certified enginer can service - the burners are basically central heating uits with different burner nozzle to accept diesel. so issues on getting engineers is a myth, Getting one to sign of your own installation can be an issue - as they often only want to certify their own work.

I spoke to a couple and found one that "advised" - left me install under his suggestions and those of Heritage (Sam again). Flue length is not that critical ours is on the centre line for weight distribution and a short chimney on the roof to clear GU bridges etc, when installed the burner readout was "excellent", an impressed engineer.total cost 170.00 for 3 visits.

 

Key points are you do need good 230V - we have a victron 3000k/70 invertor and power line when on home mooring. all suitable wired in per instructions - seperate spur / fused, double pole switch, etc. Seperate air feed from side fitting ( took the air tube to chandler for fitting and that to plumber for adaptor all screwed on no issues and cheap.

 

With our fuel tank, that last 7 to 8 months on the above running. if gets cold we just switch on for an extra hour or two, the overall unit get warm, but not hot - kids/and pets can lie against it with no issues. the top will take 3 med sauce pans but we often stick them in the oven as its quicker!.

 

water pump is the bigger power user - and you may find a low volt alternative - if really needed -

 

I linked ours to run 3 heatsink radiators; shower room. 2nd loo (composting type that like a little warmth) and engine room and we have 2 switchable radiators (bedroom and saloon).

 

Would I reccommend - absolutely - is it perfect no, but its better than all other options we looked at...

We wanted a gas free boat - cant be arsed with lugging gas bottle etc.

 

we built in the fuel tanks and a new water tank (as it now sits on tope of the oil tanks) so i figure on a total cost of @7K stove, installation & tanks..

[Dominic M]

I have a Sandyford on our boat. An Aga type domestic range converted to run off red diesel.

 

It is fantastic, and I have owned 7 boats in 30 years so I have a comparison. It needs no heat sync radiator for one. It has twin burners: one for cooking, one for heating and hot water. Both are separately operated; entirely independently of each other. It is not hot in summer. It boils a kettle in minutes. OK, if you want a roast sheep for lunch in a heatwave, you want side hatches open, but that is true with a gas oven too.

 

In the freezing winter before last, when I lived aboard, it cost about £28 per week @ 78p litre for all cooking, heating and hot water. I think that is a bargain for real comfort.

 

It beats the hell out of any other form of heating, keeping the whole boat warm and dry from stem to stern; it fires up at the twist of a dial; it creates no dust; it is civilisation compared to mucky coal or damp twigs on the roof of your boat. Servicing: about £200 every two years; filter £5 every year.

 

It is not cheap to buy (c.£7000). But it is well worth it.

 

Dominic

[Topsy]

I'm considering having a Heritage Uno installed in a holiday boat.To anyone who has one, is the oven at the bottom? It appears that way on their website and I wonder if it's odd/tricky operating at that level? I'm told it's a good size oven but surely you'd have to virtually lie on the floor to get anything to the back of it.

Thank you

 

Rachel

[Markinaboat]

Apologies for revving an old thread but hopefully, will be of interest/help.

 

We've got a compact duette in a boat we bought towards the end of last year. We moved aboard in April and have found the outer shell of the stove gets very hot indeed. The top (not the hob lids) gets so hot within around 45 mins that you can barely touch it. We had it serviced before we moved although finding someone who can be bothered to come to Harefield is nigh on impossible. This must of course contribute to heating up the boat more than it would do if conducting less heat.

 

I've emailed Heritage twice but have not had a reply although they did when we had earlier issues last year.

 

Any views/advice much welcomed before we consider the massive task of getting rid of it!

[larkshall]

You should be able to put your hand on the top, and yes it will be hand warm. But I'd shouldn't be as hot as you are experiencing. I wonder if the insulation was fitted properly. You need a specialist look at it.

[Markinaboat]

Thanks - I'm fairly sure it didn't get this hot earlier on in the year. Can't find a specialist that will come to Harefield although a guy did come to quote us for some work after nagging him for 2/3 months but after three weeks, no quote and can't get hold of.

[Terrierious]

Call Heritage directly, their service engineers are so helpful. I am moored in Iver and they happily come from Cornwall to service mine. The top lids do get hot, although this does depend on the oven temp. Maybe ask them to check the thermostat in the oven as this would keep the burners running if it was faulty.

[Markinaboat]

We did have it serviced but needed some work doing on the circulating pump wiring so will just get a heating engineer to sort this.

 

As mentioned, the lids are not the problem. It's the area around the lids (top surface) that becomes too hot to touch. I can't see why the insulating material underneath would have moved but will remove the hob plates to check as advised.

[larkshall]

I don't know what type of insulation is fitted,, I am wondering if it's broken down in part, or the seals between the hot plates, and the cooker top. Either way it needs a proper service, and maybe a top end rebuild

[Markinaboat]

The oven and heating/hot water works perfectly. Fully serviced maybe 25 'oven hours' ago. Thermostat/s working perfectly. The top surface (not the hob lids) getting very hot is the only problem. As mentioned, will remove hob plates to check said insulation material which according to the independent Heritage engineer is 'cotton/wool like'.